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chris123 hove actually 20 Dec 19 3.13pm
Originally posted by Matov And breathe out. Its over. Yes, probably some twists and turns to come and I have my doubts about Johnson and his plans which I suspect will leave me feeling short-changed but as things stand, we are now definitely leaving the EU on January 31st. Democracy has survived. Just. Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid. A disgrace it has taken this long and I still hold a very real and deep loathing for those who sort to scupper the result on June 23rd 2016 but today it does not matter. They failed. Miserably and utterly. But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on. A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind. I'll say it again - the last parliament was rotten.
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chris123

hove actually 20 Dec 19 3.13pm

Originally posted by Matov

And breathe out.

Its over. Yes, probably some twists and turns to come and I have my doubts about Johnson and his plans which I suspect will leave me feeling short-changed but as things stand, we are now definitely leaving the EU on January 31st.

Democracy has survived. Just.

Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid.

A disgrace it has taken this long and I still hold a very real and deep loathing for those who sort to scupper the result on June 23rd 2016 but today it does not matter. They failed. Miserably and utterly.

But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on.

A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind.

I'll say it again - the last parliament was rotten.

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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 20 Dec 19 3.27pm
Originally posted by Matov And breathe out. Its over. Yes, probably some twists and turns to come and I have my doubts about Johnson and his plans which I suspect will leave me feeling short-changed but as things stand, we are now definitely leaving the EU on January 31st. Democracy has survived. Just. Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid. A disgrace it has taken this long and I still hold a very real and deep loathing for those who sort to scupper the result on June 23rd 2016 but today it does not matter. They failed. Miserably and utterly. But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on. A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind. Slightly antagonistic and a hint of ‘I’ll take it any way it comes’ but broadly agreed - this needed to end and end as per the vote. Personally I think what we’ve just had to endure I’ve rate last three years is just the beginning, not the end. Absolute saga. Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.
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SW19 CPFC

Addiscombe West 20 Dec 19 3.27pm

Originally posted by Matov

And breathe out.

Democracy has survived. Just.

Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid.

But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on.

A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind.

Slightly antagonistic and a hint of ‘I’ll take it any way it comes’ but broadly agreed - this needed to end and end as per the vote.

Personally I think what we’ve just had to endure I’ve rate last three years is just the beginning, not the end. Absolute saga.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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Badger11 Beckenham 20 Dec 19 3.54pm
Originally posted by Matov And breathe out. Its over. Yes, probably some twists and turns to come and I have my doubts about Johnson and his plans which I suspect will leave me feeling short-changed but as things stand, we are now definitely leaving the EU on January 31st. Democracy has survived. Just. Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid. A disgrace it has taken this long and I still hold a very real and deep loathing for those who sort to scupper the result on June 23rd 2016 but today it does not matter. They failed. Miserably and utterly. But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on. A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind. Passionate Remainers will never change their mind which is their right. However that leaves people who may have reluctantly voted Remain possibly because they were scared of such a big change. As long as the economy continues to do well I think over time those people will accept the new status quo the same way they accepted being in the EU as the old status quo. Some of the concerns of people should be put to bed pretty quickly. How we travel around the EU will be a visible consequence of Brexit. If Boris can negotiate so that it is fairly painless that concern will wither away. It will be the same for those wishing to work in the EU. As long as they are qualified I don't expect they will have problems. The rest of the stuff e.g. workers rights or the environment is down to Parliament. If they don't like the laws no doubt they will vote accordingly at the next GE. It won't be quick but I do see the country moving on and the complaints will simply be the usual for or against the government of the day. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 20 Dec 19 3.54pm

Originally posted by Matov

And breathe out.

Democracy has survived. Just.

Lost friends, lost faith, in short feel rather battered and bruised by the whole process but finally my vote, along with 17 million plus others, has been rendered valid.

But 2020 is a new year and a new start. Not sure how we heal as a nation but at least we can now move on.

