You are here: Home > Message Board > Palace Talk > Substituting Cabaye against Arsenal kills the team
April 25 2024 11.05pm

Substituting Cabaye against Arsenal kills the team

Previous Topic | Next Topic


Page 5 of 7 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 >

 

View Tim Gypsy Hill '64's Profile Tim Gypsy Hill '64 Flag Stoke sub normal 01 Jan 17 9.44pm Send a Private Message to Tim Gypsy Hill '64 Add Tim Gypsy Hill '64 as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Mutch is getting game time to get a sale done. Shop window and all that.

At least I hope that's why.

Well, if that's the case, his value dropped today.

 


Systematically dragged down by the lawmakers

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View Kieranemm's Profile Kieranemm Flag Towcester 01 Jan 17 10.14pm Send a Private Message to Kieranemm Add Kieranemm as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo

GK: Vorm, Ruffier, Ochoa, M'bolhi (but not necessarily Palace's weak spot as Mandanda is world class)

RB: Weiser, Janmaat, Figueiras, Layun, Yedlin, Smolnikov, A. Vidal, Esgaio

CB: Ginter, Mbemba, Federico Fernandez, Caceres, Papadopoulos, Cristian Zapata, Abdennour (would cost more than 10 mil, but is behind Mangala and Garay at Valencia and they might sell), M. Sakho, Rakitsky, Nkoulou, Bastos, Kabasele

LB: Gibs, Rausch, Brady, Ali Adnan, Plattenhardt, Antonelli, Coentrao, C. Erkin, A. Moreno, Augustinsson, L. Ibanez, Jefferson

DM/ CM: Pascal Gross, Hiljemark, Giaccherini, M. Fernandez, Onazi, Jozabed, H. Herrera, van Ginkel, Rupp, Rode, Bertolacci, Poli, B. Cesar (Benfica, also qualifies as left back and left wing), Muntari, Koziello, de Guzman, R. Pardo

Right footed winger: Depay, Hermann, Deulofeu, Njie, Mina, Canos, M. Niang (Milan want to sell for disciplinary reasons), Ntep, Susaeta, Samperio, Khazri, Younes (Ajax), Carillo, Carlos Mane , Ola John (but you'll just go "what? he's in the Championship playing for a bad team and injured", A. Bueno

Left footed winger: Ben Arfa, P. Sarabia, I. Falque, G. Tore, Kishna, Refaelov, Toral, Didavi, M. Gonzalez, C. Vela, Rebic, H. Costa, Alessandrini, Melgarejo, Ozbiliz, Raphina (not the Barcelona one, the one playing in Portugal), Cornet, Cartabia, Cheryshev, J. Murphy (Norwich- they play the right footed twin but not the left footed one, who is, in my opinion, even better), Atsu, R. Alvarez, Berghuis, Hernani, Medeiros, Quintero

Second striker: El Shaarawy, Stindl, Junuzovic, E. Vargas, Marega, Niasse (Everton want him out for disciplinary reasons), S. Long, Iturbe, Taison, Vydra, L. Vibe, Afobe, Dicko, Araujo

Striker: N. Petersen, D. Zapata, Muriel, P. Cisse, O. Martins, D. Pabon, Ighalo, Gestede, A. Ramos, Locadia, Karelis, Emenike, G. Hooper, Enrich, Baston, Aggiretxe

All of the above either don't play as starters anymore or play as starters in teams that have problems and are willing to sell for a fee less that what they would deserve. All of the above are accomplished to a level. Now I can't compare a rising sensation like Santi Mina of Valencia with Hermann of Moenchengladbach. But Santi Mina has scored and assisted 18 times in his last 3.300 minutes in La Liga. That's promising.
You will say that even Derby wants Vydra out because he doesn't score and that Ben Arfa has been in the Premier League and hasn't confirmed and neither had Iturbe.

Then I'd have to make a long post about how Vydra scored and assisted 29 in the 12/13 Championship edition and 23 times in the 14/15 Championship edition. He's just going through a tough period and, notice, he's not that high on the list, but his assets like pressing and recovering put him there.
Then, I'd have to explain how Iturbe only played 50 minutes in the Premier League and that if you don't give someone time then you can't judge that player.

And I'd have to tell you that Ben Arfa scored and assisted 27 times in 4.900 minutes and that is better than most attacking midfielders who play in mid-table if not high-ranking teams and he is in no way a Newcastle flop even though pundits have characterized him as such. And last year he almost took Nice to first place in France after Newcastle tossed him away. And this year Unay Emery will also throw him away. He was a free transfer so I doubt they'd be asking for much. At the amounts they have, they probably don't even care for 2-3 millions and would let him go on a free if someone would just support his wages.


