Is the Devil good, and God evil?

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Stirlingsays 20 Jun 18 7.42pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger What do you mean by detirminism? Nature appears to have determinism. A series of random chances will appear that way given enough time. I doubt 'God' has anything to do with interference patterns or that we are close to understanding the quantum realm. The consequences of the quantum eraser experiment appear to suggest that knowledge of something determines how particles behave.....and this is independent of time....in other words independent of when it happens.....that aspect is mind blowing. No knowledge of a system suggests that particles can then exist in many states and be undetermined. I'll point you to the video which explains this.....beware though, I had to watch this quite a few times until I 'understood' it as there's a lot going on. [Link] The suggested consequence that we are living in a universe that is only determined (exactly) when it is sensed doesn't close off the possibility of a creation. Determinism seems to me more like a huge computer program or some sort of pre-defined logic process.......Don't get me wrong....this is only my speculation. I'm not putting anything forward that's solid. Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 7.50pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

20 Jun 18 7.42pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

What do you mean by detirminism?

Nature appears to have determinism. A series of random chances will appear that way given enough time.
I doubt 'God' has anything to do with interference patterns or that we are close to understanding the quantum realm.

The consequences of the quantum eraser experiment appear to suggest that knowledge of something determines how particles behave.....and this is independent of time....in other words independent of when it happens.....that aspect is mind blowing.

No knowledge of a system suggests that particles can then exist in many states and be undetermined.

I'll point you to the video which explains this.....beware though, I had to watch this quite a few times until I 'understood' it as there's a lot going on.

[Link]

The suggested consequence that we are living in a universe that is only determined (exactly) when it is sensed doesn't close off the possibility of a creation.

Determinism seems to me more like a huge computer program or some sort of pre-defined logic process.......Don't get me wrong....this is only my speculation. I'm not putting anything forward that's solid.

Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 7.50pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Hrolf The Ganger 20 Jun 18 8.58pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays The consequences of the quantum eraser experiment appear to suggest that knowledge of something determines how particles behave.....and this is independent of time....in other words independent of when it happens.....that aspect is mind blowing. No knowledge of a system suggests that particles can then exist in many states and be undetermined. I'll point you to the video which explains this.....beware though, I had to watch this quite a few times until I 'understood' it as there's a lot going on. [Link] The suggested consequence that we are living in a universe that is only determined (exactly) when it is sensed doesn't close off the possibility of a creation. Determinism seems to me more like a huge computer program or some sort of pre-defined logic process.......Don't get me wrong....this is only my speculation. I'm not putting anything forward that's solid. Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 7.50pm) I am familiar with the experiments but I have no idea what it means and nor does anyone else it seems. What is important in the context of this thread is that it is science and not superstition. I am not really comfortable discussing creationism and science in the same conversation. The former is based on ignorance. If it ever turned out that the universe was 'created', creationists will not be able to claim any sort of victory. Their beliefs are not based on an investigation but rather something akin to a lucky guess. The other possibility, in that case, would be that aliens told humans about it years ago and that knowledge got filtered into the ancient texts.
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Hrolf The Ganger

20 Jun 18 8.58pm

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Originally posted by Stirlingsays

No knowledge of a system suggests that particles can then exist in many states and be undetermined.

I'll point you to the video which explains this.....beware though, I had to watch this quite a few times until I 'understood' it as there's a lot going on.

[Link]

The suggested consequence that we are living in a universe that is only determined (exactly) when it is sensed doesn't close off the possibility of a creation.

Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 7.50pm)

I am familiar with the experiments but I have no idea what it means and nor does anyone else it seems.
What is important in the context of this thread is that it is science and not superstition.
I am not really comfortable discussing creationism and science in the same conversation. The former is based on ignorance.
If it ever turned out that the universe was 'created', creationists will not be able to claim any sort of victory. Their beliefs are not based on an investigation but rather something akin to a lucky guess. The other possibility, in that case, would be that aliens told humans about it years ago and that knowledge got filtered into the ancient texts.

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Stirlingsays 20 Jun 18 9.28pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I am familiar with the experiments but I have no idea what it means and nor does anyone else it seems. Perhaps you should download that video and watch it about twenty times like I did. It's freaking mind blowing. It's a piece of the puzzle. It suggests determinism. What that means as a larger picture?....well like we both agree, it's unknown at this time. What exactly is meant by determinism, and what this leads to.....Well, the generations to come have exciting times. Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger What is important in the context of this thread is that it is science and not superstition. With respect Hrolf my friend, the thread is called 'Is the Devil good, and God evil?'. Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I am not really comfortable discussing creationism and science in the same conversation. The former is based on ignorance. If it ever turned out that the universe was 'created', creationists will not be able to claim any sort of victory. Their beliefs are not based on an investigation but rather something akin to a lucky guess. The other possibility, in that case, would be that aliens told humans about it years ago and that knowledge got filtered into the ancient texts. Science is above what those with agendas make of discoveries. All that matters is the evidence. Speculation is fine, as long as it's presented as such. Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 9.29pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

20 Jun 18 9.28pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I am familiar with the experiments but I have no idea what it means and nor does anyone else it seems.

