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Laurence Fox on QT

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 17 Jan 20 7.35pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

I thought I'd raise the Laurence Fox/identity politics issue that's been in the news.

[Link]

I wouldn't even call Fox a conservative. He's just not far left like most in the entertainment industry and instead is a rational fair minded individual who tries to be sensible....essentially a decent normie who thinks that MLK's 'I have a dream' speech is actually achievable....decent, if misguided, in my view.

However on Question Time, upon commenting on the Harry & Markie situation he ended up responding to the characterisation of her treatment as racist by an audience member....see starting link.

Now this wasn't a question and accusation put by a random off the street who picked up a ticket. No, this accusation came from Rachel Boyle, an academic at Edge Hill University on Merseyside. A far left academic who's a university lecturer on 'Race & Ethnicity' that the BBC has used previously for political commentary in reviewing newspapers.

Here is the rub:

This situation summed up for me the changing 'identity politics' dynamic that is occurring in society that many decent people are still in denial over.

Identity politics is an industry.

A whole sector of jobs in society are now dedicated to looking for and complaining about racism. It is a self fulfilling prophecy. They find no 'racism', then they have no job.....Their job is highlighting identity politics and pushing anti white concepts for a living....It's a created industry along with affirmative action and other quota systems and it's not going away.

An idiots' charter or an 'anti white' deliberate policy?...I think both but does that matter? It's here and it's the new reality and it's not going away but it's going to expand with the changing demographic.

Mr Fox and friends are going to lose unless they wake up and realise that 'playing nice and fair' means they lose and pass on a poisoned chalice of white flight or second class status to their children.

If you don't play identity politics in an arena where your opponents do ....Well then you are going to lose as the demographics shift....people don't give up successful tactics.

'Identity politics for thee but not for me'......it's playing a football match with ten men.


Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2020 7.46pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 17 Jan 20 8.05pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I thought I'd raise the Laurence Fox/identity politics issue that's been in the news.

[Link]

I wouldn't even call Fox a conservative. He's just not far left like most in the entertainment industry and instead is a rational fair minded individual who tries to be sensible....essentially a decent normie who thinks that MLK's 'I have a dream' speech is actually achievable....decent, if misguided, in my view.

However on Question Time, upon commenting on the Harry & Markie situation he ended up responding to the characterisation of her treatment as racist by an audience member....see starting link.

Now this wasn't a question and accusation put by a random off the street who picked up a ticket. No, this accusation came from Rachel Boyle, an academic at Edge Hill University on Merseyside. A far left academic who's a university lecturer on 'Race & Ethnicity' that the BBC has used previously for political commentary in reviewing newspapers.

Here is the rub:

This situation summed up for me the changing 'identity politics' dynamic that is occurring in society that many decent people are still in denial over.

Identity politics is an industry.

A whole sector of jobs in society are now dedicated to looking for and complaining about racism. It is a self fulfilling prophecy. They find no 'racism', then they have no job.....Their job is highlighting identity politics and pushing anti white concepts for a living....It's a created industry along with affirmative action and other quota systems and it's not going away.

An idiots' charter or an 'anti white' deliberate policy?...I think both but does that matter? It's here and it's the new reality and it's not going away but it's going to expand with the changing demographic.

Mr Fox and friends are going to lose unless they wake up and realise that 'playing nice and fair' means they lose and pass on a poisoned chalice of white flight or second class status to their children.

If you don't play identity politics in an arena where your opponents do ....Well then you are going to lose as the demographics shift....people don't give up successful tactics.

'Identity politics for thee but not for me'......it's playing a football match with ten men.


Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2020 7.46pm)

Racism doesn't apply to White people. Who'd have guessed?

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 17 Jan 20 8.12pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

He does have a point.
Are there no ethnic rich and powerful people.
One runs london ffs.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 17 Jan 20 8.15pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Racism doesn't apply to White people. Who'd have guessed?

Like white lefty hero Stormzy said, 'I'm not anti white, I'm just pro black'.

They love that stuff.....but try saying the reverse.

Buckle up and strap in...the 'whitey bad' messaging is just going to increase and increase.

People who try to create utopias create dystopias.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 17 Jan 20 8.19pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

He does have a point.
Are there no ethnic rich and powerful people.
One runs london ffs.

It'll be all the major cities long before you bite the dust.

In principle there's nothing wrong with a non white running stuff.....I like that Patel bird in the home office.

But you know the types that will be doing it.


Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2020 8.20pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 17 Jan 20 8.25pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Like white lefty hero Stormzy said, 'I'm not anti white, I'm just pro black'.

They love that stuff.....but try saying the reverse.

Buckle up and strap in...the 'whitey bad' messaging is just going to increase and increase.

People who try to create utopias create dystopias.

Being pro White makes you a White supremacist but being pro Black makes you enlightened.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 17 Jan 20 8.27pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Being pro White makes you a White supremacist but being pro Black makes you enlightened.

I think that's only Michael Jackson.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Cucking Funt's Profile Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 17 Jan 20 10.22pm Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

I thought he was superb

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Online Flag Truro Cornwall 17 Jan 20 11.07pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Racism doesn't apply to White people. Who'd have guessed?

This was covered by a very recent series of comments. Perhaps you missed it! I will help by posting it again.

Racism as defined by the OED:-

"Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized"

Hint. Concentrate on the last line!

So it can affect "white" people, although not typically in countries where they constitute the majority.

 

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View SW19 CPFC's Profile SW19 CPFC Flag Addiscombe West 17 Jan 20 11.28pm Send a Private Message to SW19 CPFC Add SW19 CPFC as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I thought I'd raise the Laurence Fox/identity politics issue that's been in the news.

[Link]

I wouldn't even call Fox a conservative. He's just not far left like most in the entertainment industry and instead is a rational fair minded individual who tries to be sensible....essentially a decent normie who thinks that MLK's 'I have a dream' speech is actually achievable....decent, if misguided, in my view.

However on Question Time, upon commenting on the Harry & Markie situation he ended up responding to the characterisation of her treatment as racist by an audience member....see starting link.

Now this wasn't a question and accusation put by a random off the street who picked up a ticket. No, this accusation came from Rachel Boyle, an academic at Edge Hill University on Merseyside. A far left academic who's a university lecturer on 'Race & Ethnicity' that the BBC has used previously for political commentary in reviewing newspapers.

Here is the rub:

This situation summed up for me the changing 'identity politics' dynamic that is occurring in society that many decent people are still in denial over.

Identity politics is an industry.

A whole sector of jobs in society are now dedicated to looking for and complaining about racism. It is a self fulfilling prophecy. They find no 'racism', then they have no job.....Their job is highlighting identity politics and pushing anti white concepts for a living....It's a created industry along with affirmative action and other quota systems and it's not going away.

An idiots' charter or an 'anti white' deliberate policy?...I think both but does that matter? It's here and it's the new reality and it's not going away but it's going to expand with the changing demographic.

Mr Fox and friends are going to lose unless they wake up and realise that 'playing nice and fair' means they lose and pass on a poisoned chalice of white flight or second class status to their children.

If you don't play identity politics in an arena where your opponents do ....Well then you are going to lose as the demographics shift....people don't give up successful tactics.

'Identity politics for thee but not for me'......it's playing a football match with ten men.


Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2020 7.46pm)

I thought he was good value. Made some good points, especially this one

'Sorry, let me rewind. Any of the women. Is that better? Any woman. Because it's really important what your gender is or what your sexuality is rather than what your policies are'

However all that said I do get why minorities who are discriminated against get annoyed when, people who don't or can't fully understand their point of view talk about or try to lecture others about something they have limited experience of. That actually applies to any subject, really.

It's a tricky one though. Go too far left and you get positive discrimination and identity politics, too far right no incentive to equalise and complete dismissal that there is even an issue in the first place.

I also fail to understand how people can claim to say the main reason 'Arry and Markle were 'driven' out of the country was or wasn't racism. I mean, how do you actually know? At least provide some sort of supporting argument. It's ridiculous. Press intrusion, backstory and her being an outsider with, shock horror, her own life and interests (much like Diana), is more likely to be the case.

Unless someone can point me to some observable facts those are far more likely than racism as a single main contributing factor.

Edited by SW19 CPFC (17 Jan 2020 11.35pm)

Edited by SW19 CPFC (17 Jan 2020 11.38pm)

 


Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Online Flag 17 Jan 20 11.29pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

This was covered by a very recent series of comments. Perhaps you missed it! I will help by posting it again.

Racism as defined by the OED:-

"Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized"

Hint. Concentrate on the last line!

So it can affect "white" people, although not typically in countries where they constitute the majority.

How did that work out in South Africa?

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 18 Jan 20 3.24am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

I thought he was good value. Made some good points, especially this one

A decent chap who tries to square the circle.....He's trying to stand up for 'colour blind' politics his generation were raised in....which turned out to be a ruse and rather foolish.