And all this is disregarding the players who would cost around 15-20 millions, but would most probably decline to come to Palace, like Aurier, Gonzalo Castro, Matuidi, Ward Prowse, Robben, Tadic, Ghezal, Immobile, Bas Dost.


And here I wasted 10 minutes of my time to write this for some unfaithful who won't even understand what I'm talking about.......

Little is your faith people! I know all this and much more, but if I don't have the audience to discuss.......why bother?

Edited by mattteo (01 Jan 2017 7.29pm)

Edited by mattteo (01 Jan 2017 7.30pm)

Edited by mattteo (01 Jan 2017 7.32pm)

Out of this list of players, which three would you try to get to slot into our squad then?

I don't know every player on this list, some however don't seem to meet your criteria of under 10m in today's market and some are on ridiculous contracts in China.

Thanks in advance for your wisdom.

Out of your list 3 I would take but doubt teams would release are Kieran Gibbs from Arsenal (Loan to Permanent), M Sakho from Liverpool (Loan - would not get for 10m even if he is not wanted there, as they would get bigger offers, plus he rejected a loan move to Stoke in summer, so may think Palace being in a relegation dog fight is below him) and Shane Long from Southampton (won't happen for under 10m, and they won't sell as have a striker shortage with Austin out injured)

Edited by Kieranemm (01 Jan 2017 10.23pm)

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View girvinator's Profile girvinator Flag Poole 02 Jan 17 1.50am Send a Private Message to girvinator Add girvinator as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo


He's been in English football for the past 20 years.

If he doesn't know all players in the first 3 leagues by the middle name and all their qualities, then he's no manager. Even I know all the players in the Premier League and the Championship and what foot they kick the ball with.

Why hire him and pay him millions if he doesn't know anything? You just wait for him to learn? Jeez, you could have gotten my 7 year old son and paid him waiting for him to learn

I meant more knowing all the staff, everyone at the club, getting to know the facilities we have etc. imagine you switching jobs in whatever line of work you do. It's going to take time for him to adapt and put his stamp on the team.

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View bexleydave's Profile bexleydave Flag Barnehurst 02 Jan 17 8.18am Send a Private Message to bexleydave Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add bexleydave as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo

He's been in English football for the past 20 years.

If he doesn't know all players in the first 3 leagues by the middle name and all their qualities, then he's no manager. Even I know all the players in the Premier League and the Championship and what foot they kick the ball with.

Why hire him and pay him millions if he doesn't know anything? You just wait for him to learn? Jeez, you could have gotten my 7 year old son and paid him waiting for him to learn

I think you need to get a girlfriend and get out more

 


Bexley Dave

Can you hear the Brighton sing? I can't hear a ******* thing!

"The most arrogant, obnoxious bunch of deluded little sun tanned, loafer wearing mummy's boys I've ever had the misfortune of having to listen to" (Burnley forum)

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 02 Jan 17 8.35am Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo


He's been in English football for the past 20 years.

If he doesn't know all players in the first 3 leagues by the middle name and all their qualities, then he's no manager. Even I know all the players in the Premier League and the Championship and what foot they kick the ball with.

Why hire him and pay him millions if he doesn't know anything? You just wait for him to learn? Jeez, you could have gotten my 7 year old son and paid him waiting for him to learn

I have been speaking to people connected with professional football before and after the Allardyce appointment. They were unanimous in saying that if you need to extricate yourself from a relegation scrap then the two managers you need are Allardyce and Pulis !

It would appear that Swansea are to appoint Paul Clement.What would our supporters have said if we appointed him ? I don't think he did as bad at Derby as is being made out and was a tad unlucky to lose his job but HOL would be awash with "Limited experience", "Never managed a PL team" etc etc.


Edited by Willo (02 Jan 2017 8.41am)

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View aashman12's Profile aashman12 Flag 02 Jan 17 10.02am Send a Private Message to aashman12 Add aashman12 as a friend

Originally posted by Tim Gypsy Hill '64

If Pardew had done that, you would have called him something quite nasty.

Oh pipe down. Pards has gone. Let it be and see what big sam does. They were sensible subs given our squad and fixtures.

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View aashman12's Profile aashman12 Flag 02 Jan 17 10.04am Send a Private Message to aashman12 Add aashman12 as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Mutch is getting game time to get a sale done. Shop window and all that.

At least I hope that's why.

Mutch got game time because he's one of our only fit midfielders. Simple as. Cabaye needed resting, mutch is a cm.

