Boris
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 blackpalacefan  14 Jul 16 7.05am |
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Originally posted by snytaxx
It doesn't really matter what the yanks think right now. I don't agree with Boris's comments about Obama (except that he is a hypocrite), but its not Obama 'we' as a country need to have on side. Alot of people, Brexiteers but especially Remainers need to think longer term. Give it one year and the world may look a lot different. Obama will be gone (for sure), we might even have (the pro-brexit) Trump in power, lord help us all but then you can't deny that won't strengthen the decision to Brexit. Will Merkel still be in power? Maybe, maybe not. President 'lets make an example of the Brits' Hollande is up for election next year which he stands a real chance of losing, the equally hard nosed Italian PM (Renzo?) is looking like falling on his own sword (like Cameron did) with a needlessly called referendum on the powers of Italy's upper house. My point is this. It doesn't really matter what world leaders think of Boris, or even the Brexit decision right now, because the real decisions which will define us won't be made and enacted for another couple of years yet. What is important is sussing out the next generation of world leaders and leaning on them to get a good deal. Don't you agree? It's not the 'right now' I'm overly concerned about either really. His behaviour is very consistent over time. It certainly is all change right now. On that we can agree and that with everything being so changable it's difficult to know what the future holds. I will say that I'm happy May beat Leadsom for PM. Regardless of what people think of her politics it's clear she cares an awful lot about the country and at the moment we need that more than ever.
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| Midlands Eagle 14 Jul 16 7.07am |
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Originally posted by crystal balls
The best thing to come out of all of this is that Osborne has gone! He never achieved one of his targets, the boast of having a surplus by 2020 was dropped immediately after the referendum as it was even less likely to occur than before, so all his austerity counted for little or nothing in the end. And borrowing will still exceed target this year and next! All political careers are said to end in failure, but some much more so than others. Like him or not Osborne has overseen a remarkable transformation of the country's piggy bank from the huge mess that he inherited in 2010 to it's current position as the strong man of Europe and the fifth largest economy in the world. Quite obviously he didn't achieve a lot of what he hoped for by 2020 as he didn't last the distance but his biggest political mistake was misjudging the mood of the country and backing the wrong horse in the referendum in such a way that would make his future untenable if he ended up on the losing side - which he did
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 Hrolf The Ganger 14 Jul 16 8.36am |
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Boris got his reward for stepping aside and it's not much surprise that Osbourne had to go after his laughable Remain scaremongering.
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Kermit8  Hevon 14 Jul 16 9.52am |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Boris got his reward for stepping aside and it's not much surprise that Osbourne had to go after his laughable Remain scaremongering. You don't know the economic truth yet. It's early days. His warnings may turn out to be pretty much correct. Once we Brexit and once costs incurred filter down do you think we will be better off? Will the weekly shop be cheaper? The labour market for agriculture is quite reliant on EU itinerant workers.
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| Lyons550 Shirley 14 Jul 16 10.09am |
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Originally posted by crystal balls
I always thought Boris's aim in life was to have people laugh at him! He's caught a hot potato now, and between him and Davis they have to deliver the impossible re. the EU; get all that the exit-ers want, while keeping Britain's trade going through the uncertainty during negotiations. As Boris didn't really believe most of what he was saying before the referendum we are in for some interesting times ahead. You scurrilous scamp...you know full well that NEVER happens whatever side of the argument is being discussed. I have feeling that as long as Migration is controlled that most Brexiteers will be more than happy...
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| crystal balls The Garden of Earthly Delights 14 Jul 16 10.11am |
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Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
Like him or not Osborne has overseen a remarkable transformation of the country's piggy bank from the huge mess that he inherited in 2010 to it's current position as the strong man of Europe and the fifth largest economy in the world. Quite obviously he didn't achieve a lot of what he hoped for by 2020 as he didn't last the distance but his biggest political mistake was misjudging the mood of the country and backing the wrong horse in the referendum in such a way that would make his future untenable if he ended up on the losing side - which he did Debt doubled on his watch, there was no transformation at all; the UK was the fifth largest economy in the world when he took over; it seems to have just fallen to sixth. He didn't hit a single borrowing target. He has lost the AAA credit rating he so fetishised early on, it's now fallen two notches. As I say, a failure! It didn't matter so much that he supported remain as to his future, rather that once Cameron was off there was no way any new PM, be it Boris, Gove or May who would've retained his services. If remain had won and Cameron stayed for another two years it's inconceivable that Osborne would've outlasted his mate.
