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Bias against Trump

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View Rubin's Profile Rubin Flag 19 Jan 18 3.50am Send a Private Message to Rubin Add Rubin as a friend

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Potentially the end of the fake Russia scandal. Can't say I know much about the source, but the tweets contained in the story are certainly legit. Looks like Barry may have some difficult questions to answer.

 

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View kenbarr's Profile kenbarr Flag Jackson Heights, Queens, New York ... 19 Jan 18 4.03am Send a Private Message to kenbarr Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add kenbarr as a friend

Originally posted by Rubin

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Potentially the end of the fake Russia scandal. Can't say I know much about the source, but the tweets contained in the story are certainly legit. Looks like Barry may have some difficult questions to answer.

You're basing your theory on a well known conspiracy theory site that has been debunked constantly? For the record, the FISA information requested date back to the George W. Bush administration and disclosure of said material to Congress is routine and handled in a confidential matter.

 


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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 19 Jan 18 5.40am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by kenbarr

You're basing your theory on a well known conspiracy theory site that has been debunked constantly? For the record, the FISA information requested date back to the George W. Bush administration and disclosure of said material to Congress is routine and handled in a confidential matter.

I still predict that we are going to end up with the reality that there was no proof of 'collusion' between Trump and Russia. What charges they can come up with will be technical and involve his team.

Essentially this has been entirely politically motivated and a huge waste of money.

People like Ray, with his huge political biases and claims will have his political pants pulled down and what's shown won't be impressive.

 


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View kenbarr's Profile kenbarr Flag Jackson Heights, Queens, New York ... 19 Jan 18 6.06am Send a Private Message to kenbarr Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add kenbarr as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I still predict that we are going to end up with the reality that there was no proof of 'collusion' between Trump and Russia. What charges they can come up with will be technical and involve his team.

Essentially this has been entirely politically motivated and a huge waste of money.

People like Ray, with his huge political biases and claims will have his political pants pulled down and what's shown won't be impressive.

I agree in part and disagree in part. Being a native New Yorker, I've been exposed to more than my fair share of all things Trump. To me, his politics, whatever they are, are secondary to his character, which is abysmal. What they used to say about "Tricky Dick" Nixon applies to Tump, "Would you buy a used car from him?" For me, the answer is a resounding Hell No!

Time and time again he has been exposed as a liar and fraud. His Atlantic City casinos were so poorly run that they are now being demolished and no other state with casino gambling would grant him a license. That's not political, that's business. He tried to trick some of the most prominent real estate moguls in this country, particularly Harry Helmsley, into letting him skate on agreed payments he was supposed to make to them. In the late Mr. Helmsley's case, he successfully sued Trump and gained complete control of the Empire State Building from him. He lost his ownership stake in the Plaza Hotel, a NYC landmark, for very similar reasons. He conned the Scottish government over his golf course near Aberdeen. The jobs he guaranteed never came about. I saw an interview with Alex Salmond and his hatred for Trump is palpable. He originally supported the building of the golf course only to be bitterly disappointed when promises were never kept.

I've taken a wait and see attitude over what is being called the Mueller Investigation. Robert Mueller is, after all, a Republican. He has no reason to attack a Republican Administration without just cause. He has assembled a top notch staff of lawyers and investigators and has not hesitated to remove people who have showed anything less than total objectivity. Besides, American Election Law forbids any involvement by a foreign power in this country's electoral process. There would appear from verified reports that members of the Trump campaign, including at least one of his children, solicited aid from the Putin Government. If these allegations are proven true, the impeachment of Donald Trump becomes a certainty. I admit freely that is a big if.

Finally, the USA is a rather insular nation and always has been. Even after World War II a large segment of our population, in one way or another, opposed further foreign "entanglements," a word used by George Washington in his farewell speech to the nation at the end of his Presidency. Trump appeals to that isolationist thought. He also appeals to the protectionists with all his talk of a "beautiful wall" that Mexico will pay for. (Yeah, right). He also has a virulent case of diarrhoea of the mouth which has been on display quite a bit in the last few days. He has undermined both his party's Congressional leadership and his own Chief of Staff. I really don't think that's the way one wins friends and influences people.

