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April 19 2024 11.17am

Rolf Harris

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View Cucking Funt's Profile Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 04 Jul 14 2.42pm Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

Quote DanH at 04 Jul 2014 2.00pm

Quote Moose at 04 Jul 2014 1.56pm

Quote Cucking Funt at 04 Jul 2014 1.35pm

Quote Moose at 04 Jul 2014 1.23pm

5 years 9 months. Poor.


At age 84, it's a bit of a whopper.


I haven't heard those words since you last whispered them into my ear.


Hahahaha.


It's no laughing matter.

 


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View Superfly's Profile Superfly Flag The sun always shines in Catford 04 Jul 14 2.43pm Send a Private Message to Superfly Add Superfly as a friend

It's a typo, Cucking.

He vomited up his pasta.

 


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View The Chaser1's Profile The Chaser1 Flag 04 Jul 14 3.15pm Send a Private Message to The Chaser1 Add The Chaser1 as a friend

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To be wronged is nothing unless you continue to remember it.

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View Part Time James's Profile Part Time James Flag 04 Jul 14 3.57pm Send a Private Message to Part Time James Add Part Time James as a friend

Quote npn at 04 Jul 2014 11.16am

Quote Mapletree at 04 Jul 2014 10.54am

Wow, this has gone so off-track.

In both the Savile and the Harris case this was learned behaviour. They fancied a fiddle, found they could get away with it so did it some more. In the end it probably became a fixation.

It's not like being gay, certainly Harris was not exclusively into paedophilia, it was just something he wanted to do. Not something he 'had' to do. It would have done him no harm if he had never got into it. Unlike being gay where bottling it up is virtually impossible.

If these behaviours had been prevented at the outset nobody would have had a problem, including the individuals concerned.

They were simply nasty, selfish people attacking others in an incredibly damaging way. Don't liken them to gays, liken them to serial killers. They get their jollies from harming others, OK that happens to be sexual jollies. They had a choice. As such they were classic criminals.

The debate about whether you can 'cure' a criminal is quite another issue.


It's difficult because it's such an emotive issue when kids are involved.

Homosexual behaviour was, until comparatively recently, illegal in the UK. In many countries it still is. That doesn't stop gay people in those countries from having the same sexual urges, it just stops them acting on them and staying within the law.

I don't think you can necessarily stop someone with paedo tendencies from fancying kids (sick as most of us find it) but there is a HUGE difference between thinking 'phwoar' and doing something about it.

I think that's a valid point which is what I'm deriving from Stirling's posts (and could be a complete misunderstanding of course).

Let's not forget that we consider ourselves enlightened these days because we see gay people and say 'meh, whatever', whereas only recently the vast majority of the public would've seen them in a similar light to the way we see paedos now. Also that many old civilisations did not see kiddy fiddlers as particularly abhorrent - times and society change. What my ancestors saw as disgusting will not match what I see as disgusting, and vice versa.

When someone pulls a 14 year old (with consent) we all shout "sick pervert" but there are countries we'd see as enlightened who would not even see it as illegal.

Back on track, howeever, I'm hugely disappointed. I don't know enough to know whether he's guily or not, but either way there are only two possibilities, both of which I find unpalletable:
1. he's not guilty and an innocent man is going to jail
2. he's guilty as sin, and a bloke I always thought fondly of is a predatory nonce


I originally said "This is spot on IMHO" prior to the edit, although, as I think about it, there's a factor regarding consent and ability to assert lack of consent if you are under-age....but I totally get what you are saying.

Edited by Part Time James (04 Jul 2014 3.59pm)

 




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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 04 Jul 14 4.20pm Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Quote Superfly at 04 Jul 2014 2.43pm

It's a typo, Cucking.

He vomited up his pasta.


It was in the West County, vomited up his pastie

 

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 05 Jul 14 11.32am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Edwina Currie wrote this in her diary back in the 80's..

"'One appointment in the recent reshuffle has attracted a lot of gossip and could be very dangerous: Peter Morrison has become the PM’s PPS[Parliamentary Private Secretary].

