The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
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 steeleye20  Croydon 27 Jul 17 4.12pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
'Socialist achievements'? what utter tripe. These things are consensual and don't belong to a movement at all. All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 27 Jul 17 4.29pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments. Isn't that an oxymoron?
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| Stirlingsays 27 Jul 17 4.33pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments. Consensual not socialist. The greatest opposition to the nhs came from Doctors who voted 10 to 1 against it in 46. In the post WW2 environment the need to rebuild and heal the nation was high. The Tories initally supported the Doctors of course..Churchill referred to Bevan saying that unless he, 'changes his policy and methods and moves without the slightest delay, he will be as great a curse to his country in time of peace as he was a squalid nuisance in time of war.' Still, they came around and were more about amendments than unaccepting of the need for a national health service. The vote passed 261 votes to 113 on the bill's third reading. Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2017 4.34pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 27 Jul 17 4.40pm |
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Personally I think the greatest thing that the early socialists achieved was helping in the organizing of unions. Socialism's best usage is in its modification of capitalism. As a system itself it is doomed to failure as are most roads of good intentions that ignore the realities of human nature. The free market has achieved more than socialism. But I won't knock the early socialism that was genuinely interested in helping the working class from the overt exploitation surrounding it.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| matt_himself Matataland 27 Jul 17 5.04pm |
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You have to admire the bongo film industry. They can create a scud movie on any premise: True entrepreneurs.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 27 Jul 17 5.05pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Personally I think the greatest thing that the early socialists achieved was helping in the organizing of unions. Socialism's best usage is in its modification of capitalism. As a system itself it is doomed to failure as are most roads of good intentions that ignore the realities of human nature. The free market has achieved more than socialism. But I won't knock the early socialism that was genuinely interested in helping the working class from the overt exploitation surrounding it. The trouble is that no system serves society entirely.
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| steeleye20 Croydon 27 Jul 17 5.05pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Personally I think the greatest thing that the early socialists achieved was helping in the organizing of unions. Socialism's best usage is in its modification of capitalism. As a system itself it is doomed to failure as are most roads of good intentions that ignore the realities of human nature. The free market has achieved more than socialism. But I won't knock the early socialism that was genuinely interested in helping the working class from the overt exploitation surrounding it. All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments. No matter how much you post doesn't change the facts.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 27 Jul 17 5.14pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments. No matter how much you post doesn't change the facts.
If you want to extol the virtues of a few good men then please don't pretend that the Labour Party hasn't produced a vast amount of pricks as well.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 27 Jul 17 5.38pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
It's Nickbot time. No doubt another 'unbiased' source. Labour mentals should keep their own house in order. Are you saying the Tories aren't split over Brexit? Speaking anonymously to the paper, a pro-European minister told Sylvester that the concept of a "global Britain" was far-fetched: This row is about the future versus the past. The Brexiteers somehow think we are going to go sailing off into some glorious imperial world without realising that in the modern age we are interdependent. However, the most revealing, and damning take was this one: We are stuck in a ‘damned if we do, damned if we don’t’ bind. If we try to cancel exit we destroy ourselves; if we go ahead with it we destroy the country. People voted for a fantasy.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 27 Jul 17 5.41pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
If you want to extol the virtues of a few good men then please don't pretend that the Labour Party hasn't produced a vast amount of pricks as well. John Prescott who according to Jeremy Hardy, 'Fucked the working class in their own accent.' How many ministerial cars do current cabinet members have at their disposal?
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| Stirlingsays 27 Jul 17 6.13pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
All socialist achievements having been introduced by labour governments. No matter how much you post doesn't change the facts. Socialism didn't introduce 'gay marriage' for example did it? Is 'gay marriage' a 'conservative' concept? I think what you define as socialism is very much a selective self identity that ignores many of its faults and trumpets what you see as its positives. Ultimately nothing survives without consensus so your descriptions of 'facts' aren't worthy of the name in my book. Early socialism definitely helped create many improvements for the working class and improved the top down model of capitalism. Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2017 6.21pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 27 Jul 17 6.16pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
John Prescott who according to Jeremy Hardy, 'Fucked the working class in their own accent.' How many ministerial cars do current cabinet members have at their disposal?
Man that was funny....my tea nearly went flying.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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