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 ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 23 Dec 22 3.36pm |
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Originally posted by PalazioVecchio
PR gets you to the parliament in Italy or Ireland. constant Rainbow coalitions , a talking shop. Where nothing ever gets achieved. Its like sitting on a bus with a dozen drivers, all bickering over who has the keys. Currently UK government not keeping anyone happy, even their own supporters. Something needs to change. I also wouldn't call Ireland bickering, more brown envelope or a nudge and a wink. Italy has the Berlusconi problem, but he won't last forever. The UK doesn't need to copy either system. There are myriad systems of voting.
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steeleye20 Online  Croydon 23 Dec 22 4.01pm |
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Originally posted by Badger11
1. As the article states unpicking Brexit from Ukraine and COVID is tricky. I think it is more realistic to look in about 5 years time. For 'bumps in the road' we should look no further than our exit from the EU waterways framework directive. Thank God we are back in control. The target for cleaning up our rivers to clean up their act by 2027, now extended to 2063. 2063 41 more years of living in s***e, a clear and obvious brexit opportunity.
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| footythoughts Beckenham 24 Dec 22 2.44am |
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Originally posted by PalazioVecchio
PR gets you to the parliament in Italy or Ireland. constant Rainbow coalitions , a talking shop. Where nothing ever gets achieved. Its like sitting on a bus with a dozen drivers, all bickering over who has the keys. Maybe, but it also means that people vote for what they actually believe in, rather than strategically. It could result in a government or coalition I don't favour, but realistically I'd go for that over what we have now, as it would reflect society, and that in turn would impact how people next vote. I'm not interested in a limited and contrtived two options that sustain a system that f***s society and the working man up. Let the actual reality of the views of the public rule rather than Rishi Rich. How can it be any worse? Edited by footythoughts (24 Dec 2022 2.46am)
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| The Dolphin 24 Dec 22 8.36am |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
For 'bumps in the road' we should look no further than our exit from the EU waterways framework directive. Thank God we are back in control. The target for cleaning up our rivers to clean up their act by 2027, now extended to 2063. 2063 41 more years of living in s***e, a clear and obvious brexit opportunity. I heard that too - an absolute joke, a disgrace and we should be ashamed.
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 georgenorman Online 24 Dec 22 1.19pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
For 'bumps in the road' we should look no further than our exit from the EU waterways framework directive. Thank God we are back in control. The target for cleaning up our rivers to clean up their act by 2027, now extended to 2063. 2063 41 more years of living in s***e, a clear and obvious brexit opportunity. The point is that, free of EU 'directives'/diktats made up by unelected EU Commissioners, we can make our own rules and regulations for rivers etc.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 24 Dec 22 6.37pm |
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Originally posted by georgenorman
The point is that, free of EU 'directives'/diktats made up by unelected EU Commissioners, we can make our own rules and regulations for rivers etc. It’s this sort of misinformation that resulted in Brexit. The Commission and it’s Commissioners don’t make any law! It proposes ideas but the decisions are taken jointly by the Council and the Parliament.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Stirlingsays 24 Dec 22 8.28pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It’s this sort of misinformation that resulted in Brexit. The Commission and it’s Commissioners don’t make any law! It proposes ideas but the decisions are taken jointly by the Council and the Parliament. It's not misinformation. If it were only a think tank it wouldn't sodding exist. Honestly people like you exist as utter wind ups.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| nead1 24 Dec 22 9.52pm |
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The issue is that he is correct; the Commission - as I strongly suspect you will know - is similar to the Civil Service; influential for sure, but don't make decisions per se.
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| georgenorman Online 24 Dec 22 10.24pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It’s this sort of misinformation that resulted in Brexit. The Commission and it’s Commissioners don’t make any law! It proposes ideas but the decisions are taken jointly by the Council and the Parliament. Of course the unelected Commissioners make the laws. The EU Parliament can only vote against their proposals and in the case of budgetary and foreign policy matters, they can't even do that. MEPs can not propose laws, they have no mean of implementing any policies that they declare in their manifestos. The EU is simply undemocratic.
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| georgenorman Online 24 Dec 22 10.27pm |
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Originally posted by nead1
The issue is that he is correct; the Commission - as I strongly suspect you will know - is similar to the Civil Service; influential for sure, but don't make decisions per se. The EU Commission is nothing like our Civil Service. When did you last see a civil servant at the dispatch box proposing a new law?
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| nead1 24 Dec 22 10.43pm |
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Staff working at the European Commission are part of the European Civil Service - around 32,000 in numbers. They include researchers, lawyers, translators etc. Sound a bit similar to the UK CS?
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| steeleye20 Online Croydon 24 Dec 22 11.10pm |
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Clearly the EU structure has defects when assessed by the normal standards of Western democracy – but I would argue that the British parliament, with its unelected House of Lords and an unrepresentative House of Commons (in terms of the balance of political parties to votes cast), is even less democratic. What does control actually mean if people are not accountable as in the water example try getting any democratic access there. I can't recall anything being foistered on us by the EU either, they bent over backwards to accommodate us. The UK is going through tough times and they could get a lot worse, is about relevance, competence we seem to be detached from reality and isolated.
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