I don't get involved with any political discussion on here because as sure as eggs it will evolve into a tedious WILLO thread and HOL is certainly NOT all about me.

In terms of the post of 'Top Cat', great minds think alike !!!!

We just cannot sit back and defend.

Certainly left us short up front I guess but we had other injuries it seems and of course lacked our midfield battler in the final minutes.

I agree 99% with the sentiments of the opening post and the various replies since.

However, let's not pretend like Big Sam isn't the best Manager we've had in recent years and is proving that yet again with Everton.

His mantra is "if you don't concede a goal then you're guaranteed a point" not "let's draw every game". I think it's a pragmatic approach and exactly what we needed.

I think Roy has a similar approach although he doesn't come out and say it every interview but I also think we play with more spirit under Roy and less robotic. However, there are certainly games Roy has drawn or lost that Sam would have won, so you can pick and choose what you'd prefer.

Everything else though completely correct. He's classy, experienced and not a BS'er like Pardew.

What will be nice is if we can somehow scrape survival, having a very boring season with Uncle Roy next year before he retires. Then it's crucial we don't make another Frank De Boer mistake. But let's cross that bridge if and when it comes, we'll be lucky to be in the Prem next year but Roy is the man to do it.

They had 3 key players out of an already threadbare and weaker squad than ours in the 4-0. We had Sakho out and everyone else available. It was miraculous he got them in that situation. He certainly wouldn't have been anywhere near as sh1t as Frank and we'd be ok.

COYP

That's a good assessment, and whilst I'm sure the original poster was simply summarising what we know to be a caution-first approach from Allardyce when he described it as 'lets draw every game', we certainly shouldn't forget the value of getting the basics right.

At the same time, the spirit and slightly more positive attitude Roy has installed does compare favourably to the Allardyce approach.

I know its still early, but I feel I prefer having Hodgson to Allardyce. They both talk fairly straight in press conferences, but Roy seems less inclined to moan about the ref, to talk up his own achievements, or to develop mates in the media. More to the point though, its far more enjoyable watching the team under Roy, who seems to be able to work spirit and desire into the teams play, as well as the importance of shape and discipline. Allardyce did far more of the latter than the former.

Witness also how Allardyce talked openly about having to address the psychology of the players, who he quickly (and very publicly) diagnosed as being 'scared of playing at home'. Hodgson on the other hand just said they would need to keep on working hard in training, as that, rather than high-level sports science and suchlike, would give us the best chance of getting results. Sam made our awful home form seem like a complex thing so that he, and only he, could be seen to fix it (even though he didn't really), whilst Roy may have actually fixed it through the unglamorous, player-led mantra of hard work. Its a small point, but illustrative of the distinction between the two I think. With Sam it sometimes feels like its all about Sam, whereas with Roy its nearly always all about the players.

I've no complaints about the work Allardyce did for us of course, but I wouldn't swap him for Roy now if I was offered.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (13 Dec 2017 1.47pm)

Yes excellent.

Thank you for sharing it with us all.