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View OldFella's Profile OldFella Flag London 19 Oct 16 11.18am Send a Private Message to OldFella Add OldFella as a friend

Originally posted by chris123

I really don't recognise any of this. Any argument that contains the premise that an opposing view doesn't fully understand, is actually no argument at all.

Very eloquently put, and absolutely spot on.

 


Jackson.. Wan Bissaka.... Sansom.. Nicholas.. Cannon.. Guehi.... Zaha... Thomas.. Byrne... Holton.. Rogers.. that should do it..

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View Cucking Funt's Profile Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 19 Oct 16 1.00pm Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

You have only to listen to some of the comments, not only from the leave voters but from those politicians in favour, to reach the conclusion that they don't understand. Denials made prior and events subsequently, go to confirm that. This is far too big an issue for a simple yes, or no, question. It is far too complicated, and technical, an issue for the average voter to be able to comprehend. We need to leave it to our elected representatives to decide. That is what we pay them to do. Our job is to choose them. Hold a referendum to assess the mood, but then allow parliament to do their constitutional duty.

So what is it, exactly, that us morons who voted to leave don't understand? How are you cleverer than the 52% of the turnout?

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 19 Oct 16 1.16pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

If I polled my friends about an important life decision and it came out 52%/48% I'm not sure it would hold any weight on my ultimate decision.

Be interesting to know what the reaction would have been if it were the same margin the other way.

 

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View Part Time James's Profile Part Time James Flag 19 Oct 16 1.32pm Send a Private Message to Part Time James Add Part Time James as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

If I polled my friends about an important life decision and it came out 52%/48% I'm not sure it would hold any weight on my ultimate decision.

Be interesting to know what the reaction would have been if it were the same margin the other way.

If I was making an important life decision I wouldn't be asking my dickhead mates about it. But if I had told them that I'd definitely do whatever they decided, I'd not expect to be taken seriously next time I asked for their opinion.

 




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View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 19 Oct 16 1.44pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Originally posted by Part Time James

If I was making an important life decision I wouldn't be asking my dickhead mates about it. But if I had told them that I'd definitely do whatever they decided, I'd not expect to be taken seriously next time I asked for their opinion.

Ha, agreed. To be fair, and similar to Brexit, I'd do the total opposite of what the dickheads recommended, the dickheads.

 

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View elgrande's Profile elgrande Flag bedford 19 Oct 16 2.15pm Send a Private Message to elgrande Add elgrande as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

I voted in the referendum to confirm entry by Wilson and I think the yes vote was 67% which I think is just about enough.

However this is split down the middle and is advisory its not enough for me.

Its a sad reflection on Labour that they have deserted half of the country that voted to remain - the function of the opposition must be to oppose and as on so many issues they are AWOL.

I'd like to be governed by Ms Sturgeon and the Scots!!

Off you go then,you really think know wee Jimmy krankie is the answer.....ok

 


always a Norwood boy, where ever I live.

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Flag Croydon 19 Oct 16 2.36pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

In an ADVISORY referendum the government is asking for your opinion that is why the question is 'SHOULD' the country leave or stay? You are advising the government of your opinion that is all in this case.

The govt is not bound to put this into law unlike the previous referendum on the voting system where people voted for no change this was binding on the govt.

Isn't it the case here that the government has no expertise on the EU - dodgy Dave threatening us instead?

Referendums YUK I'm getting a cup of tea.


 

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View Part Time James's Profile Part Time James Flag 19 Oct 16 2.45pm Send a Private Message to Part Time James Add Part Time James as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Ha, agreed. To be fair, and similar to Brexit, I'd do the total opposite of what the dickheads recommended, the dickheads.

Haha! Yes, I take your point in that respect, although not in terms of the analogy any more as I'd like the country to see Brexit through. However, at the same time I don't believe the voters were qualified to vote and that isn't entirely reflective of the voters, but also the utter failures of both campaigns in terms of educational value. It was kind of like asking a blind woman what trousers you look best in. I don't feel like the public are any better educated on the subject now though, there still seems to be more focus on scaremongering and mud-slinging than pragmatism. The economical impacts at the moment are happening during a period of uncertainty which, by definition, could be proved right or wrong.

But it's good fun watching all the gum flapping going on. It reminds me of the whole Blur vs Oasis thing all over again. Very tribal. Lovely.

 




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View Part Time James's Profile Part Time James Flag 19 Oct 16 2.48pm Send a Private Message to Part Time James Add Part Time James as a friend

I should elaborate on my comment. What I mean is, I think if the public were asked again there'd be a swing towards "Remain" now, but not because we know anything we didn't know before. Just that Project Fear now has the handy ammunition of the economical fallout from the original vote which may or may not be genuinely reflective of the resultant post-Brexit economy.

