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 berlinpalace  berlin 23 Feb 19 2.32pm |
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Originally posted by ChrisGC
Incorrect by some margin, so a fib rather than a fact. The ratio is exactly 1:1 this season, being 13 defeats and 13 "non-defeats". If we lose today (which I hope we don't), the statement is true. Edited by ChrisGC (23 Feb 2019 1.11pm) Edited by ChrisGC (23 Feb 2019 1.17pm) The facts are that he has only lost around two hundred out of seven hundred career games. Even his Palace career is considerably better than the 1:1 you claim.
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CB  23 Feb 19 2.48pm |
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Originally posted by ChrisGC Maybe that washes once motivationally: "it's ok lad, you did as you were told and it didn't work out, we'll work on it for next time" but every week? It's pure belligerence. Basically Wodgson and his staff are valuing obedience over talent as it protects their authority and therefore their jobs. There is some merit in this, but the balance should be loyalty and talent. We would easily be top ten if he didn't wait 15-20 games for players to come good or just keep picking the same trusty carthorses over a bit of flare. And in terms of respect within the game? I've heard plenty of ex players on podcasts and in the media who speak negatively about his style. He's extremely one dimensional and predictable, no matter how good the passing and positional discipline has looked at times.
He does move players in and out of the team but clearly he has the people he thinks always work to the game plan. All managers have that and I don't think I can criticise that. He seems to feel we do not have enough about us (in whatever way) to play more openly - we might disagree with that as fans or not but as has been said we are competitive in almost every game and have not had a slapping yet so for me he is getting it right. He has his style and I agree with you he doesn't wholesale change it (I would not expect him to) but I think it is unfair to suggest he is totally inflexible - he doesn't just pick the same 11 (I know you didn't say he did), there is some scope for adjustment in personnel and style depending on the games, and remember when forced to "innovate" he managed to conjure up that win against Chelsea with no strikers / Andros and Wilf as strikers. It's pretty clear to me he is a very good manager, is suited to smaller clubs who do not dominate games and while his limits are probably finishing 8th at best (maybe 6th if we got very lucky) that is pretty good. We are a solid but creative team, we do not kick people to win and we do not rely on sheer physicality either - it's a pretty good balance imo.
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ChrisGC  Wantage 23 Feb 19 3.09pm |
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Originally posted by CB
He does move players in and out of the team but clearly he has the people he thinks always work to the game plan. All managers have that and I don't think I can criticise that. He seems to feel we do not have enough about us (in whatever way) to play more openly - we might disagree with that as fans or not but as has been said we are competitive in almost every game and have not had a slapping yet so for me he is getting it right. He has his style and I agree with you he doesn't wholesale change it (I would not expect him to) but I think it is unfair to suggest he is totally inflexible - he doesn't just pick the same 11 (I know you didn't say he did), there is some scope for adjustment in personnel and style depending on the games, and remember when forced to "innovate" he managed to conjure up that win against Chelsea with no strikers / Andros and Wilf as strikers. It's pretty clear to me he is a very good manager, is suited to smaller clubs who do not dominate games and while his limits are probably finishing 8th at best (maybe 6th if we got very lucky) that is pretty good. We are a solid but creative team, we do not kick people to win and we do not rely on sheer physicality either - it's a pretty good balance imo. Fair point, well made. All I'd challenge is the flexibility angle: I don't remember him really making a change unless forced to by injury or suspension.
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| ChrisGC Wantage 23 Feb 19 3.18pm |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
The facts are that he has only lost around two hundred out of seven hundred career games. Even his Palace career is considerably better than the 1:1 you claim. No it isn't. The ratio is exactly 1:1, the win rate considerably less. All games played so far is 35 not lost, 29 lost. Very close to the 1:1 of this season. As for the 200 loses in 695 games? Of those 695 he's won 315. 98 of those, nearly a third of his entire victory total, were with Malmö. In the 80s.