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View the silurian's Profile the silurian Flag The garden of England.(not really) 02 Jan 17 10.19am Send a Private Message to the silurian Add the silurian as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo

This manager should be freakin' crucified (well, figuratively, of course)

He's worse than the last one. Didn't chabge a thing, still playing with Kelly and Ward (a right footed player) as wingbacks.

Townsend and Cabaye were amazing against Arsenal up to this minute (well, amazing for Palace's level). They're the ones who have run the most and covered the most ground. They can absolutely press and compete at this level. Cabaye in the center is essential. Benteke wouldn't press if Cabaye wouldn't give him the impulse.

You just can't, absolutely CAN'T, substitute one of those players when the team is pushing for agoal and getting back into the game.

Townsend amazing??? What game were you watching? The bloke is a waste of space, probably the worst 10 million we've ever spent

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View DANGERCLOSE's Profile DANGERCLOSE Flag london 02 Jan 17 10.24am Send a Private Message to DANGERCLOSE Add DANGERCLOSE as a friend

Originally posted by steven_t92

Lol joke thread again. Townsend was awful again and Cabaye was taken off to rest for the Swansea game. We were never going to beat arsenal so try to be a bit more realistic.

Regarding the full backs, we don't hAve any others so it's Kelly and ward or no one.

Agreed

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View NEILLO's Profile NEILLO Flag Shoreham-by-Sea 02 Jan 17 10.25am Send a Private Message to NEILLO Add NEILLO as a friend

Originally posted by Tim Gypsy Hill '64

He's not saying sell them all, but improve the team/squad. If you think we have a good enough squad, why didn't we win today? New manager *bounce* and all that? It hasn't worked! Our players are not good enough, as a complete team, whoever manages. We have better players with injuries, but we need a better squad.

They played better football under Pardew than today. Absolutely shocking today.

In the same way that Burley played '' better football '' than the defensive game that Dougie introduced. You know, that defensive football that saved us from certain relegation that season.

 


Old, Ungifted and White

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View NEILLO's Profile NEILLO Flag Shoreham-by-Sea 02 Jan 17 10.35am Send a Private Message to NEILLO Add NEILLO as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo

This manager should be freakin' crucified (well, figuratively, of course)

He's worse than the last one. Didn't chabge a thing, still playing with Kelly and Ward (a right footed player) as wingbacks.

Townsend and Cabaye were amazing against Arsenal up to this minute (well, amazing for Palace's level). They're the ones who have run the most and covered the most ground. They can absolutely press and compete at this level. Cabaye in the center is essential. Benteke wouldn't press if Cabaye wouldn't give him the impulse.

You just can't, absolutely CAN'T, substitute one of those players when the team is pushing for agoal and getting back into the game.

I respect your opinion but share none of it.

What is your solution to the full back problem ? Select Fryers ?? I'm interested in hearing it.

Townsend was not '' amazing '' nor was Cabaye. I've actually seen Townsend play worse than that, but still.....Cabaye has the class to play at the highest level, but I don't think him and Punch in the same team works.

As for the substitutions, we have an important game tomorrow night which looks like a ' six pointer ', with minimum recovery time. I think Sam did the right thing. Arsenal were coasting at that point, but I'm sure that had we nicked a goal back, they had several more gears to go up if they wanted to.

I think you clearly have an issue with BFS - well that's your problem. I don't care who the manager is, I want the club to stay in the PL. Under Pardew that looked increasingly unlikely.

 


Old, Ungifted and White

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply
View mattteo's Profile mattteo Flag 02 Jan 17 10.56am Send a Private Message to mattteo Add mattteo as a friend

Originally posted by Kieranemm

Out of this list of players, which three would you try to get to slot into our squad then?

I don't know every player on this list, some however don't seem to meet your criteria of under 10m in today's market and some are on ridiculous contracts in China.

Thanks in advance for your wisdom.

Out of your list 3 I would take but doubt teams would release are Kieran Gibbs from Arsenal (Loan to Permanent), M Sakho from Liverpool (Loan - would not get for 10m even if he is not wanted there, as they would get bigger offers, plus he rejected a loan move to Stoke in summer, so may think Palace being in a relegation dog fight is below him) and Shane Long from Southampton (won't happen for under 10m, and they won't sell as have a striker shortage with Austin out injured)

Edited by Kieranemm (01 Jan 2017 10.23pm)

Out of the 130+ players I gave as example, only a few would cost a little more than 10 million: Ginter, Abdennour, Gibbs, Hector Herrera (cause Porto ALWAYS sells expensive), Depay, Hermann, Susaeta, Shane Long (only because of the striker shortage you mentioned, else he would have been packing, Puel has been a dick to him) and MAYBE El Shaarawy.