A period in British history which will not reflect well on a lot of people who really should have known better. But they did not achieve what they set out to do. Need to always keep that in mind.

Passionate Remainers will never change their mind which is their right. However that leaves people who may have reluctantly voted Remain possibly because they were scared of such a big change.

As long as the economy continues to do well I think over time those people will accept the new status quo the same way they accepted being in the EU as the old status quo.

Some of the concerns of people should be put to bed pretty quickly. How we travel around the EU will be a visible consequence of Brexit. If Boris can negotiate so that it is fairly painless that concern will wither away. It will be the same for those wishing to work in the EU. As long as they are qualified I don't expect they will have problems.

The rest of the stuff e.g. workers rights or the environment is down to Parliament. If they don't like the laws no doubt they will vote accordingly at the next GE.

It won't be quick but I do see the country moving on and the complaints will simply be the usual for or against the government of the day.

One more point

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Stirlingsays 20 Dec 19 5.01pm
The 2016 vote was such a massive shock to the establishment that it took this election to decide this issue. I can't think of a part of the establishment that weren't looking to block Brexit. The willingness to thwart the basic outcome of that 2016 result was a real eye opener for us. Independent of Brexit, we as a people need to contest the establishment, which increasingly involves corporations....seemingly more regularly than before. Johnson has a huge opportunity here to implement his philosophy. He will stand or fall by that. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

20 Dec 19 5.01pm

The 2016 vote was such a massive shock to the establishment that it took this election to decide this issue.

I can't think of a part of the establishment that weren't looking to block Brexit. The willingness to thwart the basic outcome of that 2016 result was a real eye opener for us.

Independent of Brexit, we as a people need to contest the establishment, which increasingly involves corporations....seemingly more regularly than before.

Johnson has a huge opportunity here to implement his philosophy. He will stand or fall by that.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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the silurian The garden of England.(not really) 20 Dec 19 7.52pm
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle One of them is now denying having called Brexit supporters stupid and is suing the person who spread these slurs I think it's a shame as I'd like to see Emily Thornberry take over as Labour leader as the woman is so objectionable she will ensure that Labour remain in the doldrums worth joining the Labour party, just to vote for Thornberry as leader, guarantees Labour will never win a GE for years!
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the silurian

The garden of England.(not really) 20 Dec 19 7.52pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

One of them is now denying having called Brexit supporters stupid and is suing the person who spread these slurs

I think it's a shame as I'd like to see Emily Thornberry take over as Labour leader as the woman is so objectionable she will ensure that Labour remain in the doldrums

worth joining the Labour party, just to vote for Thornberry as leader, guarantees Labour will never win a GE for years!

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Stirlingsays 20 Dec 19 7.56pm
Originally posted by the silurian worth joining the Labour party, just to vote for Thornberry as leader, guarantees Labour will never win a GE for years! Lammy, Lammy, Lammy, Lammy. Don't be a fanny, vote for Lammy! 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

20 Dec 19 7.56pm

Originally posted by the silurian

worth joining the Labour party, just to vote for Thornberry as leader, guarantees Labour will never win a GE for years!

Lammy, Lammy, Lammy, Lammy.

Don't be a fanny, vote for Lammy!

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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chris123 hove actually 20 Dec 19 8.28pm
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle One of them is now denying having called Brexit supporters stupid and is suing the person who spread these slurs I think it's a shame as I'd like to see Emily Thornberry take over as Labour leader as the woman is so objectionable she will ensure that Labour remain in the doldrums Hardly slander.
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chris123

hove actually 20 Dec 19 8.28pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

One of them is now denying having called Brexit supporters stupid and is suing the person who spread these slurs

I think it's a shame as I'd like to see Emily Thornberry take over as Labour leader as the woman is so objectionable she will ensure that Labour remain in the doldrums

Hardly slander.

