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View ASCPFC's Profile ASCPFC Flag Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 23 Jan 21 1.45pm Send a Private Message to ASCPFC Add ASCPFC as a friend

Originally posted by Cpfc1861

What you mean wait and see we already know your acting like this is Biden first time holding office.

The absolute best was Neil Kinnock's speech. In the UK, you'd never live that down. Looks like it's only taken forty years for everyone in the US to forget.

 


Red and Blue Army!

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BlueJay Flag UK 23 Jan 21 1.50pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Because 'wait and see' was so afforded to Trump wasn't it. So while, on a fairness level I tend to agree with you it kind of sticks in the stomach.

Another problem with 'wait and see' is that the Democrats have made their positions clear for years.

'Did you say this when' style comments are a distraction more than an argument. You're clearly more niche than the majority politically, and you get don't there via 'well on the other hand' outlooks so are hardly on here with balanced appraisals and equal time to approaches and parties you don't like. As such there's little point in getting the spirit level out every time somebody else makes a point.

As for the second point, Republicans under Bush were disastrous with international policy, and the Patriot Act and the like. Sure, the years tick by but Trump isn't a Republican anyway really, so he's no direct judge of the trajectory without his presence. Politicians can tell you their approach but they blow with the wind, so when they get back into power we will see. Often events dictate, but I wouldn't say that the US is especially shy of involving itself in other countries affairs, now, then or ever.

Again, two years in we'll clearly know how war geared this administration, rather than use something two days in that was happening anyway. Personally with the challenges faced I can't see any major new conflicts but of course I may well be entirely wrong.


Edited by BlueJay (23 Jan 2021 1.50pm)

 

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View nead1's Profile nead1 Flag 23 Jan 21 1.51pm Send a Private Message to nead1 Add nead1 as a friend

I have been reading a really interesting book - Putin's People. How the KGB took back Russia and then took on the West. Author is Catherine Belton - a very well respected FT journalist.
The similarities between Putin and Trump are very striking as the book develops and there is a fascinating chapter headed "The Network and Donald Trump" - basically about the extensive involvement of Russians in his business world going back into the 1990's.
For anyone interested, it's well worth a read. My own personal instincts have always been that the links between Trump and Russia are the real skeleton in the cupboard and will ultimately emerge. I guess we are likely to see in the months ahead.

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 23 Jan 21 1.59pm

Originally posted by Cpfc1861

What you mean wait and see we already know your acting like this is Biden first time holding office.

You're getting more 'back to the future' with each comment. None of us can say with any level of certainty what the next four years will bring. You highlighted something you thought shows Biden as a 'war monger' two days into his Presidency, when in fact Trump had done precisely the same thing. A year or two in if Biden has taken the country onto more of a war footing then people will no doubt draw an assessment. Until then it's fantasy. In the current climate with the problems at hand, I don't see much support for foreign conflicts.


 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 23 Jan 21 2.12pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

'Did you say this when' style comments are a distraction more than an argument. You're clearly more niche than the majority politically, and you get don't there via 'well on the other hand' outlooks so are hardly on here with balanced appraisals and equal time to approaches and parties you don't like. As such there's little point in getting the spirit level out every time somebody else makes a point.

Hang on, you talk about a distraction when your very point here is an observation on the person, not on the point.

It's correct to imply that my politics aren't aligned with the failure of centralism.

However observations are valid on their own merits, as truth doesn't have a preferred speaker.

Originally posted by BlueJay

As for the second point, Republicans under Bush were disastrous with international policy, and the Patriot Act and the like. Sure, the years tick by but Trump isn't a Republican anyway really, so he's no direct judge of the trajectory without his presence. Politicians can tell you their approach but they blow with the wind, so when they get back into power we will see. Often events dictate, but I wouldn't say that the US is especially shy of involving itself in other countries affairs, now, then or ever.

Again, two years in we'll clearly know how war geared this administration, rather than use something two days in that was happening anyway. Personally with the challenges faced I can't see any major new conflicts but of course I may well be entirely wrong.

Edited by BlueJay (23 Jan 2021 1.50pm)

Well, in my view you haven't really addressed the points.

The contention being made is that a Biden administration is a worse outcome in many ways than having Trump there. Many posters, you included, were carried away with what I'd describe as hyperbolic TDS distractions and were happy to welcome in these ideological fools as your preferred option.

I'll cede on the two years for a proper appraisal.....though as previously stated this wasn't given to Trump.

However, this doesn't mean we won't be commenting on the insidiousness and incompetency that's guaranteed to come.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Jan 2021 2.13pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 23 Jan 21 2.16pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by nead1

I have been reading a really interesting book - Putin's People. How the KGB took back Russia and then took on the West. Author is Catherine Belton - a very well respected FT journalist.
The similarities between Putin and Trump are very striking as the book develops and there is a fascinating chapter headed "The Network and Donald Trump" - basically about the extensive involvement of Russians in his business world going back into the 1990's.
For anyone interested, it's well worth a read. My own personal instincts have always been that the links between Trump and Russia are the real skeleton in the cupboard and will ultimately emerge. I guess we are likely to see in the months ahead.

