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March 28 2024 1.48pm

The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)

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View martinelliff's Profile martinelliff Flag Staffordshire 13 Jan 20 3.54pm Send a Private Message to martinelliff Add martinelliff as a friend

I don't care what happened 100 years ago either, but if we had not spread ourselves across the globe like we would not have become the honeypot we are now (language, culture, etc). It is what happened. Perhaps the leaders post war should not have sent thousands to Australia and shipped in thousands from the Caribbean and other commonwealth nations, but that is what they did and we can't change that. There will always be immigration and likely most of those immigrants will be from non-EU countries. We can't stop it happening. We have a declining birth rate among the indigenous population. Those from poorer countries have a higher birth rate for their own survival, so the ratio over here will change until migrants cease to be as poor (rich people's kids don't die so much). I am not saying I like any of this either, but time moves forward, the 50s are long gone.

Originally posted by W12

.....and what Stirling said

I actually don't give a toss what happened 100's of years ago.

 

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View martinelliff's Profile martinelliff Flag Staffordshire 13 Jan 20 4.05pm Send a Private Message to martinelliff Add martinelliff as a friend

We don't bare the sins of our fathers, but we are living with the consequences. There is no going back for anyone, it happened. Japan got mentioned regarding immigration but no-one goes there because their language and alphabet takes years to master to even find your way round. What is the answer? The North Korean model? Shut down the outside world. Produce everything ourselves. Expel anyone not born in the UK? e.g. Wilf?

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Errrr....sorry, firstly I don't accept your narrative about 'white' history and secondly what has your perception of past 'crimes' got to do with 'whites' now? Are you suggesting because I'm white I have to account for the decisions made by elites from what....hundreds of years ago?

That's historical and racial guilt you're pushing there. The idea that something someone's great grandfather did falls to me to pay for.

Sorry mate, I was not 'born guilty'......You wear a hairshirt if you want to but keep it away from me.

There's no going back for you perhaps but the consequences you have supported will and have already led nowhere good.

Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Jan 2020 3.47pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 13 Jan 20 6.12pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by martinelliff

We don't bare the sins of our fathers, but we are living with the consequences. There is no going back for anyone, it happened. Japan got mentioned regarding immigration but no-one goes there because their language and alphabet takes years to master to even find your way round. What is the answer? The North Korean model? Shut down the outside world. Produce everything ourselves. Expel anyone not born in the UK? e.g. Wilf?

No, we aren't 'living with the consequences'. We are living with really really bad decisions voluntarily taken since WW2...There was zero compulsion....and what you originally said was definitely a 'sins of the fathers' argument and it's quite depressing that this is your view of what is just.

The answer is to take the Japanese model for future immigration policy and to take the Hungary model on rewarding native births.

Anyone who hasn't been born here will be subject to the same controls that operate within Japan. So a Zaha, would operate on a permit.

He decided his loyalty was to Ivory Coast, that's fair enough. He's a foreign player and eventually once his work commitment is finished here he'd go back. A rich man who can be a role model in his own country.

Your 'inevitability' argument isn't that at all. It's a decision to go down a path that leads to dystopia ....we are seeing it in the US and it'll be here within twenty years.

Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Jan 2020 6.56pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 13 Jan 20 6.21pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by martinelliff

I don't care what happened 100 years ago either, but if we had not spread ourselves across the globe like we would not have become the honeypot we are now (language, culture, etc). It is what happened. Perhaps the leaders post war should not have sent thousands to Australia and shipped in thousands from the Caribbean and other commonwealth nations, but that is what they did and we can't change that. There will always be immigration and likely most of those immigrants will be from non-EU countries. We can't stop it happening. We have a declining birth rate among the indigenous population. Those from poorer countries have a higher birth rate for their own survival, so the ratio over here will change until migrants cease to be as poor (rich people's kids don't die so much). I am not saying I like any of this either, but time moves forward, the 50s are long gone.