If Trump falls, it will be of his own doing. He will say or do things that no one in this country will be able to tolerate. He has already sown the seeds of his destruction. The question remains, will he see his folly and correct his errors or will he go down as a fiery yet ultimately impotent comet.

Edited by kenbarr (19 Jan 2018 6.09am)

 


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View DutchEagleJohan's Profile DutchEagleJohan Flag Vlissingen, Netherlands 19 Jan 18 4.59pm Send a Private Message to DutchEagleJohan Add DutchEagleJohan as a friend

At least there is no ambiguity there! Discussion closed as far as I am concerned.

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You appear to be suggesting that a lying republican...well any hue of politician for that matter but a lying politician is some basis for holding overly biased views on Trump......Trump lies probably more than most politicians.

I can't take seriously the view that people should be anti Trump because he or his appointments lie.....All politicians lie....They would have to view all politicians with the same scorn...accepting for understandable political bias.

What I would accept is that media that isn't on the 'right' from an American perspective would be critical on Trump.....What annoys me is the utter childish nature of lots of this criticism and the vapid approaches many of them take....expecting their audience to automatically agree with their agendas.....That said this is only a criticism I hold for public broadcasting institutions like the BBC....what privately funded ones do is their business....though I criticise its poor objectivity I'm a tad more accepting of it.

I just want commentary that's more grown up and adult....In a sense not Trump like.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Jan 2018 5.35am)

 

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View Rubin's Profile Rubin Flag 19 Jan 18 10.10pm Send a Private Message to Rubin Add Rubin as a friend

Originally posted by kenbarr

You're basing your theory on a well known conspiracy theory site that has been debunked constantly? For the record, the FISA information requested date back to the George W. Bush administration and disclosure of said material to Congress is routine and handled in a confidential matter.

[Link]

Here you go Ken, try reading the quotes. They're what matters, unless you're claiming that they're faked.

Edited by Rubin (19 Jan 2018 10.11pm)

 

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View kenbarr's Profile kenbarr Flag Jackson Heights, Queens, New York ... 19 Jan 18 10.18pm Send a Private Message to kenbarr Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add kenbarr as a friend

Originally posted by Rubin

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Here you go Ken, try reading the quotes. They're what matters, unless you're claiming that they're faked.

Edited by Rubin (19 Jan 2018 10.11pm)

So you give me another ultra right wing conspiracy website. Those guys make Jones look rational. Please, for both our sakes, do a little research.

 


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View Rubin's Profile Rubin Flag 19 Jan 18 10.21pm Send a Private Message to Rubin Add Rubin as a friend

Originally posted by kenbarr

So you give me another ultra right wing conspiracy website. Those guys make Jones look rational. Please, for both our sakes, do a little research.

Read the quotes mate. Are you denying that they're legitimate quotes? Dismissing it due to the source is pretty intellectually dishonest.

Also, can you provide me with a link to just one story found on the Zero Hedge website that backs up your claim that it's 'ultra right'?

Edited by Rubin (19 Jan 2018 10.30pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 19 Jan 18 10.28pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by kenbarr

I agree in part and disagree in part. Being a native New Yorker, I've been exposed to more than my fair share of all things Trump. To me, his politics, whatever they are, are secondary to his character, which is abysmal. What they used to say about "Tricky Dick" Nixon applies to Tump, "Would you buy a used car from him?" For me, the answer is a resounding Hell No!

Time and time again he has been exposed as a liar and fraud. His Atlantic City casinos were so poorly run that they are now being demolished and no other state with casino gambling would grant him a license. That's not political, that's business. He tried to trick some of the most prominent real estate moguls in this country, particularly Harry Helmsley, into letting him skate on agreed payments he was supposed to make to them. In the late Mr. Helmsley's case, he successfully sued Trump and gained complete control of the Empire State Building from him. He lost his ownership stake in the Plaza Hotel, a NYC landmark, for very similar reasons. He conned the Scottish government over his golf course near Aberdeen. The jobs he guaranteed never came about. I saw an interview with Alex Salmond and his hatred for Trump is palpable. He originally supported the building of the golf course only to be bitterly disappointed when promises were never kept.