Have you any idea how much money and time has been spent looking into that?

Tens of millions of dollars and years is the answer.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 23 Jan 21 2.19pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by nead1

I have been reading a really interesting book - Putin's People. How the KGB took back Russia and then took on the West. Author is Catherine Belton - a very well respected FT journalist.

Will look out for that. I must confess Putin fascinates me. I always urge people to seek out his speeches and interviews on You Tube because he always comes across as very reasoned and genuine.

Never quite got why the anti-Russian stance of the West has continued since the wall fell. If people were aware of how NATO went back on what it promised in terms of expansion up to the Russian border (it assured Russia it would not do such a thing) then I suspect Putin might be given a fairer hearing. Instead he functions as this handy bogey man for the West yet he has transformed the lives of millions of Russians and speaks a lot of sense on an entire range of issues.

And Russia is a nation with the GDP of Spain. Yet we are meant to believe it is this huge threat to the West? Nah.

 


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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BlueJay Flag UK 23 Jan 21 2.48pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


Hang on, you talk about a distraction when your very point here is an observation on the person, not on the point.

It's correct to imply that my politics aren't aligned with the failure of centralism.

I can't address the 'you didn't say this when..' style approach, without talking about the contradictions involved in taking it. You're hardly 'giving him time' with regard to the Biden Presidency, much like people didn't with Trump. Difference being that you believe you do so as a reaction to others lowly behaviour and hypocrisy rather than it also being your own. A 'they made me do it, or they did it first' outlook. Of course we can all claim that or emulate the pickings from the trash can of our political opposites, but it may not serve us well.

Centralists hold a decent amount of sway. Swings voters and moderates tip many an election. They may not always get precisely what they like, but they help to draw parties towards certain aspects of popular appeal. In polarised times the opposites (who ironically have a lot in common in their mindset) bounce off one another and crave for others to joint their tribe. If someone highlights instances of foolishness and policies across the board its at least an honest approach, even if they aren't getting invited to any parties!

Quote
The contention being made is that a Biden administration is a worse outcome in many ways than having Trump there. Many posters, you included, were carried away with what I'd describe as hyperbolic TDS distractions and were happy to welcome in these ideological fools as your preferred option.

I'll cede on the two years for a proper appraisal.....though as previously stated this wasn't given to Trump.

However, this doesn't mean we won't be commenting on the insidiousness and incompetency that's guaranteed to come.

There are so many unknowns, since we're basing four years vs four days, that it will require time to tell. It may well be a disaster, or more likely it will be a little more boring than the previous four years. Maybe more of a slog due to the challenges faced than a series of wars. But again, I have no idea as it's an unpredictable time and I appreciate that people may have very different ideas about what might be ahead of us. I just think a few days is a bit on the short side to claim to know how the following years will pan out!


Edited by BlueJay (23 Jan 2021 2.49pm)

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 23 Jan 21 2.49pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

How can you even prove that? Also I'm not sure you'd be defined as a moderate in the modern age. And yes, interpretation of these things can and do change – a moderate in 1980 is not the same as a moderate now.

I've always found it interesting that those further 'right' whine about the 'MSM'

Ultimately if there were enough of you as you say, then the 'MSM' wouldn't exist as a centre left majority, we'd have a more right wing government and there would probably be some sort of Gab/Dissenter state TV station that would be the most popular in the UK. In other words, supply and demand.

I really feel that sometimes self-styled 'conservatives' over estimate the popularity of their positions. By the way this also applies to those on the far end of the left. Same deal.

I see groups that cling on to 'old school' conservatism as dwindling, not increasing. And that's mainly due to age. I haven't looked into it, but out of all the sub 30s in this country (Millenials, Gen Z) how many do you really think align with 70s era conservatism? I'd be amazed if it's any higher than 5%.

The modern age? You mean Britain since 1950s mass immigration. Or perhaps the rise of visual media thought control?
My little minority voted for Brexit. We voted in the Tories...Again Your assertions are nonsense.
You believe that your sort of opinions are more common because you mistake media propaganda for majority opinions.

 

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croydon proud Flag Any european country i fancy! 23 Jan 21 2.59pm

Originally posted by Lombardinho

Just a 40 second YouTube clip.

Does this ring any alarm bells for you?

[Link]

anybody?

NO.

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 23 Jan 21 3.05pm

Originally posted by Lombardinho

Just a 40 second YouTube clip.

Does this ring any alarm bells for you?

[Link]

anybody?

Confirmed Lizard Person.

Maybe he's lost his mask... or his mind.

Edited by BlueJay (23 Jan 2021 3.09pm)

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Online Flag The garden of England 23 Jan 21 3.20pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Shouting again CP !

 

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