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Charlie Hebdo vs Boris Johnson

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 13 Aug 18 10.17am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You wrote, 'How do you deal with people who express opinions but are less intelligent than you? That is, when their views are clearly informed by ignorance or blind stupidity?'

So then are you suggesting our conclusions are wrong and that you weren't suggesting you are more intelligent than those you deem to support 'populist' ideas?

You seemingly ignored my offer to debate any of these 'populist' ideas. Cool, no problem.

The reality is that those policy ideas you mentioned are worldviews and cultural and have zero connection to the intelligence of the individual who believes in them.


Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Aug 2018 2.41pm)

And this one was in reponse to an allegaton that I hate populist politics as those who follow it are (you say) my intellectual inferiors. My question was inferring that you attack plenty on this site based on your belief that thier views are based on ignorance or lesser intelligence i.e. that you know more than them. I was calliing you out for hypocrisy.

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 13 Aug 18 2.20pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

This one was in response to you saying that we were all being hard on Trump. We wouldn't be so hard if the Russian or Chinese premiers were shooting from the hip. I replied that they don't: even effective dictators like them measure their comments

So trump is a dictator now.
Get some perspective. The USA are the one country I would IMO actually trust. The fact that trump says it how it is should be respected not vilified. Anyone can hide but it takes guts to put your head above the parapet. He knows that some things he has done or will do won’t be correct for some of the USA or the world but doing nothing is not an option.
Much like doing nothing about the issues in this country shouldn’t be an option but it appears that it is the way it is.
Apathy will be shown to be the wrong action taken.
Just waiting to let integration happen is wrong and it won’t happen.
I’m not buying the “give it time” mantra.
Time will not be a healer it will be the cause of pain and suffering in the years ahead.
Seeing what is happening now and stating it is not hypocrisy,it is fact.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 13 Aug 18 2.31pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

This one was in response to you saying that we were all being hard on Trump. We wouldn't be so hard if the Russian or Chinese premiers were shooting from the hip. I replied that they don't: even effective dictators like them measure their comments

I think anyone reading this exchange will observe you avoiding questions and re-framing conversations instead.

You are deserving of criticism in my view for viewing how discreet a dictator is as of any importance when comparing to Trump.....but that's the extent of that.

Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Aug 2018 2.57pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 13 Aug 18 2.51pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

And this one was in reponse to an allegaton that I hate populist politics as those who follow it are (you say) my intellectual inferiors. My question was inferring that you attack plenty on this site based on your belief that thier views are based on ignorance or lesser intelligence i.e. that you know more than them. I was calliing you out for hypocrisy.

Again, you were asked directly and again you avoid.

Unlike you I answer questions, whether they are implied or explicit.

I do attack those who I regard as making silly comments. This is not hypocrisy as I don't pretend otherwise. I debate anyone contending otherwise. I don't hide behind opaque statements.

I do believe some worldviews are better than others. I do not pretend otherwise and I'm more than willing to explain why in debates.

I criticise those who put forward significantly different worldviews....I don't connect them holding those views as meaning that they are less intelligent. That may or may not be the case. Intelligence is not the be and end all in the judgement of a person. Most people who engage in a political forum can hold their own on some level.

I tend to focus more upon the ideas than play the actual person, unless I perceive a personal attack or attack on a group for poor reasons. Serial, for example....I differ wildly from him but it's an ideas debate not a personal attack....beyond the odd jokey swipe I suppose.

I state why I believe something and I state why I would believe another worldview might be wrong (within the context of society working as best it can).

For example, I attack progressivism regularly and I give my reasons why I attack it. People are free to defend it and I fully recognise that many intelligent people are progressives. Intelligence does not lead to one particular political narrative.

You seem to prefer a style of making statements then when criticised for them adopt a style of not answering subsequent questions. Even ones asking for clarity and instead hiding behind reframes.

What is wrong with answering questions.


Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Aug 2018 3.14pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Jimenez's Profile Jimenez Flag SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 13 Aug 18 2.52pm Send a Private Message to Jimenez Add Jimenez as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

This one was in response to you saying that we were all being hard on Trump. We wouldn't be so hard if the Russian or Chinese premiers were shooting from the hip. I replied that they don't: even effective dictators like them measure their comments

Well the Philipine's President Duterte certainly shoots from the hip? & usually quite literally

 


Pro USA & Israel

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 13 Aug 18 9.07pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Jimenez

Well the Philipine's President Duterte certainly shoots from the hip? & usually quite literally

Ha ha
I think he only tends to shoot low life scrum bags who have it coming.
I may be wrong.
It has been noted before

 

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 14 Aug 18 10.29am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

So trump is a dictator now.
Get some perspective. The USA are the one country I would IMO actually trust. The fact that trump says it how it is should be respected not vilified. Anyone can hide but it takes guts to put your head above the parapet. He knows that some things he has done or will do won’t be correct for some of the USA or the world but doing nothing is not an option.
Much like doing nothing about the issues in this country shouldn’t be an option but it appears that it is the way it is.
Apathy will be shown to be the wrong action taken.
Just waiting to let integration happen is wrong and it won’t happen.
I’m not buying the “give it time” mantra.
Time will not be a healer it will be the cause of pain and suffering in the years ahead.
Seeing what is happening now and stating it is not hypocrisy,it is fact.