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| Lyons550 Shirley 14 Jul 16 10.11am |
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Originally posted by Rudi Hedman
Apart from a few hundred million £ saved and as a result less interest on top of the compound interest that's causing the debt to keep rising. But I agree with you when people look back. Osborne will be remembered for wearing hi-viz jackets and hard hats, being more than a bit of a dork and being booed at the 2012 Olympics. May should hire his family company to provide the wallpaper for number 10, only if George comes with the samples. ...and being a pretty s*** bricklayer...
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 14 Jul 16 10.30am |
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Originally posted by crystal balls
Debt doubled on his watch, there was no transformation at all; the UK was the fifth largest economy in the world when he took over; it seems to have just fallen to sixth. He didn't hit a single borrowing target. He has lost the AAA credit rating he so fetishised early on, it's now fallen two notches. As I say, a failure! It didn't matter so much that he supported remain as to his future, rather that once Cameron was off there was no way any new PM, be it Boris, Gove or May who would've retained his services. If remain had won and Cameron stayed for another two years it's inconceivable that Osborne would've outlasted his mate. Rolex? Debt doubling is what happens when £1 in every £4 spent is borrowed. And money is borrowed to pay the interest on the borrowing. A debt spiral is very difficult to stop when society relies on the spending. I'm no Osborne fan but fair's fair. As Midlands Eagle says, it's the way Osborne backed the wrong horse. The way they went OTT on the scare stories. WWIII, emergency budgets for example. When is the emergency budget anyway? I'm not sure on your last comment. He may have outlasted Cameron even if just for a year or 3. Cameron would've probably gone in 2019 and the election would've been in 2020. Who knows.
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| crystal balls The Garden of Earthly Delights 14 Jul 16 10.31am |
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Originally posted by Lyons550
You scurrilous scamp...you know full well that NEVER happens whatever side of the argument is being discussed. I have feeling that as long as Migration is controlled that most Brexiteers will be more than happy... Well good luck with that! I suppose it depends what you mean by "control"; bring it down to Dave's "tens of thousands"? Some exit-ers want no immigration at all, some even want repatriation! As the majority of immigration was from outside the EU leaving will have no effect on those, it will take an entirely different approach to ALL immigrants to make any meaningful reduction. And what then for the NHS, care services, catering, hotels, agriculture? Who do you let in and who do you refuse? Refugees? What controls would appease you? Interesting negotiations ahead, I've a feeling the exit-ers are due for a heady helping of cold reality!
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| topcat Holmesdale / Surbiton 14 Jul 16 10.31am |
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Originally posted by Willo
Osborne was not sacked.He resigned from the Government. Of course he resigned. Just like Gove resigned too. Just before they were sacked.
It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark... and we're wearing sunglasses. |
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| OknotOK Cockfosters, London 14 Jul 16 10.33am |
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Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
Like him or not Osborne has overseen a remarkable transformation of the country's piggy bank from the huge mess that he inherited in 2010 to it's current position as the strong man of Europe and the fifth largest economy in the world. Quite obviously he didn't achieve a lot of what he hoped for by 2020 as he didn't last the distance but his biggest political mistake was misjudging the mood of the country and backing the wrong horse in the referendum in such a way that would make his future untenable if he ended up on the losing side - which he did Be interested to know your criteria for strong man of Europe: - Increased position in global economy X (already 5th largest) You could go on and on. The only measure that he can really claim success on is employment, which has not resulted in required increase in GDP because productivity has dropped, but which rightly should be applauded. Edited by OknotOK (14 Jul 2016 10.35am)
"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show |
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 14 Jul 16 10.34am |
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Originally posted by crystal balls
I have no doubt that Boris will be expected to take a full role in EU negotiations; it's a task that will require full Foreign Office involvement, and will be a bit too much for Davis alone, I feel.
Do you still believe this after about every single one of at least 40 odd commentators 12 hours have said Davis will most likely have Theresa May with him whenever needing someone in serious meetings? You're possibly right on May wanting him kept within but also afar from her. I wouldn't say "Friends close but enemies closer" but more on a leash/under control.
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