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March 29 2024 7.01am

Managers

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View sydtheeagle's Profile sydtheeagle Flag England 27 Jan 16 9.10am Send a Private Message to sydtheeagle Add sydtheeagle as a friend

As we all know, this has been the closest-run and most surprising Premier Leagues in many years (if not ever.) Lots of reasons are given for this, mainly related to the distribution of money, but it seems to me that an often over-looked reason is that there are more quality managers in the League than ever before, and many of them are not big names. To wit:

Bilic: I didn't think he was a good hire but he's done a superb job.
Pocchetino: To think as recently as September, some Tottenham fans wanted him out. Has now built good sides in his last two jobs.
Ranieri: I thought he was a good hire at the time and nothing has changed that. Knows what he's doing.
Pardew: Our recent blip notwithstanding, very much up to the job.
Koeman: Under-rated. Excellent last year and now turning things around again.
Hughes: What happened at QPR suggests the problem wasn't Hughes. A fine job at Stoke.
Neil: Norwich are not in the relegation zone and are punching above their weight.
Howe: Ditto, see above.

Meanwhile, the "big" names:

Pellegrino: Not bad, but underachieves given the team he has.
Van Gaal: Massively underachieving despite vast expenditure.
Pulis: Does what it says on the tin but no better than lower mid-table as always.
Allardyce: Now struggling to turn Sunderland around.
Martinez: Most over-rated manager in the history of the game.
McLaren: Newcastle's league position and defensive performance says it all.
Rodgers: Fired (Klopp jury still out.)
Mourinho: Fired (and Hiddink hasn't yet set the world on fire)

My point is, there's been a Changing of the Guard this season. The tried and tested "name" managers seem to have run out of ideas while a new generation of bosses is emerging to outwit them. What will be interesting in the summer is that Man City, Man Utd, and Chelsea at least will all be looking to hire someone new. Will they go down the same old route or recognise this shift, and bring in one of the emerging bosses. If I were them, I wouldn't be quite so obsessed with Guardiola. Frankly, anyone from the first list above would be just as good a bet.

The corollary to this point is that I think we might see a change in philosophy at the top. I may be wrong, but I think owners are going to tire of ploughing money in to buy success (with the possible exception of Man. City, but that's the Arab mentality for you.) It's a pyrrhic victory. With the possible exception of Spurs, all of the emergent teams have been developed with shrewd signings and good scouting, not wads of cash. I wonder if Abramovich and the Glazers aren't starting to ask "if we're signing all these fantastic youth players, why am I not getting a return for my money? Is it right that six months after breaking through, Ruben Loftus-Cheek wants to leave because he can't get a game?"

My guess is that at least one of the top teams will change direction in the summer, hire a manager from the first list above, and begin to take a different approach in the transfer market. Yes, big teams will always make one or two big signings but money alone may have had its day as a means to success. I also think with so many American owners they will learn that parity is a plus, not a negative, and that a more competitive league is good for all.

 


Sydenham by birth. Selhurst by the Grace of God.

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Hoof Hearted 27 Jan 16 10.33am

Interesting points Syd.... I agree in the main.

But... much as I hate Allardarse and Pulis - they are not really big names in the sense of some of the others on that list.... they are more "fire fighters" than big names. Both will probably do "as it says on the tin" and keep their clubs from relegation again, although Fat Sam has the harder task. McClaren and Rodgers are well known to most of us as bottlers rather than big names, both spend big but ultimately fail.

I would not put Hughes or Ranieri in the first category - both have had a crack at the big time before.... I expected both of them to produce mid table sides, but they are definitely punching above their weight right now especially Ranieri.

The rest of the "not big names" are doing very well I agree on limited budgets compared to the big boys.

I like the way this season has panned out!

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 28 Jan 16 2.45pm

Its a testament to how bad Sunderland actually were that they've improved under Allerdyce. I think now they have a chance of avoiding relegation, rather than being a certain companion to Villa.

I also suspect by the end of the season, the top four will look familiar, only Chelsea being excluded - And I suspect Liverpool will have crept into 4th place (Chelsea maybe now are going through a 'Liverpool phase').

Man City
Arsenal
Man Utd
Liverpool (maybe spurs).

Though I do really hope that Leicester City manage to finish top four.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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View Y Ddraig Goch's Profile Y Ddraig Goch Flag In The Crowd 28 Jan 16 3.01pm Send a Private Message to Y Ddraig Goch Add Y Ddraig Goch as a friend

Intersrtingky there are rumours circulating that Hughes is being eyed by Chelsea.

If true, he needs to be careful, jumped ship at Fulham when he could / should have stayed another season and he now seems to have found a home.

 


the dignified don't even enter in the game

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View sydtheeagle's Profile sydtheeagle Flag England 29 Jan 16 9.41am Send a Private Message to sydtheeagle Add sydtheeagle as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Its a testament to how bad Sunderland actually were that they've improved under Allerdyce. I think now they have a chance of avoiding relegation, rather than being a certain companion to Villa.

I also suspect by the end of the season, the top four will look familiar, only Chelsea being excluded - And I suspect Liverpool will have crept into 4th place (Chelsea maybe now are going through a 'Liverpool phase').

Man City
Arsenal
Man Utd
Liverpool (maybe spurs).

Though I do really hope that Leicester City manage to finish top four.

