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February 20 2019 1.39am

Soros György

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 24 Dec 18 7.27pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

I see you learned your philosophy from Eric C*ntona.

You're probably not a million miles off.

Originally posted by Mapletree

We have had the discussion before about two years ago. Mods will intervene for extreme abuse.

Slow, steady drip online abuse flies under the radar.

Anyway, it's about time you bought me a pint. You going to the Grimsby match?

Well, I'll concede that it's not perfect but I worry more about the cure.....as they say, the difference between medicine and poison is often found in the dose.

I would like to go to the Grimsby match but while the boys are still so young it's difficult.

At some point though I'll buy you guys a tipple.

 

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View pefwin's Profile pefwin Flag Where you have to have an English ... 24 Dec 18 9.00pm Send a Private Message to pefwin Add pefwin as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree


Anyway, it's about time you bought me a pint. You going to the Grimsby match?

He is probably at the theatre of dreams, you know the kids' team.

Edited by pefwin (24 Dec 2018 9.01pm)

 


"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 25 Dec 18 12.22am Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Well, I'll concede that it's not perfect but I worry more about the cure.....as they say, the difference between medicine and poison is often found in the dose.

I would like to go to the Grimsby match but while the boys are still so young it's difficult.

At some point though I'll buy you guys a tipple.

Well, there's only one of me. Again, the effects of too much Budweiser perhaps.

In any case, I shall look forward to that. Happy Christmas.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 25 Dec 18 12.29am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Well, there's only one of me. Again, the effects of too much Budweiser perhaps.

In any case, I shall look forward to that. Happy Christmas.


You haven't been the only guy whose come up with that idea Maple me lad. I'm writing to the collective....I'd have thought all left of centre chaps could appreciate that one.

Merry Mince Pie and here's to a not too severe headache on boxing day.

 

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steve1984 25 Dec 18 11.55am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

At some point though I'll buy you guys a tipple.

Kind of you to offer. However and to my considerable shame, my last trip to the home of football was more than a decade ago and I have no plans to remedy the situation.

(I'm also a desperate alcoholic and so I keep my consumption to the bare minimum.)

PS I thought your response on the subject of Soros was particularly poor. I'll respond in due course but now I have to take the dogs for a walk.

Edited by steve1984 (25 Dec 2018 12.15pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 25 Dec 18 10.02pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by steve1984

Kind of you to offer. However and to my considerable shame, my last trip to the home of football was more than a decade ago and I have no plans to remedy the situation.

(I'm also a desperate alcoholic and so I keep my consumption to the bare minimum.)

PS I thought your response on the subject of Soros was particularly poor. I'll respond in due course but now I have to take the dogs for a walk.

Edited by steve1984 (25 Dec 2018 12.15pm)

Sometimes life just gets in the way of enjoying your team to the extent you'd prefer.

Yep, alcohol is an unforgiving missus if you use her regularly....hic.

I find the Soros thing boring.....not unimportant but just boring. That's cool though, we shall await your reply.

Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Dec 2018 10.03pm)

 

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steve1984 26 Dec 18 11.27am

Boring in and of itself? That's good. I see that your criticism of Soros is reasonably measured and you're disinclined to demonise him.

So rather than bore you with an extensive reply I'll limit myself to the infamous run on the pound debacle which according to you makes him an arsehole.

You say that..

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Whether something is over valued or not is neither here nor there.

And then almost immediately go on to say..

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Capitalism has been the most successful system we have because it works with human nature and rewards meritocracy...though the downside to that can be the over exploitation of the vulnerable...

There's a considerable contradiction in these two statements. Whether or not capitalism is the most successful system is subjective opinion, I guess it probably is. But irrespective of opinion, nobody can deny that it is the dominant force.

Capitalism is built on the principal of economic freedom. The freedom to borrow, invest, produce, buy and finally sell in a "free" market. So whether or not something is over or under valued is far from irrelevant. Rather it is one of the core economic principles upon which the entire economic system is based.

Calling someone an arsehole for being a successful capitalist is somewhat at odds with your description of capitalism as the most successful system we have.

Perhaps you see Soros as a kind of 21st Century mill owner? Exploiting his workforce and damaging the local environment. I get that. But then you go onto say that the fault lies (partly) in the absence of suitable regulation..

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Like all systems comprised of humans it's only as good as its regulation and those running the regulation.

