Sir Keir Starmer
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 silvertop  Portishead 20 Apr 21 4.51pm |
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Originally posted by HKOwen
Add in the Shadow Foreign Secretary, Nandy Pandy and the anti semites still hanging around like Burgon and Long-Bailey and they are fooked. Most constituencies still with a Labour MP would vote in a dog turd if you put a red rosette on it.........come to think of it Last election proved otherwise
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| silvertop Portishead 20 Apr 21 4.52pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Last election proved otherwise And you can say the same for the blue side especially rural middle England.
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HKOwen  Hong Kong 20 Apr 21 11.35pm |
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I agree the voting polarisation of the country into urban and rural is clear. That does not explain the Red Wall collapse which was issue driven not historical voting pattern. The argument would be Labour can no longer expect " the workers " to blindly vote for a party which does not reflect their values and aspirations. "Traditional " Labour were not interested in a Corbyn led government that ignored their desire for Brexit and basically disrespected them as stupid racists, and seem equally unimpressed by Starmer so far.
Originally posted by silvertop
And you can say the same for the blue side especially rural middle England.
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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| HKOwen Hong Kong 20 Apr 21 11.37pm |
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" Still " obviously means now, not at the last election. Originally posted by silvertop
Last election proved otherwise
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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| HKOwen Hong Kong 20 Apr 21 11.40pm |
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Agree, and I hope they continue on the same self destructive path. Starmer going to Bath of all places was a good example of his out of touchness ( is that a word ) Originally posted by Matov
Problem for Starmer is that given the scale of the national crisis, it leaves little room for traditional style opposition so he is playing it pretty much right in terms of generally not appearing too critical. But he is not credible but for me that reflects a wider problem for Labour as a whole. Since 2015 they have lost Scotland and now have lost a huge swathe of seats in their traditional heartlands. Brexit has potentially destroyed them as a functioning party with Starmer and his disastrous charge for a second referendum at the very heart of that. Even since 2016 the vast majority of the activists on the left have been slagging off the very people they need to vote for them. They simply do not have the collective intellectual bandwidth to comprehend how out of touch they are. Ever since the 2015 election Labour have been on their knees with only the Corbyn led 2017 surge by way of halting that. Brexit, European Elections, local elections and then the 2019 GE have been disaster after disaster. What can Labour offer anybody now? Its membership and activist base are fundamentally lunatics with all this trans BS and desire for open borders (lets not forget that Labours official policy in 2019 was not only to protect freedom of movement but widen it). They are utterly f***ed. And with boundary changes due to come into effect before 2024, then it moves into the realms of asking what is the point of them anymore? And outside of Starmer who is there? Andy Burnham is the only possible leader I can see having even a chance of turning the tide and he is not even in the PLP. Labour will not achieve a working majority in this decade and if they don't watch it, they might even cease to exist. Identity Dogma has destroyed them and yet still they cheer it on.
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 21 Apr 21 9.51am |
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Perhaps we are witnessing the death of the traditional parties. It seems a lot about Social Media these days. Labour just seem disconnected from their original base. I used to be one, but would never have voted for Corbyn's Labour. The last I liked was John Smith. Starmer is the safe choice, probably has a chance when people are bored with the Tories. Nothing will change until politics is completely overhauled. I can't help but think our current system, in plenty of Western democracies, is not fit for purpose. I presume new parties will emerge, parties that will be more relevant to modern life.
Red and Blue Army! |
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| silvertop Portishead 21 Apr 21 11.25am |
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Originally posted by HKOwen
Agree, and I hope they continue on the same self destructive path. Starmer going to Bath of all places was a good example of his out of touchness ( is that a word ) That's true. Bath swerves from Tory to Lib Dem every election. Labour who? Fight the battles you can win mate.
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| Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 21 Apr 21 11.35am |
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Originally posted by silvertop
That's true. Bath swerves from Tory to Lib Dem every election. Labour who? Fight the battles you can win mate. The Lib Dems gained the seat from the Conservatives in 2017 and held on to it in 2019.
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| orpingtoneagle Orpington 21 Apr 21 11.36am |
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I think it is very hard to be in opposition at the current time as the pandemic has to a great extent taken away business as usual and stifled debate across all parties. Is he the best man for the job? Maybe now is not a fair time to judge anyone but we are stuck with what we have got. Who knows if/when we will return to business as usual of what even usual looks like.
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| Jacey 21 Apr 21 11.48am |
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Originally posted by orpingtoneagle
I think it is very hard to be in opposition at the current time as the pandemic has to a great extent taken away business as usual and stifled debate across all parties. Is he the best man for the job? Maybe now is not a fair time to judge anyone but we are stuck with what we have got. Who knows if/when we will return to business as usual of what even usual looks like. Poor old Keir should give up and go back to being a very effective barrister.
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| steeleye20 Online Croydon 21 Apr 21 11.56am |
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We will certainly not get a green revolution and action on climate change from Westminster. Mote like can-kicking and tory cronyism, with lack-lustre opposition. Like others I can't see the relevance of this institution anymore. My voting leaflet on the London election has plenty of choice from candidates eager to improve London's lot. They seem relevant to London, even the daft ones.
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jeeagles  21 Apr 21 12.13pm |
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Originally posted by Jacey
Poor old Keir should give up and go back to being a very effective barrister. Surrounded by non entities in his shadow cabinet,particularly dreary,dopey people like Dodds,education secretary and Ashworth who all underwent charisma bypass surgery,he was sadly,doomed from the start. Of the three Labour leaders that have won elections since the war. Two were barristers. On matters of conscious he's pretty good. It just seems like Labour have no policy. Their core supporter base has shifted since Momentum took control of the party and the sole intention is to have a throwback socialist labour party who do nothing more than call all conservative voters scum. Starmer's main battle coming up isn't to win an election, he needs to straighten out the party. Corbyn's leadership was akin to Farrage taking control of the Tories and infiltrating it with moronic UKIPpers that have chased out all the talent. Personally, I think what traditional Labour voters want to see is a party that offers pragmatic ideas to support those less well off, policy to match changing technology and economic conditions, a hard line on crime, acceptance of the referendum decision (even reluctantly), and less of this spiteful ideology which seems to be directed at the rich but helps no one. It seems the only solution at the moment is to set up a new party, as Labour won't be escaping the clutches of the lunatics any time soon. Lib Dem are still failing to fill the gap as they just seem too soft on everything, always trying to be a middle man and never being decisive.
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