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March 29 2024 1.43am

Rafiq

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 17 Nov 21 4.16am Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Orange1290


Go away, you out if your depth as usual.

I can tread water for hours. You otoh are the type to bomb in the deep end and blame the life guard that you can't swim!

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 17 Nov 21 5.16am Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

So he was 'forced' to drink wine as well.
To fit in!
A strange concept for a practising Muslim.
Thrown a lot under the bus and with so much left of his life the regret could be huge in years to come.
Still at least he will be richer !

 

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View Eagle Black.'s Profile Eagle Black. Flag South Croydon 17 Nov 21 7.22am Send a Private Message to Eagle Black. Add Eagle Black. as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

Was that racist as well then as that's what this whole thing is about. Oh and the money, always follow the money. I've no doubt there will be some handed over and I've no doubt it will all be donated to charity, publicly. Severe TIC.

Yeah it was racist,Rafiq said the treatment he received from Yorkshire was in human,everybody else was treated differently.

To be called and i quote elephant washer,bomber, the P word is 100% racist.
Azeem's testimony was very upsetting,i wanted to give him a hug.

From today English cricket needs to soughted from top to bottom.

 

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View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 17 Nov 21 7.30am Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I've heard stuff said between friends that can only be considered insults out of context.

While I don't support it I know that it would be dishonest...if for example I later framed those situations as 'insults' as it literally is bad taste banter.

No I haven't watched the testimony. It's one side of the story so how do I know it's true? I haven't read anymore on it from the summary I read a few days back.

While I have no doubt that I wouldn't support some of what goes on in dressing rooms or in pubs.....and in my twenties I use to run my old man's pub so I have some idea....that doesn't mean that I would support destroying people's livings over high jinks.

Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Nov 2021 10.31pm)

Is this just ‘banter’? I think it’s very important you actually listen to what he has to say.

‘Rafiq alleged that Martyn Moxon, now Yorkshire’s director of cricket, “tore a strip” off him when he returned after the loss of his child. He told the committee he had never seen him talk to anyone like that before and called on him to apologise for his behaviour. Rafiq described his treatment by the club as “inhuman” after the stillbirth of his son. In his witness statement he claimed: “Throughout 2017 and 2018 I struggled as a result of the bullying, targeting and racism I faced – to the point that, again, I had suicidal thoughts. Despite my disclosure to Martyn about this in August 2017, nothing was done. Soon after, I faced accusations of ‘faking injuries’ and ‘ruling myself out’ of selection by teammates, which meant that senior management (i.e. Martyn and others) were openly discussing my confidential medical records and their assessments of them.”’

 

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View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 17 Nov 21 7.43am Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Those trying to cite the ‘Ballance went to his wedding’ point to try and dismiss his claims obviously don’t know very much about south Asian wedding traditions. It’s not uncommon for 400 odd people to be invited. It’s likely the entire playing squad and coaching staff were invited - it’s unlikely he only cherry picked out those he got on with:

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 17 Nov 21 7.50am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Those trying to cite the ‘Ballance went to his wedding’ point to try and dismiss his claims obviously don’t know very much about south Asian wedding traditions. It’s not uncommon for 400 odd people to be invited. It’s likely the entire playing squad and coaching staff were invited - it’s unlikely he only cherry picked out those he got on with:

Yeah, I'm sure he invited the local EDL as well, just to make up the numbers.

You are too funny.

 

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View Eagle Black.'s Profile Eagle Black. Flag South Croydon 17 Nov 21 7.51am Send a Private Message to Eagle Black. Add Eagle Black. as a friend

Some of the cricketers have now apologised to Azeem,but others have denied it happpened.

 

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View HKOwen's Profile HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 17 Nov 21 8.18am Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

Nice to know you can be a South Asian wedding planner, you have no idea how many people attended the wedding but you are stereotyping South Asians so well done there.

Originally posted by DanH

Those trying to cite the ‘Ballance went to his wedding’ point to try and dismiss his claims obviously don’t know very much about south Asian wedding traditions. It’s not uncommon for 400 odd people to be invited. It’s likely the entire playing squad and coaching staff were invited - it’s unlikely he only cherry picked out those he got on with:

 


Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 17 Nov 21 8.31am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Is this just ‘banter’? I think it’s very important you actually listen to what he has to say.

‘Rafiq alleged that Martyn Moxon, now Yorkshire’s director of cricket, “tore a strip” off him when he returned after the loss of his child. He told the committee he had never seen him talk to anyone like that before and called on him to apologise for his behaviour. Rafiq described his treatment by the club as “inhuman” after the stillbirth of his son. In his witness statement he claimed: “Throughout 2017 and 2018 I struggled as a result of the bullying, targeting and racism I faced – to the point that, again, I had suicidal thoughts. Despite my disclosure to Martyn about this in August 2017, nothing was done. Soon after, I faced accusations of ‘faking injuries’ and ‘ruling myself out’ of selection by teammates, which meant that senior management (i.e. Martyn and others) were openly discussing my confidential medical records and their assessments of them.”’