Perhaps you should download that video and watch it about twenty times like I did. It's freaking mind blowing.

It's a piece of the puzzle.

It suggests determinism. What that means as a larger picture?....well like we both agree, it's unknown at this time.

What exactly is meant by determinism, and what this leads to.....Well, the generations to come have exciting times.

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

What is important in the context of this thread is that it is science and not superstition.

With respect Hrolf my friend, the thread is called 'Is the Devil good, and God evil?'.

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I am not really comfortable discussing creationism and science in the same conversation. The former is based on ignorance.
If it ever turned out that the universe was 'created', creationists will not be able to claim any sort of victory. Their beliefs are not based on an investigation but rather something akin to a lucky guess. The other possibility, in that case, would be that aliens told humans about it years ago and that knowledge got filtered into the ancient texts.

Science is above what those with agendas make of discoveries. All that matters is the evidence.

Speculation is fine, as long as it's presented as such.

Edited by Stirlingsays (20 Jun 2018 9.29pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Hrolf The Ganger 20 Jun 18 10.58pm
I suppose the thread title does allow for just about anything. I will indeed look at the video but quantum mechanics is baffling to even the most brilliant minds. It creates more questions than answers.
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Hrolf The Ganger

20 Jun 18 10.58pm

I suppose the thread title does allow for just about anything.

I will indeed look at the video but quantum mechanics is baffling to even the most brilliant minds. It creates more questions than answers.

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Hrolf The Ganger 21 Jun 18 12.10am
OK. I watched it and my conclusion is that I find it difficult to believe in instantaneous reactions like the twining of particles. That would imply that they occur faster than light and this would mean that you could change causality. It would also mean that you could effect matter across an infinite distance. That can't be true, can it? It would break all kinds of physical laws.
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Hrolf The Ganger

21 Jun 18 12.10am

OK. I watched it and my conclusion is that I find it difficult to believe in instantaneous reactions like the twining of particles. That would imply that they occur faster than light and this would mean that you could change causality. It would also mean that you could effect matter across an infinite distance.
That can't be true, can it? It would break all kinds of physical laws.

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Stirlingsays 21 Jun 18 6.19am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger OK. I watched it and my conclusion is that I find it difficult to believe in instantaneous reactions like the twining of particles. That would imply that they occur faster than light and this would mean that you could change causality. It would also mean that you could effect matter across an infinite distance. That can't be true, can it? It would break all kinds of physical laws. One of the most popular attempts at squaring the macro and micro worlds is the theory of a holographic universe. Here is a friendly look at this. If you don't want to watch the whole thing the main idea starts at 6 minutes. [Link] Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Jun 2018 6.24am) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

21 Jun 18 6.19am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

One of the most popular attempts at squaring the macro and micro worlds is the theory of a holographic universe.

Here is a friendly look at this. If you don't want to watch the whole thing the main idea starts at 6 minutes.

[Link]

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Jun 2018 6.24am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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mr. apollo Somewhere in Switzerland 21 Jun 18 8.25am
God-GoOd Devil-(D)evil Edited by mr. apollo (21 Jun 2018 8.25am) Glad All Over
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mr. apollo

Somewhere in Switzerland 21 Jun 18 8.25am

God-GoOd
Devil-(D)evil

Edited by mr. apollo (21 Jun 2018 8.25am)

Glad

All

Over

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Hrolf The Ganger 21 Jun 18 10.54am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays One of the most popular attempts at squaring the macro and micro worlds is the theory of a holographic universe. Here is a friendly look at this. If you don't want to watch the whole thing the main idea starts at 6 minutes. [Link] Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Jun 2018 6.24am) I was never good at maths so I would probably struggle to get through the mathematical formulas. That is why I am not a physicist. I suspect that 'reality' is prosaic and the only exciting thing about it is that we don't understand it. When one considers theoretical physics as a layman, it tends to makes existence feel pointless. Understanding the maths probably won't help either. This is why I believe that we have to attach significance to things on a personal level within the realm that we can affect and that affects us directly as human beings. To think beyond that is rather pointless. If we have a greater purpose, which I seriously doubt, then we are just a tiny piece of the jigsaw. We really should just worry about our tiny realm and very short lasting stay in it and not the nature of our reality. Some choose faith to add significance to their lives but I have never been satisfied with religious delusions as I know them to be the result of ignorance and conditioning. If we are looking for some greater meaning to our existence or the ultimate answers using maths, I think we will be very disappointed. It's the little things that really matter to us, not the bigger picture, whatever that might be. Whether I am living in a projection or not shouldn't bother me. It's fine to have knowledge for knowledge sake and if that has practical application, all the better, but existential questions are the humans burden and most human minds, if not all, are probably just not capable of understanding. I still like it that people want to dedicate their lives to knowing for the rest of us and us humans are an inquisitive bunch, but I am comfortable knowing that I will never really know what it was all for. A bit of mystery is a good thing, so we should rejoice.
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Hrolf The Ganger

21 Jun 18 10.54am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

One of the most popular attempts at squaring the macro and micro worlds is the theory of a holographic universe.

