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Jack Wilshere (suggestion) (LOCKED)

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View Bexley Eagle's Profile Bexley Eagle Flag Bexley Kent 17 Jun 18 9.58am Send a Private Message to Bexley Eagle Add Bexley Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by dp

This guy is a regular starter for Arsenal, who are better than us. If we could get him, then he would take us forward.

And yet people on here think he is not good enough for us, or are raking over the last few seasons to find reasons why he is somehow flawed. Whilst onother threads people are saying that we are Palace, and are therefore not going to sign £30 million + players.

If all this is true, then surely the only route forward is to sign these flawed quality players who have fallen out of favour in the Champions League teams, when we can. To do so we have to accept that they are flawed and that this is a risk.

Excellent post.

 

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View Mstrobez's Profile Mstrobez Flag 17 Jun 18 10.07am Send a Private Message to Mstrobez Add Mstrobez as a friend

Originally posted by Bexley Eagle

Excellent post.

It’s not true though. He’s not a regular starter for Arsenal, he’s a rotation option & deemed by most to not be good enough to start regularly.

These injury prone “maverick” big names don’t actually inspire me all that much at all. To me they just highlight a lack of global footballing knowledge from our scouting department. I don’t think we’ll ever move forward that much if we continue to confine the majority of our biggest signings to has beens, or coulda been great if hadn’t spent majority of career injured, or only way we know he’s good is because its someone we had on loan who’s price is now through the roof.

There are options out there in world football. European markets have a whole host of young creative midfielders with similar qualities to Wilshere. Who are younger, who aren’t a sick note, who have the potential to be infinitely better than him. I could do a mattteo style list of them. But we’re so obsessed with premier league experience, it ends up holding us back.

Would a fully fit Wilshere improve us? Probably. Is he the best option for the type of money we will have to spend on him? No, almost certainly not.


Edited by Mstrobez (17 Jun 2018 10.12am)

 


We're the Arthur over ere!

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View Bexley Eagle's Profile Bexley Eagle Flag Bexley Kent 17 Jun 18 10.15am Send a Private Message to Bexley Eagle Add Bexley Eagle as a friend

I can see both sides of the argument. Luka is an example which backs your case. Few including me had even heard of him let alone seen him play and yet he has been excellent since his arrival. Cabaye is probably in the other camp in that he was a big name surplus to requirements at a bigger club. Again he may never have reached the heights that we originally expected but he has been an integral part of our team and would leave a big while if he returns to France this summer. I would take Wilshere so long as the economics of the deal work for us. He is a good player who would fit into the way we play very well and would be a like for like for Cabaye if he left.

 

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View black eagle.'s Profile black eagle. Flag south croydon. 17 Jun 18 10.19am Send a Private Message to black eagle. Add black eagle. as a friend

Originally posted by dp

This guy is a regular starter for Arsenal, who are better than us. If we could get him, then he would take us forward.

And yet people on here think he is not good enough for us, or are raking over the last few seasons to find reasons why he is somehow flawed. Whilst onother threads people are saying that we are Palace, and are therefore not going to sign £30 million + players.

If all this is true, then surely the only route forward is to sign these flawed quality players who have fallen out of favour in the Champions League teams, when we can. To do so we have to accept that they are flawed and that this is a risk.

Brilliant post.

 

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View Mstrobez's Profile Mstrobez Flag 17 Jun 18 10.19am Send a Private Message to Mstrobez Add Mstrobez as a friend

Originally posted by Bexley Eagle

I can see both sides of the argument. Luka is an example which backs your case. Few including me had even heard of him let alone seen him play and yet he has been excellent since his arrival. Cabaye is probably in the other camp in that he was a big name surplus to requirements at a bigger club. Again he may never have reached the heights that we originally expected but he has been an integral part of our team and would leave a big while if he returns to France this summer. I would take Wilshere so long as the economics of the deal work for us. He is a good player who would fit into the way we play very well and would be a like for like for Cabaye if he left.

If he’s fully fit, of course he’ll be a good player for us. But I struggle to see any circumstance where economically we couldn’t do a whole lot better. If we just show a bit of ambition and broaden our horizons.

 


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View Goldfiinger's Profile Goldfiinger Flag Just down the road 17 Jun 18 12.14pm Send a Private Message to Goldfiinger Add Goldfiinger as a friend

Originally posted by Mstrobez

It’s not true though. He’s not a regular starter for Arsenal, he’s a rotation option & deemed by most to not be good enough to start regularly.

These injury prone “maverick” big names don’t actually inspire me all that much at all. To me they just highlight a lack of global footballing knowledge from our scouting department. I don’t think we’ll ever move forward that much if we continue to confine the majority of our biggest signings to has beens, or coulda been great if hadn’t spent majority of career injured, or only way we know he’s good is because its someone we had on loan who’s price is now through the roof.

There are options out there in world football. European markets have a whole host of young creative midfielders with similar qualities to Wilshere. Who are younger, who aren’t a sick note, who have the potential to be infinitely better than him. I could do a mattteo style list of them. But we’re so obsessed with premier league experience, it ends up holding us back.