Jamie -- you think Man Utd and Liverpool will finish ahead of Spurs? Wow. In my view, Spurs will finish third and may even make a run at the title. I'd go:

Man City
Arsenal
Spurs
Leicester

Yes. I think Leicester will hang on for fourth. If they were going to fall away, I think it would have happened by now. Liverpool and Man Utd have neither the consistency, the confidence nor the players to make the top 4.

 


Sydenham by birth. Selhurst by the Grace of God.

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 29 Jan 16 11.24am Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by sydtheeagle

Jamie -- you think Man Utd and Liverpool will finish ahead of Spurs? Wow. In my view, Spurs will finish third and may even make a run at the title. I'd go:

Man City
Arsenal
Spurs
Leicester

Yes. I think Leicester will hang on for fourth. If they were going to fall away, I think it would have happened by now. Liverpool and Man Utd have neither the consistency, the confidence nor the players to make the top 4.

Agree with that - Spurs look the real deal this season. Pochettino very impressive, wouldn't be surprised if some of the bigger clubs were having a look at him.

Think City will eventually kick on and prove their quality - it's funny everyone talks about Arsenal's injury problems this season, but City have probably had it worst than anyone - Kompany, Aguero, Silva and now De Bruyne have all missed huge chunks of the season - I don't think City have been able to play a full strength side in any game this year.

 

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View gambler's Profile gambler Flag Kent 31 Jan 16 11.21pm Send a Private Message to gambler Add gambler as a friend

Agree with OP re Martinez.

Big team with some great players but managed by a championship standard manager. Paul Merson lost it about on him on soccer saturday and was absolutely right for a change.

 

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View crvenaeagle's Profile crvenaeagle Flag 02 Feb 16 10.55am Send a Private Message to crvenaeagle Add crvenaeagle as a friend

Well there's your answer for one of the teams syd!

 

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View ray.pick's Profile ray.pick Flag gt yarmouth born sydenham lond... 29 Feb 16 12.36pm Send a Private Message to ray.pick Add ray.pick as a friend

this reminds me of newcastle last year no strikers losing games that shouldt be lost,. 32 points isnt safe,. adebiyour isnt good enough thats why he is going from club to club i wrote asking pardew when we were going to buy a proper striker all he said was conner wickham is a work in process,.its a bosses job to allow for injuries suspentions etc yet our back up seems so poor and it shows the diferance when you get bolasie back we beat spurs as white hart lane, but at west brom it was the old palace asleep for nearly half a game im begining to see the players are only interested in games they want to play and win need a kick up the backside with an attitude like that im very dispondant when you think we (the fans) are still here when the players have moved on,.i can see us back in the championship next season a week ago we were 50 to 1 to be relegated now we are 20 to 1 that says it are,.and yes ive lost faith in mr pardew as he obviously thinks he can get to safty without goal scorers mr parish isnt any better for not making pardew buy someone who is a regular scorer,no we buy players that score one every three games which isnt good enough to stay in the top tier,.yours gutted watching this every week ray

 


Ray Pickering,.any frends still alive and kicking should contact me,born sydenham se.26 1949 yards from sydenham hill estate,.

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 29 Feb 16 12.50pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow


Pochettino very impressive,

I recall there was an outcry when Nicola Cortese replaced Adkins with Pochettino. Adkins had done well getting Southampton promoted and in fact he was chopped with the team in 15th place in the PL with 22 pts after 22 games and with a game in hand with those below them.They appointed an unknown quantity who had been sacked by Espanyol who were bottom of the league.Seemed non-sensical at the time !

Edited by Willo (29 Feb 2016 12.56pm)

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 29 Feb 16 1.51pm

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

Interesting points Syd.... I agree in the main.

But... much as I hate Allardarse and Pulis - they are not really big names in the sense of some of the others on that list.... they are more "fire fighters" than big names. Both will probably do "as it says on the tin" and keep their clubs from relegation again, although Fat Sam has the harder task. McClaren and Rodgers are well known to most of us as bottlers rather than big names, both spend big but ultimately fail.

I would not put Hughes or Ranieri in the first category - both have had a crack at the big time before.... I expected both of them to produce mid table sides, but they are definitely punching above their weight right now especially Ranieri.

The rest of the "not big names" are doing very well I agree on limited budgets compared to the big boys.

I like the way this season has panned out!

Largely how I see it. Allerdyce is a very good at what he does, fixing problems and getting a team out of trouble, but you can only do so much if you're not actually a player.

Ultimately, Managers probably account for a small amount of a teams results and form, according to Soccernomics, the best managers really represent around 10% or so of the result. Where as I think fans seem to think they are entirely responsible for whether the team wins, draws or loses.

End of the day, you have to do what you can with what you have, and who will sign for you. This is interestingly the first season in a long time, where economic power isn't defining the top four (its an influence).

One of the things I was thinking recently, is how Martin O'Neils stock went down after Aston Villa failed to achieve under him. Of course the reality is that Aston Villa under O'Neil were overachieving, which has become rapidly apparent.

Often its the manager who gets the flack, but in the modern age of football, there are far more people involved in determining squads, signings, who plays etc than just one man.

But I really want Leicester City to win the league this season, and become the sixth team to do so.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 29 Feb 16 2.21pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Often its the manager who gets the flack,

At 'Notts Co' it is the owner Ray Trew who has been getting the flak and for this reason he has recently announced that he has stood down as Chairman and has put the club up for sale.

I think Fullarton is his 9th permanent manager since he took over the reins in Feb 2010.

 

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