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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 22 Feb 17 12.04pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I think its more a Fascist Utopia, by its construction - given that the people serve for the purpose of the state, rather than vice versa.

As you can see, I am no longer in a position to respond.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 22 Feb 17 12.11pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by legaleagle

Aldous Huxley had some thoughts on this in "The Doors of Perception" and I'm not sure the author of that very perceptive book "Brave New World" (for me even more on the ball than 1984)can automatically be dismissed as a complete nutter.

Doors of Perception was about drugs as I recall.

Recent speculation about the brain is how it might function on the sub atomic level. Does consciousness itself have the capacity to exist beyond the confines of the physical brain?
I am a bit skeptical about this kind of stuff but it is interesting.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 22 Feb 17 12.54pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Doors of Perception was about drugs as I recall.

Recent speculation about the brain is how it might function on the sub atomic level. Does consciousness itself have the capacity to exist beyond the confines of the physical brain?
I am a bit skeptical about this kind of stuff but it is interesting.

Yes, its accounts of Huxley's experience with psychedelics. I think it depends on what we mean by consciousness. Generally I'm sceptical about anything that's explicit statements of truth. However, I wouldn't preclude the idea of some element consciousness existing in some form after death, just that if it does, its not in some simplistic and easily understandable manner.

After all, to some extent humans exist in a universe with many dimensions, and everything in that universe exists across all of those dimensions, its just that their forms change. Space Time, the limitations of physical form, are only the fourth dimension.

So why not, maybe our consciousness exists across all dimensions? Everything else in the universe does.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 22 Feb 17 1.00pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Not sure I fully understand it.

There are certainly strange examples of inspiration from visions,for example,
Srinivasa Ramanujan(an Indian mathematician)credits his mathematical findings to the Goddess of Namagiri. According to Ramanujan, she appeared in his visions, proposing him mathematical formulae which Ramanujan would then have to verify. One such event was described by him as follows:
"While asleep, I had an unusual experience. There was a red screen formed by flowing blood, as it were. I was observing it. Suddenly a hand began to write on the screen. I became all attention. That hand wrote a number of elliptic integrals. They stuck to my mind. As soon as I woke up, I committed them to writing."

All his formulas have subsequently been shown to be valid.

There is an interesting phenomena in the creation of new super crystals. It can take years to create a new super crystal but once its been done, it becomes remarkably easier. Even if there are no changes to the process.

Similarly, mice of a species, respond quicker in maze tests, which their species has been exposed to, but that they haven't been exposed to

Although both these examples have rightly been criticised, and are not always consistent.

There is a case, at least to ponder like some of the interesting 'parapsychological phenomena' which as it turned out, wasn't in fact paranormal, but revolutionised modern Neurological understanding.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 22 Feb 17 1.03pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Yes, its accounts of Huxley's experience with psychedelics. I think it depends on what we mean by consciousness. Generally I'm sceptical about anything that's explicit statements of truth. However, I wouldn't preclude the idea of some element consciousness existing in some form after death, just that if it does, its not in some simplistic and easily understandable manner.

After all, to some extent humans exist in a universe with many dimensions, and everything in that universe exists across all of those dimensions, its just that their forms change. Space Time, the limitations of physical form, are only the fourth dimension.

So why not, maybe our consciousness exists across all dimensions? Everything else in the universe does.

But you do realise that this could open the door for an afterlife?
I want to thrash myself with a copy of The Blind Watchmaker for even entertaining the idea.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 22 Feb 17 1.07pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

There is an interesting phenomena in the creation of new super crystals. It can take years to create a new super crystal but once its been done, it becomes remarkably easier. Even if there are no changes to the process.

Similarly, mice of a species, respond quicker in maze tests, which their species has been exposed to, but that they haven't been exposed to

Although both these examples have rightly been criticised, and are not always consistent.

There is a case, at least to ponder like some of the interesting 'parapsychological phenomena' which as it turned out, wasn't in fact paranormal, but revolutionised modern Neurological understanding.

I suspect that we are scratching the surface.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 22 Feb 17 2.37pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

But you do realise that this could open the door for an afterlife?
I want to thrash myself with a copy of The Blind Watchmaker for even entertaining the idea.

Hahahaha, I know exactly what you mean. I think its ok, if you don't subscribe to the idea, so much as accepting the possibility though. Being sceptical should allow room for the possible. I think its probably nothing, but I hope to be proven wrong.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 22 Feb 17 2.42pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I suspect that we are scratching the surface.

Once we stepped out of the idea of seeing the universe as something separate from us, and instead seeing the universe as something we an inextricable part of, both on a Newtonian and Quantum scale, the weird starts to get scientific, especially on the quantum scale.

I used to know this Maths student at University, who was doing her PhD in topological geometry (that's how shapes distort and change across dimensions to us laymen). Even most of the maths lecturers couldn't understand what she was talking about, let alone doing.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 22 Feb 17 2.57pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Once we stepped out of the idea of seeing the universe as something separate from us, and instead seeing the universe as something we an inextricable part of, both on a Newtonian and Quantum scale, the weird starts to get scientific, especially on the quantum scale.

I used to know this Maths student at University, who was doing her PhD in topological geometry (that's how shapes distort and change across dimensions to us laymen). Even most of the maths lecturers couldn't understand what she was talking about, let alone doing.


I'm not that sure that is inherently a useful thing. As Einstein himself said, 'If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself'.

Though with general relativity....I think he knew some very smart six year olds.


Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Feb 2017 2.58pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 22 Feb 17 3.09pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Once we stepped out of the idea of seeing the universe as something separate from us, and instead seeing the universe as something we an inextricable part of, both on a Newtonian and Quantum scale, the weird starts to get scientific, especially on the quantum scale.

I used to know this Maths student at University, who was doing her PhD in topological geometry (that's how shapes distort and change across dimensions to us laymen). Even most of the maths lecturers couldn't understand what she was talking about, let alone doing.

Current science is in a bit of a crisis. Theoretical physics is so far beyond what can be measured that it is verging on religion.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 23 Feb 17 7.37am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Current science is in a bit of a crisis. Theoretical physics is so far beyond what can be measured that it is verging on religion.

I agree to a certain extent but as I'm sure you agree that a big difference is that theoretical physics can be changed by evidence and religion can not.

Also, I'm looking forward to the day when more religious people are willing to describe what they believe as 'theoretical religion'.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Feb 2017 7.37am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View matt_himself's Profile matt_himself Flag Matataland 23 Feb 17 8.12am Send a Private Message to matt_himself Add matt_himself as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I agree to a certain extent but as I'm sure you agree that a big difference is that theoretical physics can be changed by evidence and religion can not.

Also, I'm looking forward to the day when more religious people are willing to describe what they believe as 'theoretical religion'.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Feb 2017 7.37am)

You won't be saying that when the second coming happens.

 


"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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