Would a fully fit Wilshere improve us? Probably. Is he the best option for the type of money we will have to spend on him? No, almost certainly not.


Edited by Mstrobez (17 Jun 2018 10.12am)

Under stand your point but still don’t see how taking a chance on a couple of young European players for say £10m is less risky than Jack at £25m.

We did however do very well buying Luka and am totally behind more European signings. But should we not go for JW whilst he is available as he is clearly a very good player.

Very surprising people are arguing about his quality on the basis he might or might not be arsenal first team quality.....

 

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View Goldfiinger's Profile Goldfiinger Flag Just down the road 17 Jun 18 12.24pm Send a Private Message to Goldfiinger Add Goldfiinger as a friend

Originally posted by Mstrobez

If he’s fully fit, of course he’ll be a good player for us. But I struggle to see any circumstance where economically we couldn’t do a whole lot better. If we just show a bit of ambition and broaden our horizons.

Signing a quality keeper on a free was fairly good business?
How much did Luka cost us?

We sign European players and some pay off and some don’t.
We sign Premiership players also.
We pay top dollar for some and get some on the cheap.
It’s a balance between the two.

Club show a bit of ambition? For real?
Did you see the new stand plans?


 

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View eagleman13's Profile eagleman13 Flag On The Road To Hell & Alicante 17 Jun 18 2.43pm Send a Private Message to eagleman13 Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add eagleman13 as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Under stand your point but still don’t see how taking a chance on a couple of young European players for say £10m is less risky than Jack at £25m.

We did however do very well buying Luka and am totally behind more European signings. But should we not go for JW whilst he is available as he is clearly a very good player.

Very surprising people are arguing about his quality on the basis he might or might not be arsenal first team quality.....


I understand your point also.....


BUT, no-one is mentioning if he's good enough for Arsenals 1st team, they are arguing if he's FIT enough, what with his fitness history.

So, going to Wet Spam

Edited by eagleman13 (17 Jun 2018 4.03pm)

 


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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 17 Jun 18 4.02pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Signing a quality keeper on a free was fairly good business?
How much did Luka cost us?

We sign European players and some pay off and some don’t.
We sign Premiership players also.
We pay top dollar for some and get some on the cheap.
It’s a balance between the two.

Club show a bit of ambition? For real?
Did you see the new stand plans?


Some good points made all round but I lean this way a bit tbh. A mix in your strategy never a bad thing.

 


COYP

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View Painter's Profile Painter Flag Croydon 17 Jun 18 4.17pm Send a Private Message to Painter Add Painter as a friend

Roy would of seen close up whilst Wilshere was in the England squad with him. He will know exactly what his personality and ability is like and whether he can fit into our first team.
The only question would be his fitness, but there is no guarantee with any player you sign ie Wickham was hardly ever injured before, but out for 18 months since we signed him.

 

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View Mstrobez's Profile Mstrobez Flag 17 Jun 18 4.51pm Send a Private Message to Mstrobez Add Mstrobez as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Signing a quality keeper on a free was fairly good business?
How much did Luka cost us?

We sign European players and some pay off and some don’t.
We sign Premiership players also.
We pay top dollar for some and get some on the cheap.
It’s a balance between the two.

Club show a bit of ambition? For real?
Did you see the new stand plans?


Has absolutely nothing to do with transfers whatsoever. I was referring to our transfer policy and scouting department. And in terms of incomings we lack enterprise severely.

The one time we actually broadened out a bit we got Luka, imagine how much he’d cost if he were English or a PL player, and even then he was in a pool that English clubs were circling. So it’s not like we exclusively uncovered that gem. He still had to fit what appears to me as a very narrow criteria we set out for players.

The premier league is a completely over inflated market. To some the experience is the be all and end all, for me it’s not in the slightest. You’re within your rights to disagree, but it’s a matter of a difference in opinion and that’s it. And my point is quite simply that there are far better alternatives in the world than Wilshere, that will cost less, play more and have more years in them.


Edited by Mstrobez (17 Jun 2018 5.27pm)

 


We're the Arthur over ere!

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View mattteo's Profile mattteo Flag 17 Jun 18 6.55pm Send a Private Message to mattteo Add mattteo as a friend

Originally posted by Goldfiinger

Signing a quality keeper on a free was fairly good business?
How much did Luka cost us?

We sign European players and some pay off and some don’t.
We sign Premiership players also.
We pay top dollar for some and get some on the cheap.

It’s a balance between the two.

Club show a bit of ambition? For real?
Did you see the new stand plans?



Let me just disagree with the bolded part. Premiership players are never cheap. They are over inflated and always cost more than they could offer. And by the way, this is not a rant at English football, but being the league with the most money and highest earnings, it's normal that the same quality can be found somewhere else for less money. Even if Wilshire won't cost anything, he's Wilshire, You'd still have to pay him the biggest salary in the squad. Is he worth it? No.Get Gonzalo Castro for that money or Daniel Wass or Aranguiz from Leverkuse (double Copa America winner with Chile). What did Wilshire win?

 

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