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June 19 2019 6.13am

New Zealand shooting at mosques

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 15 Mar 19 4.06pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Pussay Patrol

It's all because of the disgusting right wing narrative of division, walls and getting people to hate on other people, politicians also to blame with posters saying breaking point

Do you have to try and make political capital out of everything?

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 4.09pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

All of the usual stuff on birth rates, genetics, takeover of our culture etc.

No, Iím not suggesting that at all - Iím suggesting that someone who routinely blames the left for consequences of their beliefs, who fails to recognise the consequence of their own, is a hypocrite.


So the truth is responsible for these murders? Weird way of thinking about it.....What are you suggesting? That people shut up?

When the next Islamic attack happens.....are you going to suggest that we close down Mosques because that's where the twisted motivations originated from?


Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Mar 2019 4.10pm)

 

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View dollardays's Profile dollardays Flag 15 Mar 19 4.12pm Send a Private Message to dollardays Add dollardays as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You are on this site saying, words to the effect, that it doesn't matter if white people or indeed, you must have meant all races, are mixed out of existence


Really? You're going to give the, 'if only we could get along' message? How many examples throughout history do you need?

I would suggest that it is this attitude that provides far more motivation for morons like this guy than anything else.



I've said nothing about wanting anyone mixed out of existence. I've just stated that I don't care if people I know are mixed race or white. They are not less 'of this place' to me as a result if they are born here and I'm not doing a colour count. That's it. There are more white people and indeed most other races than have ever existed in the history of the world anyway. I specifically suggested in the very message you replied to that I want immigration to be limited through Brexit because of societal issues it causes. That's hardly the attitude of someone who wants to let the world in. It's about getting along with whoever is already here where possible.

At the end of the day I hold and express a nuanced view and you follow or followed a white resistance group on social media that is off it's nut and is followed by people who actually self identify as extremists in their profiles and make incredibly out there comments, so I hardly think I need to listen to you find fault with my mundane outlook. To say that anything in my post or outlook in any way motivates acts of terror is clearly ludicrous. You're acting out because of the particular flavour of this act of extremism. Blame the individual. I have no need to paint any of these scumbags, whatever the ideology, as anything other than what they are.

I'm happy with my post as a whole which is below, rather than you picking out the few select bits you disagree with about aspiring to get along to leap to a conclusion where I'm partially responsible for the motivations of people like this guy. My proximity to individuals like this man is ancient oceans wide.

--------------

Original Message

A sickening act.


I'm pleased I've criticised both religious extremism and racial resistance groups on here. It's all too easy online to plug into these fringe movements or to go down an us vs them road to radicalisation. This guy announced what he was going to do before posting his muddled and cliched 'white genecide' ethno state manifesto on a chan site, live streaming his heinous acts to anyone interested. It's important to see the dignity in all, not get warped ideas about who does and doesn't truly belong in their own country. The regular focus on genetic themed racial stuff that is suddenly ever present on here for instance is alienating, unhelpful and a rung on the ladder this leads nowhere pleasant.

Hrolf makes a good point about how violence begets violence. Previous attacks add weight to the likelihood of attacks like this, and this in turn will no doubt tip some religious radical over the edge. I've never been for mass immigration, making a country only about benefiting elites through cheap labour. It does have an impact on stability of a country and can cause friction within communities. Religion can complicate and result in insular communities that hold age old beliefs detached from that of the country. Possibly Brexit will put the breaks on things if it actually ever happens. Even if it does though, it's important to remember that at that point the country is what it is. People still have to learn to get along in peace and to try to find commonality rather than differences no matter how hard or futile that may sometimes appear. We see here what the alternative to doing that is.


Edited by dollardays (15 Mar 2019 4.21pm)

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 15 Mar 19 4.19pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

All of the usual stuff on birth rates, genetics, takeover of our culture etc.

No, Iím not suggesting that at all - Iím suggesting that someone who routinely blames the left for consequences of their beliefs, who fails to recognise the consequence of their own, is a hypocrite.