It's not about remaking the 50s.

It's about being like most of the countries around the world. It's only Europe that is doing this. Countries like Japan and Israel and in fact most of Asia have rules that protect the national ethnicity from foreign control.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View cpfc_chap's Profile cpfc_chap Flag koh samui 13 Jan 20 6.50pm Send a Private Message to cpfc_chap Add cpfc_chap as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

It's not about remaking the 50s.

It's about being like most of the countries around the world. It's only Europe that is doing this. Countries like Japan and Israel and in fact most of Asia have rules that protect the national ethnicity from foreign control.

Most s.e Asian countries will not allow foreigners to do jobs which their own folk can do. Also all foreigners have to report to immigration every 30 to 90 days which is a ballache but it works!

 

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View martinelliff's Profile martinelliff Flag Staffordshire 13 Jan 20 6.56pm Send a Private Message to martinelliff Add martinelliff as a friend

Brexit in a few weeks so let's do all that. Boris has the power. p.s. Wilf has dual citizenship so would not need to leave.

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

It's not about remaking the 50s.

It's about being like most of the countries around the world. It's only Europe that is doing this. Countries like Japan and Israel and in fact most of Asia have rules that protect the national ethnicity from foreign control.

 

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Online Flag 13 Jan 20 7.00pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend


Also raises the question that if Britain has always been a nation of immigrants why the blame for previous generations activities always falls on the indigenous population.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 13 Jan 20 7.06pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Technology in the next few years will mean millions of of low and medium skilled jobs worldwide will be lost.

We have plenty of people in this country who will find it difficult to upskill or re-skill.


Now that we are leaving the EU the politicians can no longer hide behind the "blame the EU" excuse. I expect this government and future ones to have a sensible and flexible immigration policy that balances skills that we need against the local population.

If the current government screws this up then they have no one but themselves to blame.

I would also expect any government to look at skill shortages and implement long term plans to train our own. It's fine bringing in nurses from abroad because we need them now but we shouldn't have to do this and government policy is largely to blame.

If I am right about large scale job losses I wonder how long the EU will continue with freedom of movement before they too start looking to protect their own.

 


One more point

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 13 Jan 20 7.10pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by martinelliff

Brexit in a few weeks so let's do all that. Boris has the power. p.s. Wilf has dual citizenship so would not need to leave.

Well, I was saying what could be done rather than a return to the 50s.....Personally I don't agree with dual citizenship and many other countries don't either.

However, that's relatively minor in the scheme of things.

I agree with you on Brexit and your idea of the future is currently definitely what we are on the path towards.

It just isn't a path for me and my young family.

Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Jan 2020 7.11pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 13 Jan 20 7.12pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

"If I am right about large scale job losses I wonder how long the EU will continue with freedom of movement before they too start looking to protect their own. "

Just had a thought.
I wonder if any research has been done on which countries will be impacted by us leaving in terms of job migration.

The UK was the destination of choice for people with low skills in countries with high unemployment, where will they go now? Germany?, France?

 


One more point

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 13 Jan 20 7.28pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Surely you don't expect us to believe that

That's up to you. It matters not a jot to me if you believe it or not. What matters is that it is true and as a reward for your sarcasm let me further inform you I have many friends, some of who I was with this afternoon. Several are also Brexiteers but that doesn't get in the way of our friendship as we show each other mutual respect. I don't get a lot of that here! From a handful, sometimes in private, but not from the core.

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 13 Jan 20 7.33pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

That's up to you. It matters not a jot to me if you believe it or not. What matters is that it is true and as a reward for your sarcasm let me further inform you I have many friends, some of who I was with this afternoon. Several are also Brexiteers but that doesn't get in the way of our friendship as we show each other mutual respect. I don't get a lot of that here! From a handful, sometimes in private, but not from the core.

You wasnt bothered a while ago.
You wasnt here to make friends.
Why are you now?
Been visited by 3 ghosts?

 

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