I've taken a wait and see attitude over what is being called the Mueller Investigation. Robert Mueller is, after all, a Republican. He has no reason to attack a Republican Administration without just cause. He has assembled a top notch staff of lawyers and investigators and has not hesitated to remove people who have showed anything less than total objectivity. Besides, American Election Law forbids any involvement by a foreign power in this country's electoral process. There would appear from verified reports that members of the Trump campaign, including at least one of his children, solicited aid from the Putin Government. If these allegations are proven true, the impeachment of Donald Trump becomes a certainty. I admit freely that is a big if.

Finally, the USA is a rather insular nation and always has been. Even after World War II a large segment of our population, in one way or another, opposed further foreign "entanglements," a word used by George Washington in his farewell speech to the nation at the end of his Presidency. Trump appeals to that isolationist thought. He also appeals to the protectionists with all his talk of a "beautiful wall" that Mexico will pay for. (Yeah, right). He also has a virulent case of diarrhoea of the mouth which has been on display quite a bit in the last few days. He has undermined both his party's Congressional leadership and his own Chief of Staff. I really don't think that's the way one wins friends and influences people.

If Trump falls, it will be of his own doing. He will say or do things that no one in this country will be able to tolerate. He has already sown the seeds of his destruction. The question remains, will he see his folly and correct his errors or will he go down as a fiery yet ultimately impotent comet.

Edited by kenbarr (19 Jan 2018 6.09am)

I like a lot of views in this post. I only differ in emphasis with you on some of them.

The 'used car salesman' analogy and Rubio's 'wrist watch seller' observation are definitely fair comment in my view. I don't think there are many people about who consider Trump to be a particularly nice person.

I'm pretty sure that Trump himself didn't do anything significant against his own country as he's a nationalist. Now what the rules might say might be different.....but as far as I'm aware that for impeachment there has to be provable 'collusion'......I view that as highly unlikely.....Trump isn't even that competent to collude anyway....He's not as bright as Nixon for example.....but that's not the same as calling him stupid, which many of his hyperbolic detractors enjoy doing. Trump's not ethical either but I do believe he's a nationalist plus isn't into 4D chess like plans to destroy rivals....He just does twitter for that......That's my take via observation anyway so like everybody else we will all find out.....I believe the recent book on him also pours cold water on the Russian and impeachment stuff.

But in all seriousness, it's obvious that Mulleur hasn't got anything significant in terms of Trump falling.....Do you seriously believe that wouldn't have leaked? No...I think a lot of people have been guilty of over stretch here and wishful thinking.

Yes Trump does lean towards isolationism and protectionism.....though not by much in reality as his detractors have it....So at least I'm prepared to discuss what Trump policies you might disagree with.

We would probably agree with some because....well, like Trump, I'm not a republican.....not by far....I just dislike his current opposition even more.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Jan 2018 10.32pm)

 


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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 19 Jan 18 10.41pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by DutchEagleJohan

At least there is no ambiguity there! Discussion closed as far as I am concerned.

A tad sensitive perhaps?

Debate, leads to greater moderation on all sides, while isolation leads to greater polarization on all sides.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View kenbarr's Profile kenbarr Flag Jackson Heights, Queens, New York ... 19 Jan 18 10.48pm Send a Private Message to kenbarr Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add kenbarr as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

A tad sensitive perhaps?

Debate, leads to greater moderation on all sides, while isolation leads to greater polarization on all sides.

Amen to that.

 


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View Rubin's Profile Rubin Flag 20 Jan 18 12.12am Send a Private Message to Rubin Add Rubin as a friend

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Here's the Fox News reporting of it.

They seem to be the only mainstream outlet taking about it.

 

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