The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
Register | Edit Profile | Subscriptions | Forum Rules | Log In | RSS Feed
 Willo  South coast - west of Brighton. 04 Jul 16 10.12am |
  |
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Mapletree
Fascinating. So an unattributed comment gets credence throughout the Press a week ago and nobody checks the facts. Then a factual piece comes out and, because it wasn't the first comment on the issue, it is written off. Despite being the only proper investigation of the issue. You have to ask why the original 'estimate' was ever given the status of 'fact'. In whose interests was that? Then you have to ask why actual analysis continues to be ignored because of an earlier opinion. This is not aimed at you Willo, it is an observation about the media. As AshTree keeps telling me, the media hates young people. I would love to see some analysis that either proves or disproves that hypothesis. But I would like to know why you even bother repeating a stat that is 'passing around social media'. As ever on this site I want to see the original source and comments before I believe anything. Just pointing out the discrepancies ! I've not gone into any great investigation as to the validity of the figures from various sources as it really doesn't concern me, accordingly I am not giving creedance to any one source.As such I'm not going to bother asking you about your "Factual source" - you have probably mentioned this earlier but this whole matter doesn't really interest me to be honest. At the end of the day the Referendum is 'Done and dusted' and BREXIT prevailed. Edited by Willo (04 Jul 2016 10.16am)
|
|
 Alert a moderator to this post |
 |
| Hoof Hearted 04 Jul 16 10.14am | |
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by SloveniaDave
As the days go by, I am getting a bit more optimistic that we will be able to salvage the situation, re-negotiate a better deal and remain. Even most of the Tories are starting to panic, quite rightly, about the implications of triggering Clause 50. Hopefully they wont be daft enough to have another referendum this time though. False optimism Dave.... No one has any doubts about triggering clause 50, in fact today I heard a report that we don't even need to... we can withdraw by passing our own legislation if we want to.. The story was on R4's Today Programme. They also had Phillip Hammond on who although a Remaniac was consigned to moving onwards and follow the wishes of the people. He also confirmed he supported Theresa May's leadership bid and there would be no General Election till 2020. So... face the facts.... there will be no "best of 3", "a legal challenge to the result" "calling it unfair, because someone had their fingers crossed behind their back", "not any 16-17 year olds' voted so was undemocratic" OR any daft reason you want to dream up. The Referendum was one sided I agree, but blame David Cameron for that by not playing fair by spending tax payers money on pathetic biased leaflets and getting people like Obama in to try and con us. Luckily those of us in the know stood resolute and firm and voted Out/Leave. Let's face it, even George Osborne has come round to the idea and is actively trying to make a go of it - announcing a reduction in Corporation Tax to try and make the UK attractive to foreign investors.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Mapletree Croydon 04 Jul 16 10.30am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Willo
Just pointing out the discrepancies ! I've not gone into any great investigation as to the validity of the figures from various sources as it really doesn't concern me, accordingly I am not giving creedance to any one source.As such I'm not going to bother asking you about your "Factual source" - you have probably mentioned this earlier but this whole matter doesn't really interest me to be honest. At the end of the day the Referendum is 'Done and dusted' and BREXIT prevailed. Edited by Willo (04 Jul 2016 10.16am) Well I think it should concern you. Your generation has created a rift with the youngest generation of voters. Then it says 'well it's their own fault anyway for not voting' when in fact that was untrue. Then it perpetuates the myth. If I were a nipper again that may rather annoy me and drive me away from mainstream politics. And that is not a good place to be, the alternatives tend to involve pain. I am guessing you don't know how strong the feeling runs amongst the 17 to 24 age group which is a group that knows it will end up carrying the can.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Mapletree Croydon 04 Jul 16 10.33am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
False optimism Dave.... No one has any doubts about triggering clause 50, in fact today I heard a report that we don't even need to... we can withdraw by passing our own legislation if we want to.. The story was on R4's Today Programme. They also had Phillip Hammond on who although a Remaniac was consigned to moving onwards and follow the wishes of the people. He also confirmed he supported Theresa May's leadership bid and there would be no General Election till 2020. So... face the facts.... there will be no "best of 3", "a legal challenge to the result" "calling it unfair, because someone had their fingers crossed behind their back", "not any 16-17 year olds' voted so was undemocratic" OR any daft reason you want to dream up. The Referendum was one sided I agree, but blame David Cameron for that by not playing fair by spending tax payers money on pathetic biased leaflets and getting people like Obama in to try and con us. Luckily those of us in the know stood resolute and firm and voted Out/Leave. Let's face it, even George Osborne has come round to the idea and is actively trying to make a go of it - announcing a reduction in Corporation Tax to try and make the UK attractive to foreign investors. Maybe But then, they would say that wouldn't they? Who knows what plans are or are not afoot. What you can be sure of is no current mainstream politician will come out and say we shouldn't leave the EU, that would be political suicide. Just maybe they are mobilising people with nothing to lose to say this for them...
