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View bright&wright's Profile bright&wright Flag 25 Jul 14 8.40am Send a Private Message to bright&wright Add bright&wright as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 24 Jul 2014 11.04pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 10.50pm

Does supporting Hamas firing rockets count as anti semitism?

I don't support any firing onto UN facilities but the situation here is unclear.

Yet the usual suspects are fully in 'minds made up mode' and have their Hamas loving in top gear.

This organisation rejected a cease firs a week ago. They apparently store arms at UN locations.....Apparently fire from them.

Would Hamas engineer this by bringing the fight here for maximum publicity?.....It certainty gets their supporters foaming at the mouth.

What happened here isn't clear.......But I do know the people continuing this fight are Hamas by rejecting an Arab league cease fire.


Hamas disagreed to the terms of a ceasefire unless the blockade is lifted.

Israel say they are targeting places where Hamas are hiding.
From the Grauniad...


They hid at the El-Wafa hospital.

They hid at the Al-Aqsa hospital.

They hid at the beach, where children played football.

They hid at the yard of 75-year-old Muhammad Hamad.

They hid among the residential quarters of Shujaya.

They hid in the neighbourhoods of Zaytoun and Toffah.

They hid in Rafah and Khan Younis.

They hid in the home of the Qassan family.

They hid in the home of the poet, Othman Hussein.

They hid in the village of Khuzaa.

They hid in the thousands of houses damaged or destroyed.

They hid in 84 schools and 23 medical facilities.

They hid in a cafe, where Gazans were watching the World Cup.

They hid in the ambulances trying to retrieve the injured.

They hid themselves in 24 corpses, buried under rubble.

They hid themselves in a young woman in pink household slippers, sprawled on the pavement, taken down while fleeing.

They hid themselves in two brothers, eight and four, lying in the intensive burn care unit in Al-Shifa.

They hid themselves in the little boy whose parts were carried away by his father in a plastic shopping bag.

They hid themselves in the “incomparable chaos of bodies” arriving at Gaza hospitals.

They hid themselves in an elderly woman, lying in a pool of blood on a stone floor.

Hamas, they tell us, is cowardly and cynical.

An Israeli spokesman even had the temerity to tell Jon Snow on channel 4 news that Hamas were deliberately killing their own in order to blame Israel!


Yep. I believe most of the above.

The German's didn't have suicide bombers. The rules of warfare have changed. Hamas can't beat Israel by force so will try and use any tactic possible to beat them.

They know if they sacrifice a few lambs to the slaughter and showcase it to the world it will make the Jew look evil. Whilst still bombing and killing Israeli's of course. That always gets over-looked.

They'll try to win over the f*cking morons who know nothing about Palastine but march up to Downing Street p*ssing and moaning trying to get everyone to intervene.

Funnily enough it's the same n*b heads who moan about the Yanks and us going into Afghanistan and Iraq but cry foul when we don't go into Gaza.

Brilliant.

Pretty sure Hamas started the bombing...

If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.

 


'We are going to make a little bit of history here’ Mr. J. Ertl.

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View jcreedy's Profile jcreedy Flag 25 Jul 14 9.26am Send a Private Message to jcreedy Add jcreedy as a friend

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am


If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.


They didn't start the fight. Israel did by taking Palestinian land and destroying homes over recent decades.

Edited by jcreedy (25 Jul 2014 9.26am)

 


It was my dream to play for Palace and to make my debut. I've always played for the club so if I'm playing here, I wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

- John Bostock (Nov 2007)

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View Cucking Funt's Profile Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 25 Jul 14 9.32am Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

Quote jcreedy at 25 Jul 2014 9.26am

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am


If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.


They didn't start the fight. Israel did by taking Palestinian land and destroying homes over recent decades.

Edited by jcreedy (25 Jul 2014 9.26am)


But there's no such place as Palestine.