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| herefordeagle Hereford 23 Feb 19 3.19pm |
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Difficult one for me. I find myself wanting him out one minute and not the next. I've had opinions of various managers over the past few years. Freedman was doing okay results wise but was absolutely awful to watch whereas in his short tenure I really enjoyed watching the football that Burley had us playing / trying to play but the opposition more often than not scored more than we did. People have mixed opinions of Warnock but I can't help but like him and his time here despite the mixed results. Was a shocker under De Boer and I do believe that things would've come good but I can understand the decision to sack him...which brings me back to Roy, our performances can be inconsistent which can be down to the players, his team selections can often really frustrate me but he sees them training which can play a big part in his decision making and his use or lack of use of substitutions either at all or at what seems to be the right time can often boil my blood. For me, even after what's around a year and a half in the job the jury is still out. We've had a cup run and had some fantastic results, notably City away, but the fact we find ourselves so close to the bottom three is concerning, we could yet finish anywhere from 8th to 18th realistically and I think then, in May, is when he should be judges at the end of his first full season. Sorry for the essay, had a few beers again on preparation for the game!
"It's ok postman , he'll lick you to death" "That isn't really that comforting , I still end up dead !!" |
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| Booted Eagle Bristol 23 Feb 19 4.33pm |
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Showed an analysis on the BBC of various teams he had managed with points to game ratios and Palace out of 5 was the lowest. It was a tad higher than 1 in 1, which is usually enough to keep us in the PL. Suggests he might have more in his locker though. Happy to have him stay for next season as he seems an honest, well informed, eloquent, humble manager. If we wish to really improve probably need a decent scout/s who can find some cheap diamonds in the rough. Edited by Booted Eagle (23 Feb 2019 4.34pm) Edited by Booted Eagle (23 Feb 2019 4.35pm)
“ [T]here are known knowns; there are things we know that we know.There are known unknowns; that is to say there are things that, we now know we don't know.But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know. ” |
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DutchEagleJohan  Vlissingen, Netherlands 23 Feb 19 4.52pm |
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Surely the vast majority of us remember his unbelievable achievement of keeping us up after the failure of last seasons's Dutch vanity project. Does not mean we all agree on everything, how could we; but genuinely I think respect among the fans is huge. As it should be. Originally posted by jjsperling
People on here slag on and on about Roy on how he's toothless and never tries anything exciting. But the truth of the matter is that were one of the most structured teams in the league and that comes down to Roy
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| berlinpalace berlin 23 Feb 19 5.39pm |
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Originally posted by ChrisGC
No it isn't. The ratio is exactly 1:1, the win rate considerably less. All games played so far is 35 not lost, 29 lost. Very close to the 1:1 of this season. As for the 200 loses in 695 games? Of those 695 he's won 315. 98 of those, nearly a third of his entire victory total, were with Malmö. In the 80s. Just going from English clubs where he has had more than fifty games you have 314 games and 118 losses. Clearly better than a 1:1 ratio over a long period of time. He is remarkably consistent in a competitive environment.
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| Rachid Rachid Rachid 23 Feb 19 8.04pm |
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Originally posted by davehuggins
If anybody believes we have ever (in the PL) this term played better and more control football under another manager please speak up. For me, I just wish RH was 20 years younger and willing to sign a new 5-year contract. Thanks Roy from me. Well said that man. Game changing moment James McArthur selling two Leicester players and putting the ball on sixpence for Wilf.
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| windsoreagle Windsor 23 Feb 19 8.09pm |
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...and better than 1:1 ratio after todays great showing away against Leicester? Our aggregate against them in the last two games is 9-2 I think.
The power of the Executive to cast a man into prison without formulating any charge known to the law, and particularly to deny him the judgment of his peers, is in the highest degree odious and is the foundation of all totalitarian government whether Nazi or Communist. |
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| PalazioVecchio south pole 23 Feb 19 8.40pm |
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Croydon Roy , il est le Roy.
Eze Peasy at Anfield.... |
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NickinOX  Sailing country. 24 Feb 19 2.22am |
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Originally posted by windsoreagle
...and better than 1:1 ratio after todays great showing away against Leicester? Our aggregate against them in the last two games is 9-2 I think. Agreed. 1.44:1 win and draw/loss ratio since he arrived. 1.21 points per game. That includes sorting out a shocking mess, virtually no money, no functioning strikers, and a major injury crisis last year. Yes, he must be s*** because "Kane on corners..." nuff said. Edited by NickinOX (24 Feb 2019 2.31am)
If you come to a fork in the road, take it. |
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