It's easy to oversimplify on a message board.

I lay blame with the Left for being the useful idiot for those that promote mass immigration and multiculture for their own ends despite it causing many problems for the people they traditionally represent.

I believe that all the ideas you list are perfectly reasonable and demonstratable. None of this is justification for murdering innocent people in the same way that Islamist atrocities cannot be justified.

For me, the bottom line is that all of this is predictable when you put incompatible cultures together.
You don't have to be an extremist to see that but it is an environment where extremism will breed.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (15 Mar 2019 4.21pm)

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 15 Mar 19 4.28pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


So the truth is responsible for these murders? Weird way of thinking about it.....What are you suggesting? That people shut up?

When the next Islamic attack happens.....are you going to suggest that we close down Mosques because that's where the twisted motivations originated from?


Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Mar 2019 4.10pm)

Thatís your truth; I canít be bothered to recycle a debate thatís been had 100 times, but everyone believes their view to be the truth, hence why they believe it.

Iím not suggesting anything of the sort; just pointing out the hypocrisy of you saying the media are lying to put blame on the right, when you readily lay blame to the left.

Letís be clear; Iíve never suggested closing down anything, just highlighted an inconsistency.

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 15 Mar 19 4.33pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

It's easy to oversimplify on a message board.

I lay blame with the Left for being the useful idiot for those that promote mass immigration and multiculture for their own ends despite it causing many problems for the people they traditionally represent.

I believe that all the ideas you list are perfectly reasonable and demonstratable. None of this is justification for murdering innocent people in the same way that Islamist atrocities cannot be justified.

For me, the bottom line is that all of this is predictable when you put incompatible cultures together.
You don't have to be an extremist to see that but it is an environment where extremism will breed.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (15 Mar 2019 4.21pm)

Iím sure there are nuanced differences in his beliefs and those expressed on here, but the key ideas are the same.

I have no issue with you laying blame on the left for some of the reasons raised, but itís not a competition - my post was more to highlight that there are dangerous consequences of both sides of the debate, and I struggle to see how you could argue itís a lie that right-wing politics has played a part here.

 

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View dollardays's Profile dollardays Flag 15 Mar 19 4.37pm Send a Private Message to dollardays Add dollardays as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Thatís your truth; I canít be bothered to recycle a debate thatís been had 100 times, but everyone believes their view to be the truth, hence why they believe it.

Iím not suggesting anything of the sort; just pointing out the hypocrisy of you saying the media are lying to put blame on the right, when you readily lay blame to the left.

Letís be clear; Iíve never suggested closing down anything, just highlighted an inconsistency.

I've seen muslims committing acts of terror declared not 'real muslims' by people on account of their actions and so those communities have no need to reflect. They should. We don't need to sugar coat it.

This individual had a clear, consistent and repeated thread of angry racial ideology that ran through his manafesto, so we don't need to cobble together reasons to ignore that either.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 15 Mar 19 4.40pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Thatís your truth; I canít be bothered to recycle a debate thatís been had 100 times, but everyone believes their view to be the truth, hence why they believe it.

Iím not suggesting anything of the sort; just pointing out the hypocrisy of you saying the media are lying to put blame on the right, when you readily lay blame to the left.

Letís be clear; Iíve never suggested closing down anything, just highlighted an inconsistency.

When Islamists kill people we are told that Islam is not to blame. So how are people who hold a particular view responsible for this?

I don't agree that a belief is the same as the factual truth. If something can be demonstrated then it is a fact and not just a somebodies 'truth'.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (15 Mar 2019 4.40pm)

 

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View laddo's Profile laddo Flag london 15 Mar 19 4.40pm Send a Private Message to laddo Add laddo as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Tommy Robinson doesn't kill people that he doesn't agree with

True, that little prick instead indoctrinates others to do his dirty work. No better than Choudry. Cut. From. Same. Cowardly. Cloth.