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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View jcreedy's Profile jcreedy Flag 25 Jul 14 10.01am Send a Private Message to jcreedy Add jcreedy as a friend

Quote Cucking Funt at 25 Jul 2014 9.32am

Quote jcreedy at 25 Jul 2014 9.26am

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am


If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.


They didn't start the fight. Israel did by taking Palestinian land and destroying homes over recent decades.

Edited by jcreedy (25 Jul 2014 9.26am)


But there's no such place as Palestine.


 


It was my dream to play for Palace and to make my debut. I've always played for the club so if I'm playing here, I wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

- John Bostock (Nov 2007)

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View ghosteagle's Profile ghosteagle Flag 25 Jul 14 10.18am Send a Private Message to ghosteagle Add ghosteagle as a friend

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am

Quote nickgusset at 24 Jul 2014 11.04pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 10.50pm

Does supporting Hamas firing rockets count as anti semitism?

I don't support any firing onto UN facilities but the situation here is unclear.

Yet the usual suspects are fully in 'minds made up mode' and have their Hamas loving in top gear.

This organisation rejected a cease firs a week ago. They apparently store arms at UN locations.....Apparently fire from them.

Would Hamas engineer this by bringing the fight here for maximum publicity?.....It certainty gets their supporters foaming at the mouth.

What happened here isn't clear.......But I do know the people continuing this fight are Hamas by rejecting an Arab league cease fire.


Hamas disagreed to the terms of a ceasefire unless the blockade is lifted.

Israel say they are targeting places where Hamas are hiding.
From the Grauniad...


They hid at the El-Wafa hospital.

They hid at the Al-Aqsa hospital.

They hid at the beach, where children played football.

They hid at the yard of 75-year-old Muhammad Hamad.

They hid among the residential quarters of Shujaya.

They hid in the neighbourhoods of Zaytoun and Toffah.

They hid in Rafah and Khan Younis.

They hid in the home of the Qassan family.

They hid in the home of the poet, Othman Hussein.

They hid in the village of Khuzaa.

They hid in the thousands of houses damaged or destroyed.

They hid in 84 schools and 23 medical facilities.

They hid in a cafe, where Gazans were watching the World Cup.

They hid in the ambulances trying to retrieve the injured.

They hid themselves in 24 corpses, buried under rubble.

They hid themselves in a young woman in pink household slippers, sprawled on the pavement, taken down while fleeing.

They hid themselves in two brothers, eight and four, lying in the intensive burn care unit in Al-Shifa.

They hid themselves in the little boy whose parts were carried away by his father in a plastic shopping bag.

They hid themselves in the “incomparable chaos of bodies” arriving at Gaza hospitals.

They hid themselves in an elderly woman, lying in a pool of blood on a stone floor.

Hamas, they tell us, is cowardly and cynical.

An Israeli spokesman even had the temerity to tell Jon Snow on channel 4 news that Hamas were deliberately killing their own in order to blame Israel!


Yep. I believe most of the above.

The German's didn't have suicide bombers. The rules of warfare have changed. Hamas can't beat Israel by force so will try and use any tactic possible to beat them.

They know if they sacrifice a few lambs to the slaughter and showcase it to the world it will make the Jew look evil. Whilst still bombing and killing Israeli's of course. That always gets over-looked.

They'll try to win over the f*cking morons who know nothing about Palastine but march up to Downing Street p*ssing and moaning trying to get everyone to intervene.

Funnily enough it's the same n*b heads who moan about the Yanks and us going into Afghanistan and Iraq but cry foul when we don't go into Gaza.

Brilliant.

Pretty sure Hamas started the bombing...

If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.

Yes, what 'n*b heads', cos that worked out so well.

 

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View bright&wright's Profile bright&wright Flag 25 Jul 14 11.16am Send a Private Message to bright&wright Add bright&wright as a friend

Quote ghosteagle at 25 Jul 2014 10.18am

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am

Quote nickgusset at 24 Jul 2014 11.04pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 10.50pm

Does supporting Hamas firing rockets count as anti semitism?

