Momentum investigation
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  Hrolf The Ganger  07 Dec 17 5.13pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
There you go again, 'the Left'. It's like they are a different genus. Simplistic labelling results in an 'us and them' discussion from the outset rather than some kind of reasonable debate on its merits. In the same way as I don't trust extremists of any kind this is a group that makes most people uncomfortable. I don't suppose they are worse than Vote Leave for example but I wouldn't trust them. And I know some were bussed in to Croydon during the last election. I know this because a Labour activist of my acquaintance was bemoaning that fact. People with only one thing on their mind are downright dangerous and at best irritating. Methinks you dost protest too much.
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cryrst  The garden of England 07 Dec 17 5.26pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
But we are not in 'momentum' and should not be labelled as left wing when it doesn't fit anyway. It is an irritating stereotype used by people in the absence of any argument. It's particularly annoying to be labelled as a 'leftie' purely because I have an open mind receptive to new ideas. We are in the society because we have to be, but that does not mean that we are of it.... Open our minds and let us be rid of redundant 'left' and 'right' stereotyping. What is left wing then?
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| EverybodyDannsNow SE19 07 Dec 17 5.32pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
What is left wing then? So why bother debating politics? Or following it at all for that matter - just show up on Election Day, vote Tory, and forget all about it until the next time.
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| cryrst The garden of England 07 Dec 17 5.37pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
So why bother debating politics? Or following it at all for that matter - just show up on Election Day, vote Tory, and forget all about it until the next time. That is what I do
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| Mapletree Croydon 07 Dec 17 5.46pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Methinks you dost protest too much. No, I doth not. I have said this before. Forcing people into taking sides is exactly what prevents decent discussion and any hope of momentum in our society. I hate people that hijack debate (or specific words) for their causes celebres.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 07 Dec 17 6.28pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
wheres nick There s me thinking that naming people to get a response was frowned upon.
If they've overspent, fine them. Or just let them off as is what happened with multiple Tory constituencies.
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| elgrande bedford 07 Dec 17 6.34pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
There s me thinking that naming people to get a response was frowned upon.
If they've overspent, fine them. Or just let them off as is what happened with multiple Tory constituencies. just doing what you did with the tory allegations. you bought the tory one up with in minutes .whats the difference.
always a Norwood boy, where ever I live. |
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| elgrande bedford 07 Dec 17 6.36pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
But we are not in 'momentum' and should not be labelled as left wing when it doesn't fit anyway. It is an irritating stereotype used by people in the absence of any argument. It's particularly annoying to be labelled as a 'leftie' purely because I have an open mind receptive to new ideas. We are in the society because we have to be, but that does not mean that we are of it.... Open our minds and let us be rid of redundant 'left' and 'right' stereotyping. But its ok for the everyone to call people they do not agree with "right wing".
always a Norwood boy, where ever I live. |
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| serial thriller The Promised Land 07 Dec 17 6.46pm |
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I'm a member of Momentum, and I have to say I think this whole thing's a bloody farce. The headline is obviously tantalising for our opponents, but look at the details of this story and you'll see it's a storm in a tea cup. The Electoral Commission have said they'd investigate, as they do with almost any non-party organisation involved in the election. Momentum said they'd be happy to take part, having already released their expenses for the election. The Standard, the Times etc have their story though. Needless to say that when the investigation actually comes back with its findings, they'll report them on the 35th page, but for now they can stamp it on the front page with the usual 'hard-left', 'Trots' etc labels. It's nearly as ludicrous as this whole 'purge of the moderates' argument that's going on. But that's for another thread me thinks...
If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4 |
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| cryrst The garden of England 07 Dec 17 6.59pm |
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Originally posted by serial thriller
I'm a member of Momentum, and I have to say I think this whole thing's a bloody farce. The headline is obviously tantalising for our opponents, but look at the details of this story and you'll see it's a storm in a tea cup. The Electoral Commission have said they'd investigate, as they do with almost any non-party organisation involved in the election. Momentum said they'd be happy to take part, having already released their expenses for the election. The Standard, the Times etc have their story though. Needless to say that when the investigation actually comes back with its findings, they'll report them on the 35th page, but for now they can stamp it on the front page with the usual 'hard-left', 'Trots' etc labels. It's nearly as ludicrous as this whole 'purge of the moderates' argument that's going on. But that's for another thread me thinks... What is momentum's wants going forward then with you being a member and all.
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| serial thriller The Promised Land 07 Dec 17 7.25pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
What is momentum's wants going forward then with you being a member and all. Good question! Momentum was born out of a group in Labour called the CLPD - the Campaign for Labour Party Democracy. It was run mainly by people like John Lansman and Mcdonnell, and it was a sort of protest movement at the top-down reorganisation of the Party by Mandelson. Instead of party members electing local council nominees and Parliamentary candidates, the decision making was transferred to Whitehall and the NEC. That basically meant you got people like Tristram Hunt being put up in a place like Stoke on Trent, a person with about as much to do with Stoke on Trent as Alan Mullery does with Crystal Palace. So their first job was to wrestle control back from the beureaucracy and give it back to members. Then, during the election, they were tasked with mobilising new Labour members, which they evidently did with incredible success. As for policies, Momentum now is a really large organisation, with nearly as many members as the Tories. It took in people from anti-war backgrounds, climate backgrounds, housing, immigration, education...so lack of policy ideas is certainly not an issue! As for free education not being financially viable, how do you think they manage to do it in Germany then?
If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4 |
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| cryrst The garden of England 07 Dec 17 8.18pm |
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Originally posted by serial thriller
Good question! Momentum was born out of a group in Labour called the CLPD - the Campaign for Labour Party Democracy. It was run mainly by people like John Lansman and Mcdonnell, and it was a sort of protest movement at the top-down reorganisation of the Party by Mandelson. Instead of party members electing local council nominees and Parliamentary candidates, the decision making was transferred to Whitehall and the NEC. That basically meant you got people like Tristram Hunt being put up in a place like Stoke on Trent, a person with about as much to do with Stoke on Trent as Alan Mullery does with Crystal Palace. So their first job was to wrestle control back from the beureaucracy and give it back to members. Then, during the election, they were tasked with mobilising new Labour members, which they evidently did with incredible success. As for policies, Momentum now is a really large organisation, with nearly as many members as the Tories. It took in people from anti-war backgrounds, climate backgrounds, housing, immigration, education...so lack of policy ideas is certainly not an issue! As for free education not being financially viable, how do you think they manage to do it in Germany then? Firstly education.
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