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April 18 2024 10.25am

Loan Outs

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View doombear's Profile doombear Flag Too far from Selhurst Park 23 Jan 21 11.42am Send a Private Message to doombear Add doombear as a friend

Two of the U23s loaned out. But at what level? Kirby has gone to League 2 Tranmere and he's one of the Academy players nearest to the first team squad (Woods and Pierrick are already part of the first team squad but still playing in the U23s). Webber, the U23s first choice keeper has gone to non-league Dover Athletic.

Is this a reflection of the level the club think they are currently at? Or are the club undervaluing their level, or are these the levels clubs wanting loans see them at?

Unlike the big clubs, you don't see Palace Academy players out on loan at Championship clubs. And yet, our Academy players can suddenly find themselves thrust into the first team and not only hold their own (as Mitchell is now doing after a difficult start) but excel (as did AWB). I do wonder what this says about our current policies regarding Academy players (excluding references to Hodgson and his alleged anti-youth sentiments).

 

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View Wilesy01's Profile Wilesy01 Flag Bristol 23 Jan 21 12.06pm Send a Private Message to Wilesy01 Add Wilesy01 as a friend

Have also seen that Scott Banks has been linked to a loan move to Dunfermline, who are in the Scottish Champ.

From watching the U23 highlights I've personally thought he looks quality so a move to a team not even in the Scottish top tier is disappointing. I'd argue he isn't going to learn an awful lot from playing at that level, as opposed to a loan to a EFL championship/ top L1 side.

Or maybe he isn't that good?

 

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 23 Jan 21 1.00pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

I pop into the "other Palace forum" now and then mainly to look at "The Academy" thread as there are a couple of people who post there that seem to know what's going on.

One of them is Matt Woosnam and his opinion is that none of the Development Squad players are good enough for the first team

 

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View Ketteridge's Profile Ketteridge Flag Brighton 23 Jan 21 1.18pm Send a Private Message to Ketteridge Add Ketteridge as a friend

Kirby has been out on loan before to Blackpool looks like he did well from what I read at the time but no one has been back in for him so what does that say. If you look at the players over the last few years that have been closest to the first team they have hardly gone on to prove us wrong in our decision to get rid of them.
Levi Lumeka is at Troyes in the French second division, Jason Lokilo is at Doncaster, Sullay Kai Kai is at Blackpool but underperforming according to this from 2 weeks ago [Link] Hiram Boateng is at Cambridge and kicked around a few League 1 and 2 clubs, Gio MacGregor is a Dulwhich Hamlet along with Reece Allassani from a previous generation of future stars . Ryan Innis is at Charlton only played a few games but does seem to be doing ok , to be fair we persevered with him the longest. Even poor old Johnny Williams and he got more of chance then most.
That are not loads of players that we have released because they didn’t get a chance that are tearing up the championship, when Wan Bissaka and Mitchell were good enough they got their chance. Lewis Grabban is the last I can think of who we got shot of and had a good Championship/Career.
We have done well with younger players when we have had to chuck them in like Wan Bissaka or Mullins and Morrison and Clyne, Moses and Zaha who were all given their chances early because of administrations, so may be giving them games at an earlier age gives them the experience they need. Although to be fair Osborne, Rodgers Southgate and later Watson, Soares and Routledge all came through regardless in more settled periods and being skint and forcing us to play hardly helped Woozley and Wayne Carlisle.
So if we had to give Boateng a run of 20 matches would he now be the energetic box to box midfielder we need? Lets see what the academy does over next few years.

 


One supporter of hacking argued that without it "you will do away with the courage and pluck of the game, and I will be bound to bring over a lot of Frenchmen who would beat you with a week's practice -Blackheath secretary at first meeting of the F.A

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 23 Jan 21 1.31pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by doombear

Two of the U23s loaned out. But at what level? Kirby has gone to League 2 Tranmere and he's one of the Academy players nearest to the first team squad (Woods and Pierrick are already part of the first team squad but still playing in the U23s). Webber, the U23s first choice keeper has gone to non-league Dover Athletic.