I don't support any firing onto UN facilities but the situation here is unclear.

Yet the usual suspects are fully in 'minds made up mode' and have their Hamas loving in top gear.

This organisation rejected a cease firs a week ago. They apparently store arms at UN locations.....Apparently fire from them.

Would Hamas engineer this by bringing the fight here for maximum publicity?.....It certainty gets their supporters foaming at the mouth.

What happened here isn't clear.......But I do know the people continuing this fight are Hamas by rejecting an Arab league cease fire.


Hamas disagreed to the terms of a ceasefire unless the blockade is lifted.

Israel say they are targeting places where Hamas are hiding.
From the Grauniad...


They hid at the El-Wafa hospital.

They hid at the Al-Aqsa hospital.

They hid at the beach, where children played football.

They hid at the yard of 75-year-old Muhammad Hamad.

They hid among the residential quarters of Shujaya.

They hid in the neighbourhoods of Zaytoun and Toffah.

They hid in Rafah and Khan Younis.

They hid in the home of the Qassan family.

They hid in the home of the poet, Othman Hussein.

They hid in the village of Khuzaa.

They hid in the thousands of houses damaged or destroyed.

They hid in 84 schools and 23 medical facilities.

They hid in a cafe, where Gazans were watching the World Cup.

They hid in the ambulances trying to retrieve the injured.

They hid themselves in 24 corpses, buried under rubble.

They hid themselves in a young woman in pink household slippers, sprawled on the pavement, taken down while fleeing.

They hid themselves in two brothers, eight and four, lying in the intensive burn care unit in Al-Shifa.

They hid themselves in the little boy whose parts were carried away by his father in a plastic shopping bag.

They hid themselves in the “incomparable chaos of bodies” arriving at Gaza hospitals.

They hid themselves in an elderly woman, lying in a pool of blood on a stone floor.

Hamas, they tell us, is cowardly and cynical.

An Israeli spokesman even had the temerity to tell Jon Snow on channel 4 news that Hamas were deliberately killing their own in order to blame Israel!


Yep. I believe most of the above.

The German's didn't have suicide bombers. The rules of warfare have changed. Hamas can't beat Israel by force so will try and use any tactic possible to beat them.

They know if they sacrifice a few lambs to the slaughter and showcase it to the world it will make the Jew look evil. Whilst still bombing and killing Israeli's of course. That always gets over-looked.

They'll try to win over the f*cking morons who know nothing about Palastine but march up to Downing Street p*ssing and moaning trying to get everyone to intervene.

Funnily enough it's the same n*b heads who moan about the Yanks and us going into Afghanistan and Iraq but cry foul when we don't go into Gaza.

Brilliant.

Pretty sure Hamas started the bombing...

If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.

Yes, what 'n*b heads', cos that worked out so well.


My point being they moan when we intervene, they moan when we don't.

Never happy.

 


'We are going to make a little bit of history here’ Mr. J. Ertl.

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 25 Jul 14 11.36am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Quote corkery at 25 Jul 2014 8.17am

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 11.05pm

Quote corkery at 24 Jul 2014 10.56pm

I wouldn't accept it either. Some man called David decided thousands of years ago that this was their Holy land, then they all hop in and take land that isn't theres. Killing civilians will only make the matter worse.

What's the point of a paragraph like that?

'take land that isn't theres'....To an extent I agree with you...But that was 47....I guess you're anti immigration...Because that's how the state was enabled and ultimately happened.....They moved in and bought it up and then won it in war.

It's 2014 not 1947......We can't wave a wand and magic the state away.


1947?? It's still happening now. Occupied land with settlements. This was acceptable in the imperial days, not today.


Some or all Illegal settlements in the West Bank will be given up in any two state solution.

Supporting Hamas and continuing to fight Israel only means you make that two state solution impossible. Illegal settlements can only be sorted out via the courts via legal process.