"'Now he’s what they call a 'noted pederast', with a liking for young boys.


He admitted as much to Norman Tebbit when he became deputy chairman of the party but added 'However, I’m very discreet' - and he must be! She [Thatcher] either knows and is taking a chance, or doesn’t; either way, it’s a really dumb move.

"'[Conservative MP] Teresa Gorman told me this evening (in a taxi coming back from a drinks party at the BBC) that she inherited Morrison's (woman) agent, who claimed to have been offered money to keep quiet about his activities "

 


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View The White Horse's Profile The White Horse Flag 05 Jul 14 12.35pm Send a Private Message to The White Horse Add The White Horse as a friend

Quote DanH at 04 Jul 2014 2.00pm

Quote Moose at 04 Jul 2014 1.56pm

Quote Cucking Funt at 04 Jul 2014 1.35pm

Quote Moose at 04 Jul 2014 1.23pm

5 years 9 months. Poor.


At age 84, it's a bit of a whopper.


I haven't heard those words since you last whispered them into my ear.


Hahahaha.

That joke made me proud to be British.

 


"The fox has his den. The bee has his hive. The stoat, has, uh... his stoat-hole... but only man chooses to make his nest in an investment opportunity.” Stewart Lee

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 05 Jul 14 3.05pm

Quote The Chaser1 at 04 Jul 2014 1.36pm

He is a lucky nonce it should've been 10 or more years.

He's lucky that they were historic offences, as the judge points out in summing up, and so subject to sentences related to when the offences were carried out.

The sentence has been referred to the Attorney General to assess it suitability - so like Hall he could face a longer sentence, but that could not be issued by the Judge directly.


 


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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 05 Jul 14 3.09pm

Quote Kermit8 at 05 Jul 2014 11.32am

Edwina Currie wrote this in her diary back in the 80's..

"'One appointment in the recent reshuffle has attracted a lot of gossip and could be very dangerous: Peter Morrison has become the PM’s PPS[Parliamentary Private Secretary].

"'Now he’s what they call a 'noted pederast', with a liking for young boys.


He admitted as much to Norman Tebbit when he became deputy chairman of the party but added 'However, I’m very discreet' - and he must be! She [Thatcher] either knows and is taking a chance, or doesn’t; either way, it’s a really dumb move.

"'[Conservative MP] Teresa Gorman told me this evening (in a taxi coming back from a drinks party at the BBC) that she inherited Morrison's (woman) agent, who claimed to have been offered money to keep quiet about his activities "

Ron Richards (a tory MP now UK) also alleged him and several other senior or ranking politicals were involved in the North Wales child sex offences scandal, before politics Richards was also SIS desk officer (and had former special forces experience).


 


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View Moose's Profile Moose Flag In the sewer pipe... 05 Jul 14 3.34pm Send a Private Message to Moose Add Moose as a friend

Quote jamiemartin721 at 05 Jul 2014 3.05pm

Quote The Chaser1 at 04 Jul 2014 1.36pm

He is a lucky nonce it should've been 10 or more years.

He's lucky that they were historic offences, as the judge points out in summing up, and so subject to sentences related to when the offences were carried out.

The sentence has been referred to the Attorney General to assess it suitability - so like Hall he could face a longer sentence, but that could not be issued by the Judge directly.


Was it not the judge who decided to run some of the sentences concurrently? The total of all the sentences was 11 years which I'd have said was far more appropriate.


Edited by Moose (05 Jul 2014 3.35pm)

 


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View Farawayeagle's Profile Farawayeagle Flag Sydney 06 Jul 14 2.12am Send a Private Message to Farawayeagle Add Farawayeagle as a friend

Quote Moose at 05 Jul 2014 3.34pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 05 Jul 2014 3.05pm

Quote The Chaser1 at 04 Jul 2014 1.36pm

He is a lucky nonce it should've been 10 or more years.

He's lucky that they were historic offences, as the judge points out in summing up, and so subject to sentences related to when the offences were carried out.