It seems to me at least, that herein lies the main reason we struggle to evaluate the economy through the prism of left & right economic theory. Regulation essentially acknowledges the fact that left to its own devices capitalism doesn't work in everyone's best interest.

The tories are basically capitalists and see themselves as champions of (economic) freedom. Socialists by comparison are the champions of fairness and regulation is one of their instruments.

Soros sits smack in the middle of these two conflicting political ideologies. On the one hand he's the capitalist's capitalist but on the other hand his USD18bn donations to various foundations, makes him the archetypal socialist.

At its heart, free market capitalism works on the principle that might is right. It promotes inequality and unfairness.

In attempting to deliver fairness, socialism places limitations on freedom.

My opinion of Soros is that I'm happy that the man recognises this contradiction. I'm happy that whilst working within the strictures of the existing system he chooses to give away his wealth to what he considers to be worthy causes. But in the final analysis he is merely a product of his (or more like our) environment. An environment that is long overdue a complete overhaul.


Edited by steve1984 (26 Dec 2018 5.00pm)

 

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View Penge Eagle's Profile Penge Eagle Flag Beckenham 26 Dec 18 6.27pm Send a Private Message to Penge Eagle Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Penge Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by steve1984

Boring in and of itself? That's good. I see that your criticism of Soros is reasonably measured and you're disinclined to demonise him.

So rather than bore you with an extensive reply I'll limit myself to the infamous run on the pound debacle which according to you makes him an arsehole.

You say that..

It seems to me at least, that herein lies the main reason we struggle to evaluate the economy through the prism of left & right economic theory. Regulation essentially acknowledges the fact that left to its own devices capitalism doesn't work in everyone's best interest.

The tories are basically capitalists and see themselves as champions of (economic) freedom. Socialists by comparison are the champions of fairness and regulation is one of their instruments.

Soros sits smack in the middle of these two conflicting political ideologies. On the one hand he's the capitalist's capitalist but on the other hand his USD18bn donations to various foundations, makes him the archetypal socialist.

At its heart, free market capitalism works on the principle that might is right. It promotes inequality and unfairness.

In attempting to deliver fairness, socialism places limitations on freedom.

My opinion of Soros is that I'm happy that the man recognises this contradiction. I'm happy that whilst working within the strictures of the existing system he chooses to give away his wealth to what he considers to be worthy causes. But in the final analysis he is merely a product of his (or more like our) environment. An environment that is long overdue a complete overhaul.


Edited by steve1984 (26 Dec 2018 5.00pm)

And the better system to capitalism is...?

 

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steve1984 26 Dec 18 7.45pm

I'm not the bloody messiah but any fool can see what's wrong with capitalism.

The change from feudalism to capitalism wasn't led by some bloke saying "come on guys let's do it this way instead it might be better".

So the short answer is "I'm f***ed if I know".

But in order for it to be better, it will need to provide both freedom and fairness without the one being in perpetual conflict with the other.

But I think it's reasonable to suggest that the constant boom / bust cycle of capitalism, coupled with the continued economic exploitation of the world's finite resources and the damage that is doing to the environment will at some point lead to massive changes. Probably violent changes.

I doubt very much whether any of us will be around to see what happens afterwards.

 

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View pefwin's Profile pefwin Flag Where you have to have an English ... 26 Dec 18 8.22pm Send a Private Message to pefwin Add pefwin as a friend

Originally posted by steve1984

I'm not the bloody messiah but any fool can see what's wrong with capitalism.

The change from feudalism to capitalism wasn't led by some bloke saying "come on guys let's do it this way instead it might be better".

So the short answer is "I'm f***ed if I know".

But in order for it to be better, it will need to provide both freedom and fairness without the one being in perpetual conflict with the other.

But I think it's reasonable to suggest that the constant boom / bust cycle of capitalism, coupled with the continued economic exploitation of the world's finite resources and the damage that is doing to the environment will at some point lead to massive changes. Probably violent changes.

I doubt very much whether any of us will be around to see what happens afterwards.

oddly enough, shorter memories on here than Tw@tter users but nobody could define capitalism.

 


"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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steve1984 26 Dec 18 8.25pm

Originally posted by pefwin

oddly enough, shorter memories on here than Tw@tter users but nobody could define capitalism.

you wot?

 

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View pefwin's Profile pefwin Flag Where you have to have an English ... 26 Dec 18 8.27pm Send a Private Message to pefwin Add pefwin as a friend

Originally posted by steve1984

you wot?

the ability to define wot capitalism actual is.

?comprende?

 


"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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