Losing a child is unimaginable but in team sport I don't see how you can keep this or other issues quiet whether it is a physical or mental health issue. The coaching staff and management have to be aware of this, if you don't turn up for work your boss is entitled to know why.

Sometimes the coach will dish out a bollocking as they believe it is the best way to help someone (buck your ideas up).

All I am saying is that on paper it seems bad but in context what did he expect if he did cry off games without a noticeable injury.

Sport is rough and is not for the faint hearted. The other day I saw a retired female swimmer complaining that the coaches weighed them and criticised them if they put on weight (fat shaming). Duh yeah what did she expect she is a professional athlete footballers are always being told this.


Edited by Badger11 (17 Nov 2021 8.33am)

Edited by Badger11 (17 Nov 2021 8.34am)

 


One more point

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 17 Nov 21 9.20am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Is this just ‘banter’? I think it’s very important you actually listen to what he has to say.

‘Rafiq alleged that Martyn Moxon, now Yorkshire’s director of cricket, “tore a strip” off him when he returned after the loss of his child. He told the committee he had never seen him talk to anyone like that before and called on him to apologise for his behaviour. Rafiq described his treatment by the club as “inhuman” after the stillbirth of his son. In his witness statement he claimed: “Throughout 2017 and 2018 I struggled as a result of the bullying, targeting and racism I faced – to the point that, again, I had suicidal thoughts. Despite my disclosure to Martyn about this in August 2017, nothing was done. Soon after, I faced accusations of ‘faking injuries’ and ‘ruling myself out’ of selection by teammates, which meant that senior management (i.e. Martyn and others) were openly discussing my confidential medical records and their assessments of them.”’

From what I have seen, it seems like he is simply playing the race card.
He got called a few names during banter sessions with his team mates and then tried to link that to treatment by management that he considered unfair.

How many employees think they get unfair treatment from management and colleagues? Millions I should think. Maybe he did get unfair treatment, but that is a million miles away from proving actual racism.

He is getting this hearing so that politicians and the media can appear woke. Simple as that. Most people get an employment tribunal or are paid off at best.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (17 Nov 2021 9.21am)

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 17 Nov 21 9.56am Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

I have used the Hol for many years and this section for most of them. During that time I have read many posts I found pretty objectionable, nearly always from a small group of regular posters.

Rafiq's testimony ought, in my opinion, cause everyone to think hard and reflect whether their approach needs to be modified.

So far, there is no indication that will happen. In truth, quite the opposite. Some of the comments made here have plumbed new depths.

I know there are some good people here, with whom I have political differences, but whose hearts are in the right place.

One of the most powerful things to come out of yesterday was the need for people to speak out when they see bad behaviour, and not just remain in the group for fear of becoming ostracised.

 

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View SW19 CPFC's Profile SW19 CPFC Flag Addiscombe West 17 Nov 21 9.59am Send a Private Message to SW19 CPFC Add SW19 CPFC as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

From what I have seen, it seems like he is simply playing the race card.
He got called a few names during banter sessions with his team mates and then tried to link that to treatment by management that he considered unfair.

How many employees think they get unfair treatment from management and colleagues? Millions I should think. Maybe he did get unfair treatment, but that is a million miles away from proving actual racism.

He is getting this hearing so that politicians and the media can appear woke. Simple as that. Most people get an employment tribunal or are paid off at best.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (17 Nov 2021 9.21am)

I think he’s entitled to ‘play the race card’ if ‘a few names’ are actually racist slurs or insults. Stop downplaying it to fit your agenda. Loads of employees get unfair treatment. Racism is, rather obviously, beyond ‘unfair treatment’. Do you have a threshold for when racism is racist enough to be a problem? I suppose casual continual racist banter doesn’t quite make it for you. A psychologist would have a field day working out why your harbour such continual resentment to anyone you view as ‘better off’ or apparently getting special treatment.

Also I do find it ironic that you’re forever complaining about identity politics when you are in fact guilty of it every time you generalise about other races, in this case motivation for ‘playing the race card’.

Now whether this had to be trotted out to the public in the fashion that is unfolding now is another question, and I do agree the current penchant for these sort of instances becoming unbalanced and unobjective is a concern, as is the moral character of Rafiq himself based on other chatter around this subject (which is not necessarily being reported in a balanced way). However once racism enters the fray you’re leaving yourself at the mercy of the storm. Also just because his character is not squeaky clean does not mean that his allegations should not be taken seriously, trivialised or somehow dismissed. Objectivity in action, right there.

Ultimately if the seniority at Yorkshire, including senior players, had an ounce of awareness and understanding about what is racist and what isn’t, with sincerity or not, this would never have escalated. And it’s not a single or rare instance - it was continuous and culturally entrenched in the club by the captain and dismissed by his seniors to try and hush it up and prevent escalation. Which ironically is now happening. So it’s all on them, frankly.

To add - I’ve been privy to several club threads where openly racist content is shared. Sometimes is shut down, rightly, other times it’s simply allowed to continue or even celebrated. Needless to say from what I’ve seen
this rather expectedly happens in some of the backwater areas outside of London but it simply shows it’s not a problem from 10 years ago.

 


Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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