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Stirlingsays 21 Dec 19 12.29am
Originally posted by chris123 Hardly slander. It's handbags, but if true (and I'm with Flint) it would badly hamstring her leadership bid. I'm not seeing anyone sensible running.....and to be honest until they change their electional rules Momentum will hold onto the party. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

21 Dec 19 12.29am

Originally posted by chris123

Hardly slander.

It's handbags, but if true (and I'm with Flint) it would badly hamstring her leadership bid.

I'm not seeing anyone sensible running.....and to be honest until they change their electional rules Momentum will hold onto the party.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Matov 21 Dec 19 10.58am
Originally posted by SW19 CPFC Slightly antagonistic.... A valid criticism. I guess I am still full of rage about people who tried to render my vote on June 23rd as an irrelevance. For me the healing is nothing to do with how people voted on June 23rd. Voting Remain was a perfectly valid choice and I am sure many people did so for the most positive of reasons although ultimately if they tossed a coin, their vote is still perfectly acceptable. My ire is aimed solely at those who sort post-June 23rd to effectively make my vote pointless. It is those I struggle to exchange a civil word with these days and it scares me how fragile our democracy truly is, with the biggest danger posed by those who attempt to present themselves as the most virtuous in our society. But they lose. And ended up with a huge Tory majority, free to do what it wants for their pains. Perhaps the best way now is to just let the issue fade. There is a process and that will be followed through on, for good and bad. One less star on that s***ty flag is definitely a good start and I will relish the tears on January 31st but beyond that, just a nasty taste in the mouth and a certain sadness because I have lost a huge amount of respect for people who whilst I might have disagreed with them on a vast swathe of subjects, I still assumed they knew right from wrong. More fool me on that. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.
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Matov

21 Dec 19 10.58am

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

Slightly antagonistic....

A valid criticism. I guess I am still full of rage about people who tried to render my vote on June 23rd as an irrelevance.

For me the healing is nothing to do with how people voted on June 23rd. Voting Remain was a perfectly valid choice and I am sure many people did so for the most positive of reasons although ultimately if they tossed a coin, their vote is still perfectly acceptable.

My ire is aimed solely at those who sort post-June 23rd to effectively make my vote pointless. It is those I struggle to exchange a civil word with these days and it scares me how fragile our democracy truly is, with the biggest danger posed by those who attempt to present themselves as the most virtuous in our society.

But they lose. And ended up with a huge Tory majority, free to do what it wants for their pains.

Perhaps the best way now is to just let the issue fade. There is a process and that will be followed through on, for good and bad.

One less star on that s***ty flag is definitely a good start and I will relish the tears on January 31st but beyond that, just a nasty taste in the mouth and a certain sadness because I have lost a huge amount of respect for people who whilst I might have disagreed with them on a vast swathe of subjects, I still assumed they knew right from wrong. More fool me on that.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 21 Dec 19 11.04am
Originally posted by Matov A valid criticism. I guess I am still full of rage about people who tried to render my vote on June 23rd as an irrelevance. For me the healing is nothing to do with how people voted on June 23rd. Voting Remain was a perfectly valid choice and I am sure many people did so for the most positive of reasons although ultimately if they tossed a coin, their vote is still perfectly acceptable. My ire is aimed solely at those who sort post-June 23rd to effectively make my vote pointless. It is those I struggle to exchange a civil word with these days and it scares me how fragile our democracy truly is, with the biggest danger posed by those who attempt to present themselves as the most virtuous in our society. But they lose. And ended up with a huge Tory majority, free to do what it wants for their pains. Perhaps the best way now is to just let the issue fade. There is a process and that will be followed through on, for good and bad. One less star on that s***ty flag is definitely a good start and I will relish the tears on January 31st but beyond that, just a nasty taste in the mouth and a certain sadness because I have lost a huge amount of respect for people who whilst I might have disagreed with them on a vast swathe of subjects, I still assumed they knew right from wrong. More fool me on that. An excellent post.I doff my hat.
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Willo

South coast - west of Brighton. 21 Dec 19 11.04am