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Housing in London

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View serial thriller's Profile serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 24 Nov 14 4.56pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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View Stuk's Profile Stuk Flag Top half 24 Nov 14 5.06pm Send a Private Message to Stuk Add Stuk as a friend

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.

 


Optimistic as ever

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Pussay Patrol Flag 24 Nov 14 5.20pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.51pm

Quote johnfirewall at 23 Nov 2014 8.43pm

Well the E15 mums are doing more than just shouting and making tits of themselves. Hats off to them. Most council's housing plans are cynical. A lot of estates were knocked down with people shipped out to the sticks.

There are probably in the region of 50,000 homes under construction in London right now with an obligatory portion in the inner city areas being allocated to social housing.

How many can we realistically build? It's ironic the old estates have been flattened and modern developments are now high rises with a concierge service. Evidence of the way people are being priced out of London. There was a woman being attacked on Question Time for being expressing her concerns over this. It was put to her that no one has a right to live in London. I would have gone mad. If she earns a living she has every right.

You've got recent arrivals crammed in to dormitory style accommodation (or sheds) by unscrupulous landlords. Private landlords are doing pretty well out of the above sort of arrangement, plus legitimate benefit cases. Councils are even advertising for more landlords round here. Then you've got normal working people paying through the nose for a box room.

I guess it's a product of the recession that people want to live in London. Not just from abroad but other parts of the UK as well. I reckon more students have stayed here after graduating from London universities than Poles.


I broadly agree with a lot of what you say mate. Just a couple of points I'd pick up on.

I don't think building houses is necessarily the solution, because all you are doing is temporarily satisfying what looks to be an insatiable demand to live in London, both nationally and globally. That's all tied in with the fact that 80% of jobs under the coalition have been created in London, while the key elements of our economy, the financial and service sectors, are based in the Capital. Housing has actually now become a third prong to which financial sectors are propping up our faltering economy, and the relatively stable inflation of house prices means invested capital in housing in Central London is a big money-spinner, hence why we are seeing, as in the video I posted, foreign investment schemes buying up large estates and tripling rent.

But other than widescale devolution of power from London, what else is there to do? Because the institutions people like the E15 mums and the New Era estate are facing are unaccountable they have no obligation not to maximise profit to the detriment of long-standing social groups. So really there are only two routes I can see: you can have government intervention, which looks pretty unlikely, albeit Labour are claiming they will intervene to help first-time buyers if they win in 2015 which is a very small step in the right direction. Alternatively you need grassroots social action like these two examples to bring these organisations in to the lense of public scrutiny. They have done that, and in the case of the E15 mums, they've won.

Just one other point, given that this thread has been slightly de-railed by arguments about the Greens, one thing I do think could help devolution from London would be the £10 obligatory minimum wage they are proposing. Given that in London by 2020, if inflation continues on its trends, £10 will probably be below the London Living Wage (it's about £9.15 now). But outside London it will still be significantly more than the Living wage, therefore standards of living will be higher. All hypothetical, but a thought.


You're right on the minimum wage, I think this would also solve the immigration problem long term. Indigenous people would be more willing to do the basic jobs if it brought in a decent wage. Plus we'd pay out less tax credits. It might hurt small businesses but you could give them tax relief in other areas to soften the blow.

 


Paua oouaarancì Irà chiyeah Ishé galé ma ba oo ah

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View serial thriller's Profile serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 24 Nov 14 5.22pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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Pussay Patrol Flag 24 Nov 14 5.37pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.

Whats ludicrous is ordinary people who struggle to make ends meet having to pay £100 - £200 a year on Green taxes for wind farms and other fancifull pet projects.

It all gets lost in a big EU bottomless pit to meet CO2 quotas anyway. All the while People in the US go around in their Gas guzzlers, Las Vegas is lit up like a christmas tree and China churn out so much smog you can barely see a few metres ahead

 


Paua oouaarancì Irà chiyeah Ishé galé ma ba oo ah

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View serial thriller's Profile serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 24 Nov 14 5.55pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Quote Pussay Patrol at 24 Nov 2014 5.37pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.

Whats ludicrous is ordinary people who struggle to make ends meet having to pay £100 - £200 a year on Green taxes for wind farms and other fancifull pet projects.

It all gets lost in a big EU bottomless pit to meet CO2 quotas anyway. All the while People in the US go around in their Gas guzzlers, Las Vegas is lit up like a christmas tree and China churn out so much smog you can barely see a few metres ahead


Climate Change is the biggest single issue our species faces, if temperature globally increases by the 4 degrees even conservative estimations reckon is likely by 2100 you can expect to see crop yields fall, major climactic change and many major cities submerged in water. This will invariably also lead to large population shift, meaning most probably an even greater need for migratory flow in to places like Britain, America etc. areas with the capital required to resist it.

It's obviously very in vogue at the moment to slag off the EU, but I think their leading stance on green issues, while far from perfect, is something to take pride in, as if we all bury our heads in the sand the economic and social permutations of major climactic change will be devastating. They are setting at least some kind of example, which is encouraging, even though as I say I think they'd be better investing in alternative energy sources than taxing energy companies.

But all of this this does leave me wondering what the f*ck it has to do with housing in London?

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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View Stuk's Profile Stuk Flag Top half 24 Nov 14 11.07pm Send a Private Message to Stuk Add Stuk as a friend

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.


