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Liberal Left that ruled Britain is being destroyed

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View Superfly's Profile Superfly Flag The sun always shines in Catford 23 Sep 16 2.46pm Send a Private Message to Superfly Add Superfly as a friend

Originally posted by Sportyteacher

Don't bother voting then as when I conscientiously (for the love of my family's future) bother to care and ask serious questions, I tend to receive insightful responses....however such substance is ALTOGETHER different from politically biased tabloids whose owners skimp upon corporate tax courtesy of ...our Govt!

He doesn't 'get' the references to bandanas.

Do you feel silly now?

 


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banbandanas Flag Birmingham 23 Sep 16 3.12pm

Originally posted by Superfly

He doesn't 'get' the references to bandanas.

Do you feel silly now?

Nothing to be ashamed about, the bandana issue is complex.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 23 Sep 16 3.32pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

So rather than ruled, the term pervasive ideas among the populace. I quite agree, ideas are definitely prevalent and rise and fall in popularity within society.

Personally I find the hyperbole of political correctness gone mad just as annoying as people who throw out racist as a means of engaging in an actual debate. Its the new 'shouting fascist' at anyone who is right wing.

I think there is a case for saying that the use of political correctness has probably run its course, now that its become adopted as a means of 'shouting down' rather than opening up discourse.

Of course, the term liberal left does really just mean anything that isn't right wing. Following that American trend of the idea that somehow being liberal on an issue (i.e. open to right and left wing arguments towards a pragmatic solution) is somehow a bad thing.

Actually it is a reaction to shouting "racist". It is the backlash. So is Donald Trump, UKIP, Le Pen et al.
It is what happens when politics swing in a irrational and extreme direction. You have to have a counter.
People are also beginning to realise the cynical, deliberate side to all this so called political correctness.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 23 Sep 16 3.55pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Actually it is a reaction to shouting "racist". It is the backlash. So is Donald Trump, UKIP, Le Pen et al.
It is what happens when politics swing in a irrational and extreme direction. You have to have a counter.
People are also beginning to realise the cynical, deliberate side to all this so called political correctness.

I'm not sure about that one, but I get what you mean. Of course, the less cynical side of political correctness is that of people couching their prejudices in more acceptable colours.

Of course on the other side you do have people effectively objecting to political correctness for calling them on their racism, homophobic mysognist s**t

 


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Hoof Hearted 23 Sep 16 3.58pm

Originally posted by banbandanas

Didn't have you down as a bandana-wearer Hoof?

No but I rate Eric Bana as an actor.... Troy, Chopper.... great films.

 

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Hoof Hearted 23 Sep 16 4.00pm

Originally posted by banbandanas

Nothing to be ashamed about, the bandana issue is complex.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 24 Sep 16 11.30am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I'm not sure about that one, but I get what you mean. Of course, the less cynical side of political correctness is that of people couching their prejudices in more acceptable colours.

Of course on the other side you do have people effectively objecting to political correctness for calling them on their racism, homophobic mysognist s**t


Well you can argue that stuff back and forth all day but the issue that matters to most people is immigration and the fact is that the so called liberal left attitude is to deny certain realities to perpetuate the idea that the majority believe in multiculturalism and see it as a positive thing when in fact the opposite us largely true. Multiculturalism will not work all the time human beings cling on to their absurd tribalism and religious dogma. In other words it will never work in the foreseeable future. The trend is to bury all negativity along with their heads in the sand and those that do that for reasons of personal morality or philosophy are being manipulated by those self interested parties who have far more selfish objectives.

 

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View palace_in_frogland's Profile palace_in_frogland Flag In a broken dream 24 Sep 16 12.17pm Send a Private Message to palace_in_frogland Add palace_in_frogland as a friend

Originally posted by banbandanas

Nothing to be ashamed about, the bandana issue is complex.

Oh come now, it's just a soft nutritious fruit wrapped up in a yellow skin. It ain't rocket science...

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 24 Sep 16 3.06pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger


Well you can argue that stuff back and forth all day but the issue that matters to most people is immigration and the fact is that the so called liberal left attitude is to deny certain realities to perpetuate the idea that the majority believe in multiculturalism and see it as a positive thing when in fact the opposite us largely true. Multiculturalism will not work all the time human beings cling on to their absurd tribalism and religious dogma. In other words it will never work in the foreseeable future. The trend is to bury all negativity along with their heads in the sand and those that do that for reasons of personal morality or philosophy are being manipulated by those self interested parties who have far more selfish objectives.

