No it is comparing their record.

Despite 50+ deaths this year there are no plans to increase police numbers on the street, down by 20% since labour.

Tories do not understand that crime has cause and that must be tackled.

New York does recognise that and violent crime there has been decreasing for several years.

It is not easy of course, but the UK idea of punishment alone just brings more and more suffering on our streets.

In what way is Mrs Lawrence truly awful?

My understanding of the situation is that her son - an innocent and decent young man as far as I can see - was randomly attacked because he was black.

The Police then did a truly dreadful job of investigating

The Lawrences, who are pretty bright, would not let it rest and pressed hard in order to discover the string of errors made. They then started to ask why these errors were made. Turns out it was because - at the time - many Police officers had pre-set opinions about black youths and just didn't choose to do a proper job.

This then led eventually to an independent review and the huge conclusion that the Police in general suffered from institutional racism

The DCCs I worked with knew their Constabularies had this problem and needed major change long beforehand but had been struggling to address the issues.

So what, in your opinion, makes the Police so special that they are immune from having to change and adapt?

And by the way, don't forget that the Officers involved are being investigated by the NCA under the direction of the IOPC. So not just incompetent and uncaring, potentially complicit and criminal.

It is interesting that you consider turning this particular rock has inflicted 'damage' upon the Police service. Without the persistence of the Lawrences the Police would have changed far slower and the DCCs would have had much less leverage to make the changes.

Regarding OBEs. So you mean that the Queen really doesn't make her own mind up? Who'd a thought it. It's almost as if you don't think the monarchy is relevant any more - you young people with your lack of respect, grrr.

In fact, OBEs are determined through a comprehensive process involving a variety of civil servants but - in the majority - notable independent people. They then go through a second independent review. It's such a shame these people aren't as clever or free thinking as you but there you are. But do make a recommendation for who you would like to see get an OBE, Tommy Robinson springs to mind. About a quarter of OBEs are awarded due to public nominations.

[Link]

By the way, a word to the wise. As a teacher it may be helpful for you to know the difference between effect and affect.

Edited by Mapletree (25 Apr 2018 9.05pm)

The mind boggles. I hope you can get a device to relieve that.

Not sure how asking a simple question makes me the 'most literal poster on HOL'. Love to hear you expand on that.

Not sure sure how asking a simple question makes you deduce how I'm therefore 'not a palace fan'. Do explain further.

Not sure why you need to use caps. MAYBE YOU FELT A BIT SHOUTY.

Its tempting to bate you, but I'd love to debate the issue. So try to debate it. Try to avoid any 'how dim are people' 'youre not a palace fan' 'youre the most literal poster' etc etc, as that's not debating is just name calling.

Im not interested in name-calling posts. Happy to debate.

When the time comes, I want die just like my Dad - at peace and asleep.
Not screaming and terrified.
Like his passengers.

If you mean about my English, no.

I hate to see the dreadful violence that has regularly reared its head for time immemorial. I don’t care about colour or race. I do care about fairness, lack of it perpetuates the violence and gives people an excuse to ramp it up.

Highlighting one particular example may be helpful on the basis of how do you eat an elephant. But I agree that we need to address every case with equal passion. I don’t think you can vilify the Lawrences for focusing on their own world. Doesn’t mean their case is particularly special, just that they got mobilised and persevered.