Even Milan gets to take Deulofeu on loan with an option to buy. And Italian clubs are known not to be serious. They always take players on loan and then they don't pay the fee. And in today's football, Crystal Palace (or any Premier League team for that matter) is much more financially potent than Milan. Or, as recent sources say, it's going to be a "dry loan", but in 6 months things will change sooo much and he will be so forgotten at Everton that they're going to let him off for half what they're asking today. That's how time works: it makes people forget.
And Delofeu is just an example. Another one you mentioned is Sakho. He'll definitely cost less than 10 million. He hasn't played since June. He was in a different position in the summer when he refused Stoke. Again: time.


Regarding your question, "who would I buy?", let me just say who I'd keep first.

The gks are fine (Mandanda and Hennesey) so I wouldn't go there, except maybe to take M'bolhi as a third choice, cause he only costs 500.000 and he's playing in Turkey. He was fantastic fr Algeria 3 years ago when they qualified for the World Cup.

The fullbacks all have to go, maybe just keep 1 as right back between Ward and Lee, who is going to be a substitute anyway. I'd rather keep Lee cause Ward has no future prospect, but he's an actual right back, while Lee would be an attempt at reconversion. Pape Souare out (I never liked his playing, even though some teams would pay money for him), I haven't seen Fryers enough, but he should be out too.

Among the center backs, Dann and Tomkins should stay. Delaney can't cut it anymore. He's too old. Thank you and good bye.

There are 2 players in the defensive midfielder- somewhat box-to-box position: McArthur (who's been on fire this season) and Ledley. One real box-to-box: Cabaye, one good playmaker who also runs (as much as he can and age lets him): Puncheon.

On the wings Zaha and Townsend are good. Bakary Sakho is not a bad left footed, but maybe he needs a change and Palace actually needs someone better than Townsend there as a starter.


Up front there's Benteke, who is PL mid table material. I also very much like Remy and I think he'll be amazing. He was great at Newcastle, QPR and Marseille and a starter in a good France national team. Chelsea didn't pay 13 million for him for nothing. He just needs to recover from the injury. And now the bombm: I wouldn't keep Connor Wichkam. I think Palace can get SOME money out of selling him now, his value will only decrease, he'll never be the next Teddy Sheringham, not even an Andy Carrol. He's a good, average player, but not PL material.

So, let's see what we need:

....................Mandanda
....................Hennessey

?..............Dann............?...................?
Ward/ Lee........?..........Tomkins................?
....................................................
....................................................
Zaha..........McArthur......Puncheon...............?
?..............Ledley..........?............Townsend
...................................................
.............................Cabaye................
................................?..................
.................Benteke...........................
..................Remy.............................


So, let's say I have a transfer budget of 30 million (maybe it's a lot, but I'm not saying that all this should be done this winter, IT CAN BE DONE IN 2 WINDOWS: NOW + IN THE SUMMER). From the list I gave above, I can take 1 player worth around 10 million, about 2 players worth around 5 million, 4 players worth around 2,5 million and 1 player on a free. (to respect my budget of 30 million).

I'd definitely go for El Shaarawy, as I like him a lot. Bu then again, there's Cabaye there who is PL starter material. Getting El Shaarawy would mean starting him and putting Cabaye instead of Puncheon in the first 11. Could work, but it's tricky and would need more consideration.

From the above, the team would need a starting CB, a starting LB and a starting LW. Maybe Tomkins and Townsend are actually ok starters for a mid table team, but a starting LB is a must! So that's where the 10 million player should be. You could get Plattenhardt from Hertha who hasn't been capped for Germany despite fully deserving it in the last 2 years. This has kept his value rather low. You could get Robbie Brady, Antonelli from Milan, Augustinsson (who has proven himself with Copenhagen and steps into the shoes of Wendt and Bengtsson who have made the move to a bigger team before him), you could get Alberto Moreno (who was really good at Sevilla before coming to Liverpool, a Europa League winner and left back sensation, he's been over criticized at Liverpool) or even Gibbs (those last 2 are a big maybe at 10 million, I agree). But then again....Coentrao is on a free, Rausch is available for...what?...3 million? I'd take him ANY day.

So, the manager might not even spend the most money on a left back. It's all about how you juggle it, the players you convince, what positions you need to fill.

Edited by mattteo (02 Jan 2017 10.59am)

Edited by mattteo (02 Jan 2017 11.00am)

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post Quote this post in a reply

 

Page 5 of 7 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 >

Previous Topic | Next Topic

You are here: Home > Message Board > Palace Talk > Substituting Cabaye against Arsenal kills the team