Just what is working class

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Stirlingsays 22 Dec 17 8.52pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 Ok let's twist that one a bit. If a privately-educated RP-spoken fella from a well to do background, whose relatives and descendants were of the professional class, as are all his friends, but he himself had been employed as a Ł15,000 a year waiter for the last five years; does that stop him being the ultra middle class lad which his background and environment dictates that he is? I think not. Like I said, there are two components to being working class....the money and the mentality. The guy you mentioned is working class because his past background isn't going to help moving forward......and there are plenty of well spoken poor people. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

22 Dec 17 8.52pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

Ok let's twist that one a bit. If a privately-educated RP-spoken fella from a well to do background, whose relatives and descendants were of the professional class, as are all his friends, but he himself had been employed as a Ł15,000 a year waiter for the last five years; does that stop him being the ultra middle class lad which his background and environment dictates that he is?

I think not.

Like I said, there are two components to being working class....the money and the mentality.

The guy you mentioned is working class because his past background isn't going to help moving forward......and there are plenty of well spoken poor people.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Kermit8 Hevon 22 Dec 17 8.55pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Like I said, there are two components to being working class....the money and the mentality. The guy you mentioned is working class because his past background isn't going to help moving forward......and there are plenty of well spoken poor people. He's middle-class but on a low wage. It is possible. Even if he were on the dole he would still be middle-class. Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.56pm) Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 22 Dec 17 8.55pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Like I said, there are two components to being working class....the money and the mentality.

The guy you mentioned is working class because his past background isn't going to help moving forward......and there are plenty of well spoken poor people.

He's middle-class but on a low wage. It is possible.

Even if he were on the dole he would still be middle-class.

Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.56pm)

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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Stirlingsays 22 Dec 17 8.56pm
Originally posted by .TUX. I disagree. Unregulated capitalism is true capitalism in every sense, ie if you're good at what you do the public will keep you/your business alive. If not, you burn. Today there are rules for everything. Just this morning, for example, the US federal government published another 709 pages of new 'regulations'. WTF! What you describe there is meritocracy.....unregulated capitalism is related to it but it isn't the same thing....for example, unregulated capitalism gives you monopolies.....w3hich is the opposite of meritocracy. We had a pretty unregulated capitalism in its early days where we had children working in factories and chimneys.......there are no ethics when the profit motive is unfetted. I believe in capitalism as the best system we have.....but unregulated capitalism is an evil. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Dec 2017 8.59pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

22 Dec 17 8.56pm

Originally posted by .TUX.

I disagree. Unregulated capitalism is true capitalism in every sense, ie if you're good at what you do the public will keep you/your business alive. If not, you burn.
Today there are rules for everything. Just this morning, for example, the US federal government published another 709 pages of new 'regulations'.

WTF!

What you describe there is meritocracy.....unregulated capitalism is related to it but it isn't the same thing....for example, unregulated capitalism gives you monopolies.....w3hich is the opposite of meritocracy.

We had a pretty unregulated capitalism in its early days where we had children working in factories and chimneys.......there are no ethics when the profit motive is unfetted.

I believe in capitalism as the best system we have.....but unregulated capitalism is an evil.

Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Dec 2017 8.59pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 22 Dec 17 8.58pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 He's middle-class but on a low wage. It is possible. Even if he were on the dole he would still be middle-class. Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.56pm) You can't be middle class and poor, that's a paradox. You are talking about his mentality.....like I said, there are plenty of well spoken, well educated poor people. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

22 Dec 17 8.58pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

He's middle-class but on a low wage. It is possible.

Even if he were on the dole he would still be middle-class.

Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.56pm)

You can't be middle class and poor, that's a paradox.

You are talking about his mentality.....like I said, there are plenty of well spoken, well educated poor people.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Kermit8 Hevon 22 Dec 17 9.05pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays You can't be middle class and poor, that's a paradox. You are talking about his mentality.....like I said, there are plenty of well spoken, well educated poor people. Totally disagree. And it's not just about mentality but, obviously, environment. Some shelf-stacker Eton kid from a well-to-do background will never be working class. Having money, or not, doesn't always dictate social standing. The nouveau riche were working class but with money. It didn't make them middle class. Their privately-educated kids may have ended up middle class because they would have had a different experience. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 22 Dec 17 9.05pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You can't be middle class and poor, that's a paradox.

You are talking about his mentality.....like I said, there are plenty of well spoken, well educated poor people.

Totally disagree. And it's not just about mentality but, obviously, environment. Some shelf-stacker Eton kid from a well-to-do background will never be working class.
Having money, or not, doesn't always dictate social standing. The nouveau riche were working class but with money. It didn't make them middle class. Their privately-educated kids may have ended up middle class because they would have had a different experience.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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johnfirewall 22 Dec 17 9.09pm
Never before has there been such aspiration to be working class. I think it speaks volumes that so many are out of it.
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johnfirewall

22 Dec 17 9.09pm

Never before has there been such aspiration to be working class. I think it speaks volumes that so many are out of it.

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.TUX. 22 Dec 17 9.15pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 The human race, you mean? We are not in this all together. Some have progressed/benefited and some have suffered through the modern capitalist system. If you scan the globe you will easily find areas that have been aggressively destroyed in the pursuit of profit and the locals who have born the brunt. Also, you are contradicting yourself. You hate the banks more than anyone but they are the finest example of what you have just promoted. Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.53pm) We all should (!) and they are far far from anything that i ''promote''. The 'system' has moved us into a 'banking system' that when it fails.............we 'rescue'. This has only been around for 100yrs give or take. How on earth did we manage before? Not your best effort tbh bud. Buy Litecoin.
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.TUX.