Here is a friendly look at this. If you don't want to watch the whole thing the main idea starts at 6 minutes.

[Link]

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Jun 2018 6.24am)

I was never good at maths so I would probably struggle to get through the mathematical formulas. That is why I am not a physicist.

I suspect that 'reality' is prosaic and the only exciting thing about it is that we don't understand it.
When one considers theoretical physics as a layman, it tends to makes existence feel pointless. Understanding the maths probably won't help either. This is why I believe that we have to attach significance to things on a personal level within the realm that we can affect and that affects us directly as human beings. To think beyond that is rather pointless. If we have a greater purpose, which I seriously doubt, then we are just a tiny piece of the jigsaw. We really should just worry about our tiny realm and very short lasting stay in it and not the nature of our reality.

Some choose faith to add significance to their lives but I have never been satisfied with religious delusions as I know them to be the result of ignorance and conditioning. If we are looking for some greater meaning to our existence or the ultimate answers using maths, I think we will be very disappointed. It's the little things that really matter to us, not the bigger picture, whatever that might be. Whether I am living in a projection or not shouldn't bother me.

It's fine to have knowledge for knowledge sake and if that has practical application, all the better, but existential questions are the humans burden and most human minds, if not all, are probably just not capable of understanding. I still like it that people want to dedicate their lives to knowing for the rest of us and us humans are an inquisitive bunch, but I am comfortable knowing that I will never really know what it was all for.

A bit of mystery is a good thing, so we should rejoice.

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Stirlingsays 21 Jun 18 10.56am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I was never good at maths so I would probably struggle to get through the mathematical formulas. That is why I am not a physicist. I suspect that 'reality' is prosaic and the only exciting thing about it is that we don't understand it. When one considers theoretical physics as a layman, it tends to makes existence feel pointless. Understanding the maths probably won't help either. This is why I believe that we have to attach significance to things on a personal level within the realm that we can affect and that affects us directly as human beings. To think beyond that is rather pointless. If we have a greater purpose, which I seriously doubt, then we are just a tiny piece of the jigsaw. We really should just worry about our tiny realm and very short lasting stay in it and not the nature of our reality. Some choose faith to add significance to their lives but I have never been satisfied with religious delusions as I know them to be the result of ignorance and conditioning. If we are looking for some greater meaning to our existence or the ultimate answers using maths, I think we will be very disappointed. It's the little things that really matter to us, not the bigger picture, whatever that might be. Whether I am living in a projection or not shouldn't bother me. It's fine to have knowledge for knowledge sake and if that has practical application, all the better, but existential questions are the humans burden and most human minds, if not all, are probably just not capable of understanding. I still like it that people want to dedicate their lives to knowing for the rest of us and us humans are an inquisitive bunch, but I am comfortable knowing that I will never really know what it was all for. A bit of mystery is a good thing, so we should rejoice. A good and thoughtful post. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

21 Jun 18 10.56am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I was never good at maths so I would probably struggle to get through the mathematical formulas. That is why I am not a physicist.

A bit of mystery is a good thing, so we should rejoice.

A good and thoughtful post.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Hrolf The Ganger 21 Jun 18 11.08am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays A good and thoughtful post. I just read through it again and I thought it was total waffle.
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Hrolf The Ganger

21 Jun 18 11.08am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

A good and thoughtful post.

I just read through it again and I thought it was total waffle.

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Stirlingsays 21 Jun 18 11.44am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I just read through it again and I thought it was total waffle. A lot of philosophy is described as such, but I liked it anyway. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

21 Jun 18 11.44am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I just read through it again and I thought it was total waffle.

A lot of philosophy is described as such, but I liked it anyway.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Strolling bones Hastings 21 Jun 18 12.38pm
My favourite theory is that they are one of the same person . Which suits me as if I'm going upstairs all is good, if I'm going downstairs maybe all is better ..
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Strolling bones

Hastings 21 Jun 18 12.38pm

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My favourite theory is that they are one of the same person . Which suits me as if I'm going upstairs all is good, if I'm going downstairs maybe all is better ..

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