He's arguing that it can work, if everyone would just be reasonable. Quite naive if honorable - King Canute ordering the tide to stop.

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

'Sorry, let me rewind. Any of the women. Is that better? Any woman. Because it's really important what your gender is or what your sexuality is rather than what your policies are'

That's the argument against 'identity politics'. We know that it's the decent one, but it's from the past and it doesn't work.

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

However all that said I do get why minorities who are discriminated against get annoyed when, people who don't or can't fully understand their point of view talk about or try to lecture others about something they have limited experience of. That actually applies to any subject, really.


It seems to me that when it's advantageous to be considered an individual, people argue for individualism for themselves. When it's advantageous to be considered a collective....

What you're stating asks for an impossible unachievable standard that can never be satisfied. Don't get me wrong, I'm against egalitarianism anyway because of quite a few objections I have however....like you I can see the 'fairness' argument.

Well there is of course a solution....which is what is really being asked for.

Give away your 'spoils' lad.

It isn't going to stop at makeshift stop gaps like the 'diversity industry', affirmative action and quotas.

Because that's what It's all about...power, which always comes down to money. You can be part of the shakedown out of some sense of subjective historical racial guilt but just don't require it of others.....because I don't accept the terms.

It's self harming madness and a betrayal of future generations.

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

It's a tricky one though. Go too far left and you get positive discrimination and identity politics, too far right no incentive to equalise and complete dismissal that there is even an issue in the first place.

I'd say there is a section of the normie right and centralists/egalitarians who genuinely did and still do the 'colour blind' stuff and so as we see with 'Fox'.....and of course there are plenty of sensible non whites who stand for common sense. However, I contend that 'sense' has already lost to demographics.

The Europeans brought into the MLK 'I have a dream' stuff and now the demographics have shifted and like Mohammad..(I'm generalising of course but it's the result all the same)..you play nice when you're weak, but as you become more powerful you don't......Notice that few in the non white community talk about 'I have a dream' anymore? That talk mainly comes from whites who don't realise that this stage has ended and now the activists want to collect.

What you are seeing here is the slow shifting of power.

I'd say that what I've found is that actually both the far left and the far right agree about 'racism'. It's just that they feel differently about it....one being ideological and the other going with controlled tribalism, which is the natural order.

It's the same with class, the fundamentals they both agree on....They just have different solutions.

If you actually want the truth about the politics, the only people who are actually speaking realism are to be found on the far right and left....Maybe I should give a caveat here because you'll still find bats*** crazy stuff there, especially on the left, but that's only because they are more visible due to mainstream institutional and legal acceptance.

The choice really comes with what you think works. I seem to remember you think that it's all heading towards a corporatocracy and in a European/Anglosphere sense we have been building towards that for a century. However, I think long term the power dynamics are not strictly predictable. Some things we can be reasonably sure about and others are mere trends awaiting forks in the road.

Essentially, I think the far left's solutions lead to a far larger pile of bones than the far right's....and that the centralist's path is doomed to the past....With the far left their arguments require the subjugation of human nature to an ideal rather than the flow of natural law.....That will always require more authoritarianism....Both do, but one requires much larger gulags than the other.

But as we are seeing, if you shift the racial demographics you shift the power base. If you shift the power base too much you don't end up with 'equality' you end up with flight and conflict.


Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

I also fail to understand how people can claim to say the main reason 'Arry and Markle were 'driven' out of the country was or wasn't racism. I mean, how do you actually know? At least provide some sort of supporting argument. It's ridiculous. Press intrusion, backstory and her being an outsider with, shock horror, her own life and interests (much like Diana), is more likely to be the case.

Unless someone can point me to some observable facts those are far more likely than racism as a single main contributing factor.

Well, as we know we differ on the whole 'racism' discussion, which I regard as an almost child like argument riven with unrealistic idealism.

However, I'd agree of course, that yours and Fox's take is far nearer the mark. The Royal Family is a form of soft padded gilded open prison which requires its inhabitants to follow the rules.....otherwise the conceit doesn't work.

Markle is just another example of a self entitled tart who wants her cake and eat it too. All the upside and no downside. Diana's genes on poor judgement are certainly working through Harry.

The race thing is a factor but with the right person it would have worked.....because essentially Europe is the least in-group (racist) continent on earth.

Much to its current trajectory of long term decline.


Edited by Stirlingsays (18 Jan 2020 6.30am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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