I trust you are now winding me up? This is OBVIOUSLY not what I said.

I was saying - just to ram home the point one last time - that there is no-one alive whose words have more influence and impact. Yet he constantly shoots from the hip with little or no filter. I think that is irresponsible given his place in the world.

That's it!

 

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 14 Aug 18 10.31am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Again, you were asked directly and again you avoid.

Unlike you I answer questions, whether they are implied or explicit.

I do attack those who I regard as making silly comments. This is not hypocrisy as I don't pretend otherwise. I debate anyone contending otherwise. I don't hide behind opaque statements.

I do believe some worldviews are better than others. I do not pretend otherwise and I'm more than willing to explain why in debates.

I criticise those who put forward significantly different worldviews....I don't connect them holding those views as meaning that they are less intelligent. That may or may not be the case. Intelligence is not the be and end all in the judgement of a person. Most people who engage in a political forum can hold their own on some level.

I tend to focus more upon the ideas than play the actual person, unless I perceive a personal attack or attack on a group for poor reasons. Serial, for example....I differ wildly from him but it's an ideas debate not a personal attack....beyond the odd jokey swipe I suppose.

I state why I believe something and I state why I would believe another worldview might be wrong (within the context of society working as best it can).

For example, I attack progressivism regularly and I give my reasons why I attack it. People are free to defend it and I fully recognise that many intelligent people are progressives. Intelligence does not lead to one particular political narrative.

You seem to prefer a style of making statements then when criticised for them adopt a style of not answering subsequent questions. Even ones asking for clarity and instead hiding behind reframes.

What is wrong with answering questions.


Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Aug 2018 3.14pm)

What have I dodged?

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 14 Aug 18 11.27am Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

I trust you are now winding me up? This is OBVIOUSLY not what I said.

I was saying - just to ram home the point one last time - that there is no-one alive whose words have more influence and impact. Yet he constantly shoots from the hip with little or no filter. I think that is irresponsible given his place in the world.

That's it!

You included trump in the paragraph.
If you think he is a dictator then stick by your convictions.
Free speech and all that.
Like I said he tells it as it is.
Actually trying to make his country great again.
IE the Iran deal is crap. In two years they can just crack on how they were.he saw through the smokescreen and will now get a positive response.
Taxes on imports can only benefit the USA.
Wish some of ours would consider the UK first.
We even have the opposition leader lying his way out of a situation.
And he has a very short memory of the event.

 

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View Penge Eagle's Profile Penge Eagle Flag Beckenham 15 Aug 18 2.17am Send a Private Message to Penge Eagle Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Penge Eagle as a friend

Not sure if this link works... [Link]

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 15 Aug 18 9.44am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

What have I dodged?


Do you regard yourself as more intelligent than those who follow populist policies? I think that was the gist of it.

Just to be clear, all this is only an exchange of views and I harbour no ill will. It's a problem with text sometimes.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 15 Aug 18 10.47am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


Do you regard yourself as more intelligent than those who follow populist policies? I think that was the gist of it.

Just to be clear, all this is only an exchange of views and I harbour no ill will. It's a problem with text sometimes.

The brain is a muscle like any other. I think many people just let their brain atrophy. So when it comes to thinking current affairs, they are not match sharp and opt for the easy route. We have both met many people like that. Not thick. But too lazy in the mind to connect with events that shape their lives.

Populist politics plays into that as it offers easy solutions for difficult problems.

In Victorian times few had the vote. But those who did had no TV or radio. They read "respectable" newspapers every day, poetry, philosophy, history, literature and actively engaged in the arts and intellectual debate. They were also directly involved in commerce, agriculture and industry. Politicians had to be on their toes then. Now I fear they see their role as more of a case of feeding the pond life.

That is why I see populist politics as dirty words. It insults us.

In some ways, even though I lost my career in the public sector because of it, I admire austerity as it was rightly seen as critical and went against mass support. Ditto direct negotiation with the IRA where Major defied his whole cabinet. More of that please.

 

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