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| jamiemartin721 Reading 04 Jul 16 10.37am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Willo
Just pointing out the discrepancies ! I've not gone into any great investigation as to the validity of the figures from various sources as it really doesn't concern me, accordingly I am not giving creedance to any one source.As such I'm not going to bother asking you about your "Factual source" - you have probably mentioned this earlier but this whole matter doesn't really interest me to be honest. At the end of the day the Referendum is 'Done and dusted' and BREXIT prevailed. Edited by Willo (04 Jul 2016 10.16am) Whilst I'm inclined towards agreeing with you, that the people have spoken etc... That doesn't rule out legal challenges, or guarantee an exit either. For example, were a party to stand in a general election on a 'remain ticket' and win, then there is definitely grounds for remaining in the EU. Or another referendum at a later date, about reversing the decision - either as part of the process of completing and finalising Article 50. Especially if there is no general election before hand. It would be undemocratic to assert that the referendum would be the one and only on the subject. Certainly if there is no general election, the public would have to have the final say on negotiations over article 50, and of course if there was a party who won a general election on the basis of staying in the EU - It would be undemocratic to dismiss that as a possibility (although it would, in my opinion, to be fair have to be a general election on a second referendum). There also remains the possibility of blocking in parliament, although I think this would be a crisis for British Democracy, if parliament overruled a referendum, without 'the authority of the masses'
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| jamiemartin721 Reading 04 Jul 16 10.45am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Let's face it, even George Osborne has come round to the idea and is actively trying to make a go of it - announcing a reduction in Corporation Tax to try and make the UK attractive to foreign investors. A mistake, in my opinion, even though I'll benefit. There is little point in replacing the corporate state of the EU, with a corporate state of the UK, and simply becoming attractive to different international foreign influences. Hardly a patriotic or nationalist act, cut government revenues, which will need to be met by reduced government spending, in order to 'attract' foreign investment. I thought the point of independence was to be independent, not become in hoc to more mercenary foreign influences (as their interest is purely financial). Selling the country piece by piece, and rallying around the flag with a hooo-rah.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Hoof Hearted 04 Jul 16 10.48am | |
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by jamiemartin721
A mistake, in my opinion, even though I'll benefit. There is little point in replacing the corporate state of the EU, with a corporate state of the UK, and simply becoming attractive to different international foreign influences. Hardly a patriotic or nationalist act, cut government revenues, which will need to be met by reduced government spending, in order to 'attract' foreign investment. I thought the point of independence was to be independent, not become in hoc to more mercenary foreign influences (as their interest is purely financial). Selling the country piece by piece, and rallying around the flag with a hooo-rah. And your credentials to oppose this tax strategy are....? You are the world's leading authority on everything Jamie if we were to believe all your posts. Is there not one thing you haven't got an opinion on? LOL mate.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Mapletree Croydon 04 Jul 16 11.25am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by SloveniaDave
As the days go by, I am getting a bit more optimistic that we will be able to salvage the situation, re-negotiate a better deal and remain. Even most of the Tories are starting to panic, quite rightly, about the implications of triggering Clause 50. Hopefully they wont be daft enough to have another referendum this time though. Have you been observing the legal challenge Dave? It's Mischcon de Reya, so to be taken very seriously. I have been up against them in the past and they really know what they are doing. Likely outcome is that Parliament would have to vote on leaving, no doubt taking into account the way the referendum went. I wonder if MPs will have the balls to vote according to how their constituencies voted. If so it could be a close run thing and I might suggest it would shift slightly in favour of remain.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Part Time James 04 Jul 16 11.27am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Mapletree
