From where do you get your 15% to 20%? I think that is wildly overstated and doesn't match my own experiences at all. It might be true in parts of Iraq or Afghanistan but cannot be so in Indonesia, Turkey or Malaysia.

I have no time at all for religion based intolerance and want to see it eradicated every bit as anyone else does. The question is not if that needs to be done, but how. You cannot just wipe away a religion, so the only way has to be to make other things become more important. That can be done with economic progress and a place in the modern world. It works already in some Muslim countries and can, in time, in all of them. It will for us, once we stop herding them into ghettos and treating them like outcasts. I realise that for many that is currently their own choice but we need to break that circle.

The numbers may be small but the impact is massive.
Google Brigette Gabriel and watch her put a lady to bed about the minority in a society. Frighteningly true and she is from Lebanese decent so can’t put the race scarf around her neck.
The Irish terrorists have seen the light after 100 years.
Muslim terror has been going on from 12 years into the formation of Islam.
That is around 1500 years and it started because this Mohammed chap didn’t get his own way like a spoilt brat.
This Islam against the world will not be a happy ending.
The same way that the religions around when Islam formed are not here in numbers any more. Because the Quran states that it is the last and final book on religion. Now does that not, just a little bit make you wonder about the mindset.
Wisbech around 15-20% of muslims around the world are classed as radicle and wanting there own secular lives and the end of the West or even Christianity.That is 1 in 5. A minority in a math term yes. But in reality upwards of 300,000,000 around the world.
How many in the uk with that thought. Just the thought I’m saying, not the balls to do it.
Think of the scene in braveheart when the king says get Wallace as the others are mere sheep.
If Wallace shows up we are f####d.

God you are so deluded it beggars belief.

Tell me what Muslim countries are in the modern world and are making in progress because I'm going to enjoy proving that is nonsense.

You can't force people to integrate. Stop spreading your nonsense make believe about Islam.

Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Aug 2018 4.46pm)

Have you ever heard of Malaysia let alone ever been there? Indonesia is another as is Turkey. Whilst none are nearly as developed as us they are quite obviously developing and part of the modern world. Turkey has it's issues with traditionalists but the very fact that they are opposed makes the point. To try to deny this is to deny reality.

Of course you cannot force people to integrate! I have never suggested that you can. What you can do is encourage it by establishing the conditions in which it becomes the best option and then allow the time for that to happen. No-one is born a radical Muslim, an evangelical Christian or anything else. It all depends on your upbringing, environment and access to information. Change those and you too will change. It won't happen by itself. It requires commitment, a great deal of effort, endless patience and lots of time, but it can be done. It requires interventions to change the status quo towards outcomes that suit us all. Just bleating in the dark achieves nothing.

I am a patient man but I am losing patience with you. You constantly insult me whilst admitting that you defend far right racists like "Robinson", are a member of the ridiculous UKIP, are in favour of Brexit and Trump. All of these call into question your judgment. You complain about Muslim immigration without making any kind of suggestion on how a currently challenging situation can be improved. Unless I read something more positive from you, which is based on reason rather than rhetoric, I won't be bothering with you again. I have better things to do than talk to brick walls.

It isn't though just a theory is it? It is an established scenario seen many times in the past. Some people think evolution is just a theory. I don't. I think it's an established scientific fact.

Whether what I expect happens is as yet unknown. On that you are obviously correct but it's a lot more than hope. It's an expectation because things are already being done and no society could allow the kind of doomsday outcome that the gloom merchants are predicting to actually happen. Further interventions are therefore inevitable.

Nothing in the present is relevant when dealing with evolutionary change and forecasted interventions. The Police are under resourced but are doing much more, alongside the IC, than we perhaps realise. Much of this is underneath the radar so as to avoid negative publicity.

I am routinely insulted by those of the far right for holding views which are tangential to their extreme ones. It's water off the proverbial duck's back but if it becomes the only response without any real engagement with the argument then responding further is a waste of time.

It HAS been stated that integration is a major desire. Not by the groups involved but by our elected representatives, who are very well informed. It's just such a pity that so much of their time and energy is now being taken up by the stupidity of Brexit. However, I too doubt that much will change in the short term. This will take generations to overcome.

All the countries you mention have terrible human rights records. Minorities like homosexuals and apostates are in danger in most of those countries. Turkey even has religious departments in its government and restricts free speech and many other rights. You probably think Malaysia is ok because it's only 64 percent Islamic and so religions like Buddhism have an influence there....As for Indonesia! Are you kidding me?

For you to push them forward as examples just shows how risible and deluded your opinions are. Where-ever there is an Islamic minority they are concerned about rights, where-ever there is an Islamic majority they restrict them.....The Pew data showing Islamic attitudes here and around the world and shows your opinions for the folly they are.

You say you recognise that people can't be made to integrate. Yet in the next few sentences you appear to suggest the very opposite. Again....the common sense reality is that unless you stop Muslims coming in with backward attitudes (you can't) Unless you can massively change the forms of conservative Islam within their mosques to reformist Islam (you can't)...Unless you can stop them living together in large groups (you can't) Unless you can end their religious schools (you can't) Unless you could do all these things you are talking pipe dreams and you aren't going to integrate a socially conservative religion....you are talking dreamland.

Again, I state to you (you ignored this question earlier). Point to me the western country with an Islamic minority that has successfully integrated into it. It's nonsense, just as your earlier claim that more people agreed with you....which I then disproved with statistics...leading you to fall back into what the weasels in parliament think.

As for you expanding this out into Trump.....that is a deflection. My support for Trump is less about him and more against the outrageous bias shown in the lefty media. Also it's against the current far too left wing state of the democrats and their immigration policies.....However, he is doing very well economically in comparison to what went before.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Aug 2018 8.37am)