Ludicrous exaggeration is akin to accentuating your point on the hol, nothing more.

Nothing will ever bring energy prices down. No matter who, when or why. All you can do is go as off grid or consumption light as possible.

 


Optimistic as ever

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 25 Nov 14 10.10am

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 11.07pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.


Ludicrous exaggeration is akin to accentuating your point on the hol, nothing more.

Nothing will ever bring energy prices down. No matter who, when or why. All you can do is go as off grid or consumption light as possible.

Well you could nationalize the industry and then utilize taxation revenue to subsidise the cost of utilities, recouping through taxation. Whilst it wouldn't actually reduce the cost over all (because ultimately you'd pay out in taxation) it would ensure the provision of an essential utility to all citizens.

Obviously, you could set a tariff by which over x amount of usage is charged to the individual at a certain rate.

Or through monopolization by the state you could recoup the cost through provision to private enterprise (who'd pass the cost onto the consumer) in terms of luxury products.

Whilst neither option makes energy prices any cheaper, they do secure them and make them more affordable / available to all.

In theory as well it should enable the state to wield more power in terms of price paid for power.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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View jcreedy's Profile jcreedy Flag 25 Nov 14 11.11am Send a Private Message to jcreedy Add jcreedy as a friend

Unless people get help from parents, buying houses in London is now just for the wealthy, and ridiculous stamp duty thresholds makes it even harder.

 


It was my dream to play for Palace and to make my debut. I've always played for the club so if I'm playing here, I wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

- John Bostock (Nov 2007)

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 25 Nov 14 12.07pm

Quote jcreedy at 25 Nov 2014 11.11am

Unless people get help from parents, buying houses in London is now just for the wealthy, and ridiculous stamp duty thresholds makes it even harder.

Pretty much, although not limited to the wealthy, just the high earners. I'd have thought you'd need to be looking at either a substantial deposit, or a salary in excess of 40k to get onto the property ladder in any kind of realistic way.


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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View Stuk's Profile Stuk Flag Top half 25 Nov 14 12.33pm Send a Private Message to Stuk Add Stuk as a friend

Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Nov 2014 10.10am

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 11.07pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.


Ludicrous exaggeration is akin to accentuating your point on the hol, nothing more.

Nothing will ever bring energy prices down. No matter who, when or why. All you can do is go as off grid or consumption light as possible.

Well you could nationalize the industry and then utilize taxation revenue to subsidise the cost of utilities, recouping through taxation. Whilst it wouldn't actually reduce the cost over all (because ultimately you'd pay out in taxation) it would ensure the provision of an essential utility to all citizens.

Obviously, you could set a tariff by which over x amount of usage is charged to the individual at a certain rate.

Or through monopolization by the state you could recoup the cost through provision to private enterprise (who'd pass the cost onto the consumer) in terms of luxury products.

Whilst neither option makes energy prices any cheaper, they do secure them and make them more affordable / available to all.

In theory as well it should enable the state to wield more power in terms of price paid for power.


None of that will happen.

As I said, the only way you'll ever reduce your energy bills is to use less or generate your own.

 


Optimistic as ever

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Pussay Patrol Flag 25 Nov 14 1.24pm

Quote Stuk at 25 Nov 2014 12.33pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Nov 2014 10.10am

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 11.07pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 5.22pm

Quote Stuk at 24 Nov 2014 5.06pm

Quote serial thriller at 24 Nov 2014 4.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 23 Nov 2014 7.40pm

It's the Greens whose agenda is responsible for energy prices being more expensive than it needs to be.

It's the Greens, not the Tories who are really the implicit killers who finish off grannies and oldies too worried to put their heating on this winter.

All so we can look good while China open another forty coal factories next year.


If I hadn't already written one unnecessarily long post I would write another one explaining how wrong you are. The Greens kill grannies? FFS.

What he is eluding to, is the push for green taxes and levies (not to mention the part of the bill that pays for people who don't pay their own bills) mean that the overall unit cost becomes far more than it should be at wholesale cost + distribution + profit.

Over 10% and then 5% VAT too.


I get that, but it's a ludicrous exaggeration to make and considering the Greens advocate more funding in to renewable energy resources, which if implemented would actually bring energy prices down, I think it's a bit disingenuous.


Ludicrous exaggeration is akin to accentuating your point on the hol, nothing more.

Nothing will ever bring energy prices down. No matter who, when or why. All you can do is go as off grid or consumption light as possible.

Well you could nationalize the industry and then utilize taxation revenue to subsidise the cost of utilities, recouping through taxation. Whilst it wouldn't actually reduce the cost over all (because ultimately you'd pay out in taxation) it would ensure the provision of an essential utility to all citizens.

Obviously, you could set a tariff by which over x amount of usage is charged to the individual at a certain rate.

Or through monopolization by the state you could recoup the cost through provision to private enterprise (who'd pass the cost onto the consumer) in terms of luxury products.

Whilst neither option makes energy prices any cheaper, they do secure them and make them more affordable / available to all.

In theory as well it should enable the state to wield more power in terms of price paid for power.


None of that will happen.

As I said, the only way you'll ever reduce your energy bills is to use less or generate your own.


Not neccesarily. Don't energy companies charge you a high rate for the first amount you use then the rate goes down above that rate? So any reduction in use is barely noticable overall? Unless you're a very excessive user and can make significant reductions

 


Paua oouaarancì Irà chiyeah Ishé galé ma ba oo ah

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