Is this a reflection of the level the club think they are currently at? Or are the club undervaluing their level, or are these the levels clubs wanting loans see them at?

Unlike the big clubs, you don't see Palace Academy players out on loan at Championship clubs. And yet, our Academy players can suddenly find themselves thrust into the first team and not only hold their own (as Mitchell is now doing after a difficult start) but excel (as did AWB). I do wonder what this says about our current policies regarding Academy players (excluding references to Hodgson and his alleged anti-youth sentiments).

I saw that and agree with your comments. If it is your first loan out then nothing shabby about going to League 2 however where is the progression for Kirby?

By now Championship clubs should have been knocking on our door for him we don't seem to loan players to the Championship which is a worry. Those that go on loan don't seem to be asked back.

Maybe the quality just isn't there.

 


One more point

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View Pete53's Profile Pete53 Flag Hassocks 23 Jan 21 2.25pm Send a Private Message to Pete53 Add Pete53 as a friend

History suggests that a loan to a lower league club is often the first step to the end of that player's Palace career.

I know that the argument is that by giving the player an opportunity to play at senior level, even if with a League One or Two club, is worth more than any number of Under 21/23 games.

However, I am trying to think of any of our "hopefuls" that have followed that path and then returned to establish themselves in the 1st team squad.

 

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 23 Jan 21 2.30pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by Pete53

History suggests that a loan to a lower league club is often the first step to the end of that player's Palace career.

I know that the argument is that by giving the player an opportunity to play at senior level, even if with a League One or Two club, is worth more than any number of Under 21/23 games.

However, I am trying to think of any of our "hopefuls" that have followed that path and then returned to establish themselves in the 1st team squad.

Both Richard Shaw and John Salako were loaned out to Hull and Swansea respectively.

Edited by Willo (23 Jan 2021 2.33pm)

 

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View Pete53's Profile Pete53 Flag Hassocks 23 Jan 21 2.38pm Send a Private Message to Pete53 Add Pete53 as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Both Richard Shaw and John Salako were loaned out to Hull and Swansea respectively.

Edited by Willo (23 Jan 2021 2.33pm)

True Willo, but I am thinking more recent history. Say the last 10 years.

 

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 23 Jan 21 2.52pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by Pete53

True Willo, but I am thinking more recent history. Say the last 10 years.

I have been wracking my cerebral matter but like you I cannot find any examples.

Some of the players I have considered who went out on loan in recent seasons :

Cadogan, N'Diaye, Sekajja, Pinney, Ladapo, Binnom-Williams, Dymond, Gray, Banton, Djilali, Croll, Appiah.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 23 Jan 21 3.20pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Both Richard Shaw and John Salako were loaned out to Hull and Swansea respectively.

Edited by Willo (23 Jan 2021 2.33pm)

In the case of Salako the Swansea fans were raving about him and even in those pre internet days that had drifted back to us fans so it was no surprise he returned and broke into the first team.

 


One more point

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View Harborough Eagle's Profile Harborough Eagle Flag Market Harborough, Leicestershire 24 Jan 21 10.31am Send a Private Message to Harborough Eagle Add Harborough Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

I saw that and agree with your comments. If it is your first loan out then nothing shabby about going to League 2 however where is the progression for Kirby?

By now Championship clubs should have been knocking on our door for him we don't seem to loan players to the Championship which is a worry. Those that go on loan don't seem to be asked back.

Maybe the quality just isn't there.

and also its possible that as Danny Murphy alluded to last night that its not the kind of league for flair and they would get kicked a lot hence not tough enough and not kept. I suspect its a combination of both.

 


Red and Blue though and through (more than 50 years)

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View Phil’s Barber's Profile Phil’s Barber Flag Crowborough 24 Jan 21 10.55am Send a Private Message to Phil’s Barber Add Phil’s Barber as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

I pop into the "other Palace forum" now and then mainly to look at "The Academy" thread as there are a couple of people who post there that seem to know what's going on.

One of them is Matt Woosnam and his opinion is that none of the Development Squad players are good enough for the first team

Richard Shaw said the same when he left his post as our U23 Head Coach just over a year ago.

 

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