Have you been observing the legal challenge Dave? It's Mischcon de Reya, so to be taken very seriously. I have been up against them in the past and they really know what they are doing. Likely outcome is that Parliament would have to vote on leaving, no doubt taking into account the way the referendum went. I wonder if MPs will have the balls to vote according to how their constituencies voted. If so it could be a close run thing and I might suggest it would shift slightly in favour of remain. Even if the majority of them voted how their constituency voted then it'd be in favour of Leave still. I think I saw somewhere that on a FPTP system Leave would've had about 68% backing.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Hoof Hearted 04 Jul 16 11.34am | |
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Mapletree
Have you been observing the legal challenge Dave? It's Mischcon de Reya, so to be taken very seriously. I have been up against them in the past and they really know what they are doing. Likely outcome is that Parliament would have to vote on leaving, no doubt taking into account the way the referendum went. I wonder if MPs will have the balls to vote according to how their constituencies voted. If so it could be a close run thing and I might suggest it would shift slightly in favour of remain. This is just another hopeful attempt to outdo democracy and not carry out the will of the people. Assuming the legal challenge was successful, do you honestly think Parliament would not vote to uphold what the majority of the UK voted for? MP's like Liz Truss who was a Remaniac, but her constituency was fiercely Brexit. She would not risk being de-selected. This is just another false hope, and a dying man clutching at straws.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| silvertop Portishead 04 Jul 16 11.47am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
False optimism Dave.... No one has any doubts about triggering clause 50, in fact today I heard a report that we don't even need to... we can withdraw by passing our own legislation if we want to.. The story was on R4's Today Programme. They also had Phillip Hammond on who although a Remaniac was consigned to moving onwards and follow the wishes of the people. He also confirmed he supported Theresa May's leadership bid and there would be no General Election till 2020. So... face the facts.... there will be no "best of 3", "a legal challenge to the result" "calling it unfair, because someone had their fingers crossed behind their back", "not any 16-17 year olds' voted so was undemocratic" OR any daft reason you want to dream up. The Referendum was one sided I agree, but blame David Cameron for that by not playing fair by spending tax payers money on pathetic biased leaflets and getting people like Obama in to try and con us. Luckily those of us in the know stood resolute and firm and voted Out/Leave. Let's face it, even George Osborne has come round to the idea and is actively trying to make a go of it - announcing a reduction in Corporation Tax to try and make the UK attractive to foreign investors. As much as you may hate them pesky foreigners Hoof it may be unwise to by-pass the Art 50 procedure with the very people who we apparently want to negotiate effective bi-lateral trade deals with.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| jamiemartin721 Reading 04 Jul 16 11.53am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
And your credentials to oppose this tax strategy are....? You are the world's leading authority on everything Jamie if we were to believe all your posts. Is there not one thing you haven't got an opinion on? LOL mate. I'm not the one championing the idea of patriotism and how great the UK is. You can't be 'patriotic' in one breath about how the UK must be free of EU influence, and then cutting taxes to attract foreign investment the next. Hardly a victory for the British people... Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
You are the world's leading authority on everything Jamie if we were to believe all your posts. Is there not one thing you haven't got an opinion on? I'm interested in a lot of things, including the fate of the nation, but the hypocrisy of Patriotism and Nationalism, especially in politics, is a subject I'm very interested in.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
Login / Register
All images and text on this site are copyright © 1999-2023 The Holmesdale Online, unless otherwise stated.
Web Design by Guntrisoft Ltd.