For that you need a two state solution....For that you need moderates in charge willing to make something lasting work....For that Hamas need to be out of political power so that Israel stop voting in right wing governments.

I don't know what world the 'usual suspects' left live in regarding this.......Supporting Hamas and their rocket fire goes absolutely nowhere.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Jul 2014 11.37am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 25 Jul 14 12.16pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 25 Jul 2014 11.36am

Quote corkery at 25 Jul 2014 8.17am

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 11.05pm

Quote corkery at 24 Jul 2014 10.56pm

I wouldn't accept it either. Some man called David decided thousands of years ago that this was their Holy land, then they all hop in and take land that isn't theres. Killing civilians will only make the matter worse.

What's the point of a paragraph like that?

'take land that isn't theres'....To an extent I agree with you...But that was 47....I guess you're anti immigration...Because that's how the state was enabled and ultimately happened.....They moved in and bought it up and then won it in war.

It's 2014 not 1947......We can't wave a wand and magic the state away.


1947?? It's still happening now. Occupied land with settlements. This was acceptable in the imperial days, not today.


Some or all Illegal settlements in the West Bank will be given up in any two state solution.

Supporting Hamas and continuing to fight Israel only means you make that two state solution impossible. Illegal settlements can only be sorted out via the courts via legal process.

For that you need a two state solution....For that you need moderates in charge willing to make something lasting work....For that Hamas need to be out of political power so that Israel stop voting in right wing governments.

I don't know what world the 'usual suspects' left live in regarding this.......Supporting Hamas and their rocket fire goes absolutely nowhere.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Jul 2014 11.37am)


Netanyahu has said he doesn't want Palestine to be a sovereign state, see earlier link, so twould appear he doesn't want a two state solution. This is why we need intervention. One could almost argue the opposite of what you have in that until Israelis vote out Netanyahu, it's their own fault that Hamas are firing rockets.
Of course I'm being a little facetious, but you get my drift.
What is needed is someone to come in and metaphorically bang both sides heads together until they see sense. Otherwise we'll be stuck in this deadlock and Israel will continue to get away with murder.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 25 Jul 14 12.38pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 25 Jul 2014 12.16pm

Netanyahu has said he doesn't want Palestine to be a sovereign state, see earlier link, so twould appear he doesn't want a two state solution. This is why we need intervention. One could almost argue the opposite of what you have in that until Israelis vote out Netanyahu, it's their own fault that Hamas are firing rockets.
Of course I'm being a little facetious, but you get my drift.
What is needed is someone to come in and metaphorically bang both sides heads together until they see sense. Otherwise we'll be stuck in this deadlock and Israel will continue to get away with murder.


Netanyahu and the right don't believe peace is possible or indeed that a two state solution is in Israel's best interests long term......There is logic in what he says but of course it isn't ethical.

Anyway what Netanyahu says only stands while he is in power.

Israelis actually get the chance to vote out Netanyahu and the right.

Hamas...the side you support..... have suspended democracy and have linked conditions to stopping this bloody mess that you only blame Israel for.

Oh....Not forgetting that you think Israel are staying in Gaza to control its future gas reserves of course....We mustn't forget that one.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Jul 2014 12.40pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View davidpercival's Profile davidpercival Flag Croydon 25 Jul 14 12.53pm Send a Private Message to davidpercival Add davidpercival as a friend

Stirling (Correctly spelt I trust) - As you have raised a new topic, I think that breaches our ceasefire agreement and I can comment.

Let me get this right. You admit the Israeli settlements are illegal yet you say they can only be expected to give them up as part of a legal process?

It is rather as if you got mugged in the street and the thief said you can only get your property back if you take it through the Courts and you will have to make concessions to do it?

I think all this defending Israel is causing you to lose contact with rational thinking. Surely the starting point is Israel saying they will give up the stolen land and that they are prepared to negotiate ordinary relations between states with whatever government the Palestinian people chose to elect.