I think its a bit more complex, as the definition of the 'success of multiculturalism' as a concept is defined by different groups according to their 'agenda'. For me, I'd say the UK is fairly multicultural in that it consists of all manner of different cultures, that for the most part get along, function within society and without conflict.

The problem of the most 'militant' multiculturalist movments is that they seem to expect instant change, rather than graduated change and integration, and in pursuing this approach, create greater dissonance by embracing an ideology, over pragmatism - usually by dismissing critical analysis of cultural conflicts rather than focusing on resolution of the conflicts.

People who think multiculturalism as a perfect functioning merge are misguided - Cultures by the definition exist in conflict with other cultural views and perceptions. And in targeting specific ideals alienate other cultural groups.

A good example of this can be seen in how 'indiscriminately dismissing any criticism of Islam as Islamaphobia, those with reasonable criticisms that need to be addressed in social discourse are by default allied to those which are the product of those that are unfounded, or more cynically the produce of prejudice - and its these kinds of groups like EDL, British first that benefit, because the exclusion of the reasonable disenters and critics by default allies them to less reasonable arguments.

Which ironically, is exactly what political correctness as a means of social engineering was devised to prevent.

 


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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 24 Sep 16 3.52pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I think its a bit more complex, as the definition of the 'success of multiculturalism' as a concept is defined by different groups according to their 'agenda'. For me, I'd say the UK is fairly multicultural in that it consists of all manner of different cultures, that for the most part get along, function within society and without conflict.

The problem of the most 'militant' multiculturalist movments is that they seem to expect instant change, rather than graduated change and integration, and in pursuing this approach, create greater dissonance by embracing an ideology, over pragmatism - usually by dismissing critical analysis of cultural conflicts rather than focusing on resolution of the conflicts.

People who think multiculturalism as a perfect functioning merge are misguided - Cultures by the definition exist in conflict with other cultural views and perceptions. And in targeting specific ideals alienate other cultural groups.

A good example of this can be seen in how 'indiscriminately dismissing any criticism of Islam as Islamaphobia, those with reasonable criticisms that need to be addressed in social discourse are by default allied to those which are the product of those that are unfounded, or more cynically the produce of prejudice - and its these kinds of groups like EDL, British first that benefit, because the exclusion of the reasonable disenters and critics by default allies them to less reasonable arguments.

Which ironically, is exactly what political correctness as a means of social engineering was devised to prevent.


All very reasonable.

The "success" of multicultural should be measured in my view by how it effects the majority. What we see is the pressure toward a multicultural society working against the majority and against opinion.
It is true that a significant number of immigrants fit comfortably into our society but they are not the issue. It is those that don't for a number of reasons.
The biggest criticism I have of "liberalism" is that it tries to ignore or airbrush these issues to suit it's agenda. I also find it a very perverse example of human nature that some "liberals" actually seem to favour people of other cultures and persuasions over there own. It's as if this has become a crusade that overwhelms their own interests in a similar way to Stockholm syndrome. Now their might be some bigger picture here as to why nature inflicts such an attitude on some people but since they are in the minority it must say something more about them and their circumstances than it does about the population as a whole.

 

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banbandanas Flag Birmingham 24 Sep 16 7.10pm

Originally posted by palace_in_frogland

Oh come now, it's just a soft nutritious fruit wrapped up in a yellow skin. It ain't rocket science...

Slippery

 

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 24 Sep 16 8.18pm Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger


All very reasonable.

The "success" of multicultural should be measured in my view by how it effects the majority. What we see is the pressure toward a multicultural society working against the majority and against opinion.
It is true that a significant number of immigrants fit comfortably into our society but they are not the issue. It is those that don't for a number of reasons.
The biggest criticism I have of "liberalism" is that it tries to ignore or airbrush these issues to suit it's agenda. I also find it a very perverse example of human nature that some "liberals" actually seem to favour people of other cultures and persuasions over there own. It's as if this has become a crusade that overwhelms their own interests in a similar way to Stockholm syndrome. Now their might be some bigger picture here as to why nature inflicts such an attitude on some people but since they are in the minority it must say something more about them and their circumstances than it does about the population as a whole.

Their own what? Culture?

I much prefer some of the foreigners i have met and have more in common with to the, for example, British bigots and Little Englanders, but don't prefer them over the decent, warm and nice people who also happen to be British.

Why are 'liberal lefties' or anyone for that matter expected to put "their own" first if an individual or a particular group of 'their own' are cvnts of the highest order but just happen to have the same birthplace? Culturally they would be very different too.


Edited by Kermit8 (24 Sep 2016 8.32pm)

 


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