 




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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Flag Croydon 19 Oct 16 5.12pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

Have to admit that when my 2 kids with degrees and careers said what about the referendum I asked what effect leaving would have on their work conditions and I got the blank look that said social chapter what is that?

Educated about Europe we are not and I include the government in that - what do they actually know about negotiating with Europe even knowing what they want.

We have serious problems in the UK that we can get on tackling housing, the union, NHS, debt(as ever) thats enough to do without a protracted battle over years that may get us back to the single market where we are already.

Germany are reducing their immigrant quota by 47% after reverses for Mrs.Merkel in their local elections - it is a German matter.

So why are the UK whining on about sovereignty and immigration? I support immigration myself but it is in the UKs hands and always has been just like Germany.


 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 19 Oct 16 7.08pm

Originally posted by carlonoil

I didn't say that Corbyn has called for another referendum, in fact he has said we should respect the peoples' decision.

Then why did you write Many people clamouring for another referendum are also supporters of the Corbyn led Labour Party.

To me it seems you are equating the two even though they have opposite opinions. What was your point in saying 'Corbyn led'?

Quote

Corbyn released a list of 10 key policies. Along with various Socialist Father Christmas type promises of solving the housing crisis overnight and shoveling yet more billions into the bottomless pit of the NHS, he wants to nationalise the railways and buses, dismantle our defence capability, give free rein to the unions and have no limits on immigration.


Trying to alleviate the housing crisis, what an evil left wing b******. Never mind that he would invest in housebuilding programmes that used builders and services from the communities in which the houses are to be built along with incentives and help for small businesses and entrepreneurs in the same communities to foster job creation and growth = more tax pennies.


Polls have shown that that a significant majority of people in the UK want to see transport services renationalised. Pinko c***s the lot of 'em eh?

Save the national health service rather than running it down in order to persuade the public it's better to hand over the health service to his mates (who live abroad eh Mr Branson) in the private sector and make it a for profit organisation rather than a public service. How f***ing dare he!

Dismantle our defence capability - I'll give you the fact that trident is a top issue that divides opinion, but has Corbyn actually said he will cut the defence budget or has he said the money would be used elsewhere within the auspices of the defence department.

Repealing the trades unions act giving back a bit of power to the unions such as facilitation time (which actually saves a heap of cash) and allowing workers to have a say in what workplaces should be like. hardly free rein - you are using exaggerated, emotive language I feel.

Quote
To fund it all he will somehow 'grow the economy' and increase 'progressive' income tax to 'shrink wealth inequality'.

The last labour government had 47 months of continued growth. Can you explain how the current lot (who have created more levels of debt than every Labour government combined btw) are growing the economy?


What a b****** again for wanting to reduce wealth inequality. What sort of a nasty s*** would want to do that?

Quote
What is also significant of course is (as I have alluded to before) that many of his close associates are even further to the left than him, one an actual Communist Party member and apologist for North Korea - he is tipped as the next Labour Party General Secretary.

I know you haven't actually called Corbyn a communist, but to the left of him is an actual communist party member'. Quick run for the hills, women and children first, someone on the left has very left wing views. There are others on the left that are more what I'd term democratic socialist. How shocking it is to have such a wide range of ideas and ideologies to share within the largest member lead political party in Europe.

Quote
Do you think international businesses, stock market investors and other creators of wealth would want to operate under such an old style socialist regime?


Where did you hear/read that a Corbyn government would be an old style socialist regime? What do you mean by the term? Or are you just using emotio-semantic twaddle again.


Edited by nickgusset (19 Oct 2016 7.09pm)

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 19 Oct 16 7.36pm

Interesting peer reviewed research of the referendum...

Who Voted for Brexit?
A Comprehensive District-Level Analysis

Sascha O. Becker
Thiemo Fetzer
Dennis Novy

October 2016
Abstract
On 23 June 2016, the British electorate voted to leave the European Union.
We analyze vote and turnout shares across 380 local authority areas in the
United Kingdom. We find that fundamental characteristics of the voting
population were key drivers of the Vote Leave share, in particular their
age and education profiles as well as the historical importance of manufac-
turing employment, low income and high unemployment. Migration was
relevant only from Eastern European countries, not from older EU states
or non-EU countries. We also find an important role for fiscal cuts being
associated with Vote Leave. Our results indicate that modest reductions in
fiscal cuts could have swayed the referendum outcome. In contrast, even
drastic changes in immigration patterns would probably not have made a
difference. We confirm the above findings at the much finer level of wards
within cities. Our results cast doubt on the notion that short-term cam-
paigning events had a meaningful influence on the vote.

[Link]

Worth a read, the results point to austerity rather than immigration being one the main reasons for people voting leave.

How accurate this all this is, I don't know, but it gives food for thought.

Edited by nickgusset (19 Oct 2016 7.37pm)

 

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