 


laddo

"People say, live fast, die young. I say live fast, die old. That's me, the non-conformist".
David Brent.

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 15 Mar 19 4.43pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

When Islamists kill people we are told that Islam is not to blame. So how are people who hold a particular view responsible for this?

I don't agree that a belief is the same as the factual truth. If something can be demonstrated then it is a fact and not just a somebodies 'truth'.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (15 Mar 2019 4.40pm)

And yet in those cases, you are the first to argue the ideology is to blame...

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 15 Mar 19 4.44pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Iím sure there are nuanced differences in his beliefs and those expressed on here, but the key ideas are the same.

I have no issue with you laying blame on the left for some of the reasons raised, but itís not a competition - my post was more to highlight that there are dangerous consequences of both sides of the debate, and I struggle to see how you could argue itís a lie that right-wing politics has played a part here.

If something is a fact then it is neither Right wing or Left wing. These are merely labels.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 4.45pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by dollardays

I've said nothing about wanting anyone mixed out of existence. I've just stated that I don't care if people I know are mixed race or white.

A distinction without a difference.

You like to portray this idea that I'm against people who are born mixed. I'm not, I'm simply aware of my own identity and don't wish to see it lost. That's what's happening and that's the extent of it.


Originally posted by dollardays

They are not less 'of this place' to me as a result if they are born here and I'm not doing a colour count. That's it. There are more white people and indeed most other races than have ever existed in the history of the world anyway. I specifically suggested in the very message you replied to that I want immigration to be limited through Brexit because of societal issues it causes. That's hardly the attitude of someone who wants to let the world in. It's about getting along with whoever is already here where possible.

You are talking pure naivety. You may not care about identity but a large part of the human race do. You have no right to belittle their preference for their own in group because of your ideology.

Like I said, what this guy has done is monstrous and if I had been there I would have tried to stop him. However when it comes to what is likely to have angered him....it would be by reading views telling him that his identity doesn't matter.


Originally posted by dollardays


At the end of the day I hold and express a nuanced view and you follow or followed a white resistance group on social media that is off it's nut and is followed by people who actually self identify as extremists in their profiles and make incredibly out there comments, so I hardly think I need to listen to you find fault with my mundane outlook. To say that anything in my post or outlook in any way motivates acts of terror is clearly ludicrous. You're acting out because of the particular flavour of this act of extremism. Blame the individual. I have no need to paint any of these scumbags, whatever the ideology, as anything other than what they are.


Now, anyone else who is bored enough to read down this long post should know something about this guy. He stalked my twitter contacts. He actually went to Twitter and spied on me....that's how pathetic it is.

Anyway, after doing that, he came onto a thread and announced to the world how me following a white identity group was evidence for some insidious character trait or whatever.

Now he didn't mention (like he doesn't here)...or appear interested in the fact that I also follow...among right wingers people like, Bernie Sanders, Barack Obama, old feminists like Christina Sommers, Imman Mohammad Tawhidi, tranny Blaire White, liberals like Dave Rubin and various lefty comedians like Ben Stiller.

But no...it's guilt by association because I'm interested in my identity.


Originally posted by dollardays

I'm happy with my post as a whole which is below, rather than you picking out the few select bits you disagree with about aspiring to get along to leap to a conclusion where I'm partially responsible for the motivations of people like this guy. My proximity to individuals like this man is ancient oceans wide.


Edited by dollardays (15 Mar 2019 4.21pm)

What's wrong with selecting the bits I disagree with.....You want these posts to go on forever?....Your self absorbed posts are already too long. I'm even had to reduce this one.

As for what is likely to have angered this guy....Your opinions on what is important to him are far more likely to anger him far more than mine.

If this guy listened to me, he certainly wouldn't be murdering anyone that's for sure.

He'd never listen to someone telling him his identity doesn't matter.


Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Mar 2019 5.02pm)

 

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