22 Dec 17 9.15pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

The human race, you mean? We are not in this all together. Some have progressed/benefited and some have suffered through the modern capitalist system.

If you scan the globe you will easily find areas that have been aggressively destroyed in the pursuit of profit and the locals who have born the brunt.

Also, you are contradicting yourself. You hate the banks more than anyone but they are the finest example of what you have just promoted.

Edited by Kermit8 (22 Dec 2017 8.53pm)

We all should (!) and they are far far from anything that i ''promote''. The 'system' has moved us into a 'banking system' that when it fails.............we 'rescue'.
This has only been around for 100yrs give or take. How on earth did we manage before?

Not your best effort tbh bud.

Buy Litecoin.

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.TUX. 22 Dec 17 9.39pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays What you describe there is meritocracy.....unregulated capitalism is related to it but it isn't the same thing....for example, unregulated capitalism gives you monopolies.....w3hich is the opposite of meritocracy. We had a pretty unregulated capitalism in its early days where we had children working in factories and chimneys.......there are no ethics when the profit motive is unfetted. I believe in capitalism as the best system we have.....but unregulated capitalism is an evil. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Dec 2017 8.59pm) We've rightly moved on from children going up chimneys etc etc but there really is no change to where we have 'progressed' to at this moment in time. Today we need two salaries to own/run a home. No chimneys involved this time, just the same extortion but on two fronts instead of one. Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does. Buy Litecoin.
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.TUX.

22 Dec 17 9.39pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

We had a pretty unregulated capitalism in its early days where we had children working in factories and chimneys.......there are no ethics when the profit motive is unfetted.

I believe in capitalism as the best system we have.....but unregulated capitalism is an evil.

Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Dec 2017 8.59pm)

We've rightly moved on from children going up chimneys etc etc but there really is no change to where we have 'progressed' to at this moment in time.
Today we need two salaries to own/run a home. No chimneys involved this time, just the same extortion but on two fronts instead of one.

Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does.

Buy Litecoin.

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.TUX. 22 Dec 17 9.40pm
Originally posted by johnfirewall Never before has there been such aspiration to be working class. I think it speaks volumes that so many are out of it. This. Buy Litecoin.
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.TUX.

22 Dec 17 9.40pm

Originally posted by johnfirewall

Never before has there been such aspiration to be working class. I think it speaks volumes that so many are out of it.

This.

Buy Litecoin.

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Stirlingsays 22 Dec 17 10.58pm
Originally posted by .TUX. We've rightly moved on from children going up chimneys etc etc but there really is no change to where we have 'progressed' to at this moment in time. Today we need two salaries to own/run a home. No chimneys involved this time, just the same extortion but on two fronts instead of one. Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does. Yep, two salaries to stand still is not an advancement for living standards in this country......globalization has shafted the working class in Britain....the left not caring of course because they are mainly internationalist....and the economic right not caring either because its cheaper labour for them. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

22 Dec 17 10.58pm

Originally posted by .TUX.

Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does.

Yep, two salaries to stand still is not an advancement for living standards in this country......globalization has shafted the working class in Britain....the left not caring of course because they are mainly internationalist....and the economic right not caring either because its cheaper labour for them.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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jamiemartin721 Reading 23 Dec 17 11.12am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays As said, there is working class by wage and working class by mentality. He has the mentality but he isn't working class....he doens't have to deal with any of the problems of working people...over and above a certain amount of money you just can't be working class....even if that's where you came from.....but he has the mentality because he was raised working class. Technically its your job and the status of your job that defines your class. Some jobs, though not particularly well paid, traditionally ranked as middle and even lower upper class (civil servant and teachers). Of course you could be kind of poor and a member of the aristocratic classes as well. These days, its all about disposable income. If you're capable of spending, you're empowered in society. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 23 Dec 17 11.12am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

As said, there is working class by wage and working class by mentality.

He has the mentality but he isn't working class....he doens't have to deal with any of the problems of working people...over and above a certain amount of money you just can't be working class....even if that's where you came from.....but he has the mentality because he was raised working class.

Technically its your job and the status of your job that defines your class. Some jobs, though not particularly well paid, traditionally ranked as middle and even lower upper class (civil servant and teachers). Of course you could be kind of poor and a member of the aristocratic classes as well.

These days, its all about disposable income. If you're capable of spending, you're empowered in society.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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jamiemartin721 Reading 23 Dec 17 11.14am
Originally posted by .TUX. We've rightly moved on from children going up chimneys etc etc but there really is no change to where we have 'progressed' to at this moment in time. Today we need two salaries to own/run a home. No chimneys involved this time, just the same extortion but on two fronts instead of one. Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does. The children 'up chimneys' metaphorically still exist, its just they're based in third world countries and work in sweatshops. Much like the Upper and Middle classes wouldn't have tolerated their kids 'up chimneys' but the distance from the working classes made it acceptable; now that kind of labour is exported out of sight, and out of mind. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 23 Dec 17 11.14am

Originally posted by .TUX.

Capitalism does not exist. 'Do as we tell you' does.

The children 'up chimneys' metaphorically still exist, its just they're based in third world countries and work in sweatshops. Much like the Upper and Middle classes wouldn't have tolerated their kids 'up chimneys' but the distance from the working classes made it acceptable; now that kind of labour is exported out of sight, and out of mind.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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