The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
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 Stirlingsays  17 Sep 19 10.21am |
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Originally posted by W12
I certainly agree with what should happen but it seems the remainers have full control of the narrative to the point they can ignore opposition and slander opponents and so can virtually do whatever they want now. I believe it will take some drastic action by leavers to make this happen. i.e. riots The interesting option re cummings is that the justification for extending in March was that EU law supplanted UK law. If that's the case how can this traitorous surrender legislation supplant article 50? I don't know....but I'm planning to eat a lot of popcorn between now and whenever this saga ends.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| W12 17 Sep 19 10.22am | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
I don't know....but I'm planning to eat a lot of popcorn between now and whenever this saga ends. Hopefully you can eat popcorn and sharpen a pitchfork at the same time
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| Stirlingsays 17 Sep 19 10.27am |
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Originally posted by W12
Hopefully you can eat popcorn and sharpen a pitchfork at the same time There's a scenario where a lot of us will probably be traveling towards the same time and location certainly. But I'm more optimistic that we will be leaving....in one form or another. It's about the principle more than anything else. If we have another referendum in a couple of years and we revert back....then so be it.....With the demographic change it's inevitable anyway.....here anyway. Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Sep 2019 10.28am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| steeleye20 Croydon 17 Sep 19 10.28am |
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All Supreme Court judges must be wider at the bottom than at the top. This prevents them from being overturned
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 17 Sep 19 10.43am |
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Originally posted by W12
I certainly agree with what should happen but it seems the remainers have full control of the narrative to the point they can ignore opposition and slander opponents and so can virtually do whatever they want now. I believe it will take some drastic action by leavers to make this happen. i.e. riots The interesting option re cummings is that the justification for extending in March was that EU law supplanted UK law. If that's the case how can this traitorous surrender legislation supplant article 50? Don't you think it's Parliament as a whole, irrespective of whether it's individual members were originally in favour of leaving or remaining, that have simply reasserted their supremacy over the executive? Many MP's have accepted, even if they don't personally want it, that they are honour bound to try to implement to referendum decision.(I don't agree with them, but that's not the point). Their issue is the way we leave, and not if we leave. Other's take different positions but there are enough to be a majority against leaving without a deal. So this is now no longer simply about Brexit. It's about ensuring the preservation of Parliamentary democracy. Allow an executive to dominate Parliament and ignore their decisions is a big step towards allowing a future wanna be dictator to ride roughshod over our democratic processes. Parliament cannot allow such a precedent to be set. So I think your description of how things are is way of the mark. Preserving our system comes much higher up the agenda. Brexit has already been delayed so a another month or two hardly matters.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Matov Online 17 Sep 19 11.19am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Many MP's have accepted, even if they don't personally want it, that they are honour bound to try to implement to referendum decision.(I don't agree with them, but that's not the point). Their issue is the way we leave, and not if we leave. Other's take different positions but there are enough to be a majority against leaving without a deal. If that is the case why is the issue of 'Remain' being on a proposed second referendum so prominent?
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 17 Sep 19 11.29am |
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Originally posted by Matov
If that is the case why is the issue of 'Remain' being on a proposed second referendum so prominent? Because many doesn't mean all or even most. It's when all those who oppose any kind of Brexit come together with those who just oppose a no deal Brexit that Parliament has a majority against the government's current stance. If and when there is another referendum deciding what will be on the ballot paper will undoubtedly be another long drawn out process subject to legal reviews
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Teddy Eagle  17 Sep 19 11.35am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Because many doesn't mean all or even most. It's when all those who oppose any kind of Brexit come together with those who just oppose a no deal Brexit that Parliament has a majority against the government's current stance. If and when there is another referendum deciding what will be on the ballot paper will undoubtedly be another long drawn out process subject to legal reviews And provided Gina Miller approves the outcome.
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palace_in_frogland  In a broken dream 17 Sep 19 11.40am |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
All Supreme Court judges must be wider at the bottom than at the top. This prevents them from being overturned
Weebles wobble but they don’t fall down.
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| Matov Online 17 Sep 19 12.03pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
If and when there is another referendum deciding what will be on the ballot paper will undoubtedly be another long drawn out process subject to legal reviews And put what we have experienced already in terms of political turmoil into the shade. This is what I struggle to understand about the Remainer stance. A second referendum with a Remain option settles nothing. Only makes things MUCH MUCH MUCH worse. Because nobody will have the slightest shred of faith in the process. Why would anybody accept the result? For a start, I suspect a much lower turn out with even an organised boycott/spoiling the ballot paper campaign. That would certainly be my instinctive reaction. So at the end lets us say we get a turnout of under 50% with a Remain 'victory' under 17 million votes. Can you honestly, with a straight face, claim that as a democratic mandate to revoke A50? It will be a farce that has the potential to end in tragedy with a nation already at each other's throats and the potential for that to turn to a level of nastiness that acheives nothing other than potential bloodshed. Brexit does not go away until we have left the EU. Our national sanity requires that closure because otherwise this is a wound that festers away, poisoning every aspect of our lives. Once that is done then campaign away to Rejoin. Best of British with that. A perfectly legitimate political ambition. But to inflict another Brexit referendum on this country is the most dangerous wish of all. Beyond irresponsible. Edited by Matov (17 Sep 2019 12.04pm)
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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| steeleye20 Croydon 17 Sep 19 12.08pm |
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I always view these Supreme Court cases as inherently unfair, in my cynical way I think that the side with the most money usually wins. The government can progress through court after court throwing the taxpayers money at it, what do they care, whereas their opponent presumably has to cough up themselves, unless they win. That's a hell of a risk, imagine how costly it is, suspension probably hasn't worked for Johnson anyway. At the end of the day, as Cameron said last night on TV, he will just have to go back to the parliament where the majorities are now considerably against him.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 17 Sep 19 12.08pm |
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Originally posted by Matov
And put what we have experienced already in terms of political turmoil into the shade. This is what I struggle to understand about the Remainer stance. A second referendum with a Remain option settles nothing. Only makes things MUCH MUCH MUCH worse. Because nobody will have the slightest shred of faith in the process. Why would anybody accept the result? For a start, I suspect a much lower turn out with even an organised boycott/spoiling the ballot paper campaign. That would certainly be my instinctive reaction. So at the end lets us say we get a turnout of under 50% with a Remain 'victory' under 17 million votes. Can you honestly, with a straight face, claim that as a democratic mandate to revoke A50? It will be a farce that has the potential to end in tragedy with a nation already at each other's throats and the potential for that to turn to a level of nastiness that acheives nothing other than potential bloodshed. Brexit does not go away until we have left the EU. Our national sanity requires that closure because otherwise this is a wound that festers away, poisoning every aspect of our lives. Once that is done then campaign away to Rejoin. Best of British with that. A perfectly legitimate political ambition. But to inflict another Brexit referendum on this country is the most dangerous wish of all. Beyond irresponsible. Edited by Matov (17 Sep 2019 12.04pm) Exactly right. The whole idea of a second ballot with a Remain option is completely unacceptable on every level.
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