The sentence has been referred to the Attorney General to assess it suitability - so like Hall he could face a longer sentence, but that could not be issued by the Judge directly.


Was it not the judge who decided to run some of the sentences concurrently? The total of all the sentences was 11 years which I'd have said was far more appropriate.


Edited by Moose (05 Jul 2014 3.35pm)

With due respect Moose.
I don't understand this desire to double the cost to the taxpayer. As I alluded to before official cost for keeping a prisoner in a low security jail is estimated at 20,000 to 25,000 pounds. So 11 years would be hitting a quarter of a million. I can think of more worthy ways in society to spend tax money. He's going to jail for probably 3 years -- he is a social and professional pariah and he most probably will get hit with a class action for damages. How vindictive does a society need to be to extract what appears from some comments to be an odd reflected revenge on behalf of the victims.

i come at this from the point of view of someone who was sexually assaulted a couple of times when I was 10 years old. (52 years ago) I didn't want revenge. In the end I wanted the guy to get help and I warned friends not to end up alone with him. I also spoke to a policeman about him. In those days seemed the right way to do it. The police in my town were still the friendly cop on the beat. I am confidant the police kept a watchful eye on him. He never came near me again. He died early in life I was told.

Even now, if he were alive, I wouldn't want him locked away forever, or to die in jail as some have been suggesting about Harris on the twitter sphere. And unlike Rolf Harris my molester had not contributed positively in other ways to society. He was just a sad troubled human being.

I have difficulty relating to the victims who say their life was ruined by such an encounter. I think it is more about the victim's character -- whether they can cope with it. That is not to point blame at these particular victims. I don't know them. I am talking in general.

What happened to me was worse than a few of the counts described in the Harris case but I went on to be a successful person in my life with two great kids and in fact I have often been the person others confide in and seek advice from with their life troubles. So it doesn't necessarily destroy your life.


I don't know if Harris is guilty or not. The events are so long ago -- so it is very much a he said, she said. The jury believed the "She saids". So that is the verdict. If something good is to come out of this then it should be learning positive lessons for the future.

I think victims should go to the police immediately. (Just my opinion) Not decades later.
I'm sure my molester's activity was curtailed after I spoke to the police because I'm absolutely sure they had a word in his shell like.

If Harris's activities with minors are to be believed then could some of the parents have acted quicker. It took 15 years for the parent who received the letter to give it to the police.

We now have a stack of women putting their hand up to say he touched them as adults and there is talk of class action suits to get money from his estate. The report is that he was known in the entertainment industry as a groper of attractive women. But it seems all people did was avoid him or just describe him to their colleagues as an octopus.

I know it might have been difficult in those days to get the powers that be to do something as a blind eye was often turned to what has been described as "flirtatious, touchy feely behaviour." But somebody could have tried.

Any way just some thoughts to consider.

 


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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 06 Jul 14 9.57am

Quote Moose at 05 Jul 2014 3.34pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 05 Jul 2014 3.05pm

Quote The Chaser1 at 04 Jul 2014 1.36pm

He is a lucky nonce it should've been 10 or more years.

He's lucky that they were historic offences, as the judge points out in summing up, and so subject to sentences related to when the offences were carried out.

The sentence has been referred to the Attorney General to assess it suitability - so like Hall he could face a longer sentence, but that could not be issued by the Judge directly.


Was it not the judge who decided to run some of the sentences concurrently? The total of all the sentences was 11 years which I'd have said was far more appropriate.


Edited by Moose (05 Jul 2014 3.35pm)

Indeed, but the sentence has to be proportionate to those dealt out to others who've committed similar crimes of a roughly similar nature. You can't just decide to hand down 11 years, because you can. You have to present a rational basis for that (otherwise you'll have a successful appeal).

Its the power of the Attorney General to decide whether the sentence was too lenient or too severe.

Reading the judges summary there are indicators as to why the sentence wasn't the maximum possible 11 years.


Edited by jamiemartin721 (06 Jul 2014 9.58am)

 


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