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jamiemartin721  Reading 01 Sep 17 11.56am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
I didn't mention global warming or climate change. Stop looking for arguments. Just because the majority of the media say it's doubtful it exists, doesn't make over 90% of climate scientists wrong. It's worth considering how little the media have shown the tragedy around Mumbai. Even the 10% believe its real - The argument is really about whether or not human activity significantly impacts the rate at which its occurring (climates shift and change naturally over time). The consensus is that yes, it has, but its not entirely dependent on human activity, but that its reasonable to accept that there is a correlation between human industrialisation and climate change. Even if there wasn't, the argument about climate change is a moot one - because the pollution created by the emission of carbon based fuels, long and short chain, hydrocarbons and chemical industry is far more serious than just 'global temperatures'. We've really known for decades that pollution is a monumental problem awaiting humanity that gets worse generation on generation. The fear of Global Warming should be very small compared to the reality of petro-chemical and industrial chemical pollution.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| legaleagle 01 Sep 17 12.46pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Definitely not a Nazi, but he was a far right Christian militia member. That said, most US neo-Nazi groups aren't really very National Socialist either - being pro-capitalist and typically pro-Religious. Which is kind of how the Spanish Fascists were Falangists, not fascists (and couldn't be Fascists, because of their strong Roman Catholic basis). But they're effectively classed as Fascists. I agree that technically fascism is an anti-capitalist ideology and that quite a few regimes we apply the term to were not technically fascist (including Germany after the Night of the Long Knives). Hitler didn't call himself a National Socialist for nothing,a fusion of socialism within a highly nationalistic framework concerned with protecting the culture and "integrity" of the "indigenous" people and not welcoming of outsiders. We tend to use the term (myself included) to describe any authoritarian, extreme right wing, highly nationalistic regime or people who would like to bring one about.
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 Mr_Gristle In the land of Whelk Eaters 01 Sep 17 1.12pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
I agree that technically fascism is an anti-capitalist ideology and that quite a few regimes we apply the term to were not technically fascist (including Germany after the Night of the Long Knives). Hitler didn't call himself a National Socialist for nothing,a fusion of socialism within a highly nationalistic framework concerned with protecting the culture and "integrity" of the "indigenous" people and not welcoming of outsiders. We tend to use the term (myself included) to describe any authoritarian, extreme right wing, highly nationalistic regime or people who would like to bring one about. How many children around the world have had to pledge their allegiance to a flag at school this morning? Fascism 101. Not the kids' fault.
Well I think Simon's head is large; always involved in espionage. (Name that tune) |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 01 Sep 17 2.02pm |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
So that kind of nationalistic prejudice and stereotyping is OK but not if they were black or Jewish for example? Te he. I'm in France right now and it's quite nice to be away from the Brits quite honestly.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 01 Sep 17 2.06pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Pretty much agree. I don't really have an issue with Neo-Nazis drowning so much, as the idea a) God exists b) God drowns innocent people and ruins their lives to get a few c**ts d) that it diminishes the suffering of all those non-Nazis who were impacted by the flooding. I guess they were trying to be ironic or satirical, like when c**ts blame gays for hurricanes or some such - but its just f**king s**t. You can't be dumb and satirical. It really does demonstrate the double standards we have today.