Quote Stirlingsays at 25 Jul 2014 11.36am

Quote corkery at 25 Jul 2014 8.17am

Quote Stirlingsays at 24 Jul 2014 11.05pm

Quote corkery at 24 Jul 2014 10.56pm

I wouldn't accept it either. Some man called David decided thousands of years ago that this was their Holy land, then they all hop in and take land that isn't theres. Killing civilians will only make the matter worse.

What's the point of a paragraph like that?

'take land that isn't theres'....To an extent I agree with you...But that was 47....I guess you're anti immigration...Because that's how the state was enabled and ultimately happened.....They moved in and bought it up and then won it in war.

It's 2014 not 1947......We can't wave a wand and magic the state away.


1947?? It's still happening now. Occupied land with settlements. This was acceptable in the imperial days, not today.


Some or all Illegal settlements in the West Bank will be given up in any two state solution.

Supporting Hamas and continuing to fight Israel only means you make that two state solution impossible. Illegal settlements can only be sorted out via the courts via legal process.

For that you need a two state solution....For that you need moderates in charge willing to make something lasting work....For that Hamas need to be out of political power so that Israel stop voting in right wing governments.

I don't know what world the 'usual suspects' left live in regarding this.......Supporting Hamas and their rocket fire goes absolutely nowhere.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Jul 2014 11.37am)


 

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View davidpercival's Profile davidpercival Flag Croydon 25 Jul 14 12.58pm Send a Private Message to davidpercival Add davidpercival as a friend

So how come Britain had a mandate from the UN to govern a place called Palestine? The fact that Israel declared it no longer existed doesn't mean it doesn't. Even right wing Israelis (i.e. nearly all of them) don't maintain the fiction that Palestine doesn't exist any more. That seems to make you even more right wing than them, which takes some doing.

Quote Cucking Funt at 25 Jul 2014 9.32am

Quote jcreedy at 25 Jul 2014 9.26am

Quote bright&wright at 25 Jul 2014 8.40am


If you start a fight and can't back it up, it's your problem.


They didn't start the fight. Israel did by taking Palestinian land and destroying homes over recent decades.

Edited by jcreedy (25 Jul 2014 9.26am)


But there's no such place as Palestine.


 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 25 Jul 14 1.11pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Quote davidpercival at 25 Jul 2014 12.53pm

Stirling (Correctly spelt I trust) - As you have raised a new topic, I think that breaches our ceasefire agreement and I can comment.

Let me get this right. You admit the Israeli settlements are illegal yet you say they can only be expected to give them up as part of a legal process?

Yes.....The realistic alternative being?

Quote davidpercival at 25 Jul 2014 12.53pm

It is rather as if you got mugged in the street and the thief said you can only get your property back if you take it through the Courts and you will have to make concessions to do it?

If someone mugs you in the street then unless you can win that property back there and then yes.....The only way you get it back is through the courts.

Whether or not there will be concessions on the illegal settlements is a matter for negotiations on the two state solution.

A two state solution would involve transitional wars within both states to implement it......The moderates within both states would have to fight and beat their own to implement it.

It is the only way.

Quote davidpercival at 25 Jul 2014 12.53pm

I think all this defending Israel is causing you to lose contact with rational thinking. Surely the starting point is Israel saying they will give up the stolen land and that they are prepared to negotiate ordinary relations between states with whatever government the Palestinian people chose to elect.

And the motivation for Israel to do that is?

There is no point giving land and a state back to an enemy which is dedicated to wiping you out....Has a constitution that says it is at war and continually fires rockets....Any break being only an opportunity to grow stronger.

Sorry.....tell me what's in it for Israel?

If someone declares permanent war on you do you treat them fairly and enable them to grow stronger then?

Any peace with the Palestinians cannot involve Hamas.....The right in Israel only have power from the ballot box....Israel's constitution means peace is possible.....Hamas's doesn't.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Jul 2014 1.13pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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