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| Stirlingsays 01 Sep 17 2.55pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
Timothy Mcveigh was heavily influenced by the Christan Identity movement,which was extremely racist.Its main "guidebook" was The Turner Diaries,described as : "In his book "The Turner Diaries," Pierce describes a race war that ends with the government being overthrown. Pierce's book is more than fiction. The most radical elements of the movement view it as a vision or blueprint for action. In the book, the Aryan forces used armored car robberies to finance their revolution. In real life, the radical white supremacist group called "the Order" used Pierce's book as a guide to their armored car robberies in the Northwest. In the book, the revolutionaries blow up a federal building as part of their antigovernment war. In real life, the bombing of Oklahoma City's Alfred P. Murrah Building was almost a carbon copy of the incident in Pierce's book. As I mentioned earlier, Timothy McVeigh had photocopies of a portion of "The Turner Diaries" with him when he was arrested. McVeigh also sold copies of the book at gun shows around the country." As for McVeigh Number 2,have a look at this delightful gentleman a couple of months ago: "Brandon Russell is capable of making a bomb - and he admitted doing so. Officials believe he also participated in neo-Nazi chat rooms where he threatened to kill people and blow up places. Investigators found guns, ammunition and white supremacist propaganda in his bedroom, court records say. A framed photograph of convicted Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh was on his dresser." All this is shoe-horning......McVeigh was a terrorist but he wasn't a Nazi, that was the point I made and it's accurate. McVeigh, like most in America was raised with religion, but by the time of his murderous activities he self identified as an agnostic and when asked what his religion was he said science. He appears to have no more than a slight cultural attachment to Christianity. When we label people this or that we should at least listen to them if they want to provide information. McVeigh was quite intelligent (IQ 126) and very clear about why he bombed the federal building. I haven't seen any race stuff myself from him. No doubt he had affiliation with some of this stuff but I don't see it as a driving force. He wrote pieces that justify what he did and when I read them I found them logically consistent and very painful to read. He was a soldier fighting against society's structures. There isn't anything you can do with the McVeighs' of this world other than shoot them in the head. This is similar to some Islamic terrorists. Those who portray them all as stupid are being silly. It's the same mistake that some make when they try to claim that a political affiliation is connected to intelligence. It doesn't stand up to serious analysis. There are reasons why people fall into the belief systems they do and intelligence level rarely changes it. McVeigh said some very painful things that I don't want to think about. Essentially he makes you pick a side....but any side you pick has hands stained with the blood of innocents. No one gets to opt out of that.....In a very real sense, ignorance can be bliss. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Sep 2017 3.13pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 01 Sep 17 3.09pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
We tend to use the term (myself included) to describe any authoritarian, extreme right wing, highly nationalistic regime or people who would like to bring one about. Well, I wish you'd stop doing it. You should call them the far right perhaps. I honestly think it's just because it's easier to chant and enables you to demonise more easily. But it often ends up with people being smeared and sometimes attacked who most definitely aren't 'nazis'. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Sep 2017 3.10pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 01 Sep 17 3.24pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
It really does demonstrate the double standards we have today. For a section of society this is most definitely true. What shocked me and changed my mind about society was the Brexit and Trump reactions. It showed me that really, a significant part of society isn't really that democratic. It's about 'winning' and if they are winning you get the warm words but when things turn against them they can be quite shocking. At some level we must all be like that....We all have a political breaking point....but I thought it was at the extreme ends....I guess that for some people these events represented those extremes. Shows how wedded to a very narrow political environment they are and were.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Ray in Houston  Houston 01 Sep 17 3.54pm |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
What don't we just say that far right and far left nut jobs are very undesirable political entities and not play down the activities of one and magnify those of the other. There is no equivalency between right and left when it comes to deadly political violence. If the activity of right wing terrorists (in the US at least) seems magnified, it's because they are disproportionately by far the deadliest sect of extremists out there. Since 9/11, right wing extremists are killing 2 people to every 1 person killed by all other terrorist combnined, including Islamists (the second biggest group) and left-wing terrorists (who barely make the list). If you think otherwise, you are Frank the Tank, running naked in the streets, excusing yourself by claiming that "everyone's doing it".
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 01 Sep 17 3.56pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Pretty much agree. I don't really have an issue with Neo-Nazis drowning so much, as the idea a) God exists b) God drowns innocent people and ruins their lives to get a few c**ts d) that it diminishes the suffering of all those non-Nazis who were impacted by the flooding. I guess you haven't read much of the Old Testament, then.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 01 Sep 17 4.10pm |
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Why Harvey hasn't been politicised:
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 01 Sep 17 4.27pm |
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Originally posted by Mr_Gristle
How many children around the world have had to pledge their allegiance to a flag at school this morning? Fascism 101. Not the kids' fault. Its not, communist kids used to pledge allegiance to the country etc. Its a questionable practice, but its not really fascist. Nationalism is a tennet of Fascism, but its a very particular kind of nationalism.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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