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March 29 2024 4.39am

The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)

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jeeagles Flag 22 Aug 19 6.36pm

I think Boris has really played a blinder so far.

The issues May had is that she didnt believe in Brexit, and didnt have any leverage. To gain leverage, you've got to create problems for the other side. Multiple issues for the EU are now emerging.

Neither side wants to be the party that creates a no deal, but the backstop has resulted in a deal that the UK cant accept so it's currently our only option.

If we extend our membership, then our MEPs will take there seats. The EU now has an option of throwing us out without a deal, or letting us stay and cause havoc.

Boris has also pointed out that the backstop could result in trouble returning to northern island as a result of disgruntled nationalist. Something the EU has been ignoring so far, and counters their argument against a hard boarder.

The great withdrawal bill says will remain aligned to EU law until we change our laws or they change their law.

The best outcome in the case of a no deal is a quick agreement that we carry on as normal with aligned laws. This will minimise disruption in the short term, however the EU and the UK will probably need to consult if they want to make changes to future laws. That will put the UK in a much better position for influanci ng EU laws than if it were a member. The EU will have an influence over some UK laws by the same token, but the laws it will have influenced over will be ones they already have total control over.

Next stages I'd imagine are that we will suggest an approach to the uk boarder problem in about 28 days which is likely to be very favourable to the UK and possibly ireland but not the rest of the EU, and that will give the EU no time to negotiate it before the end of October meaning they have to accept it, or kick us out with a no deal.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 22 Aug 19 7.10pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

He can honestly say that he tried his best to hammer out a compromise but the gang of three weren't interested so we can go ahead with no deal as that is the only thing left

Agreed. In order to get a no deal through Parliament Boris will have to show the waverers that he tried for a deal but the EU would not compromise so voting against a no deal would be illogical.

 


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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 22 Aug 19 7.22pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

Agreed. In order to get a no deal through Parliament Boris will have to show the waverers that he tried for a deal but the EU would not compromise so voting against a no deal would be illogical.

I suspect you are quite right but I am unhinged about this at the moment so tend to think the worst.

 


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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deleted user Flag 22 Aug 19 9.38pm

Originally posted by Badger11

Agreed. In order to get a no deal through Parliament Boris will have to show the waverers that he tried for a deal but the EU would not compromise so voting against a no deal would be illogical.

Realistically, isn't No Deal the default anyway? There are certainly scenarios where it's irrelevant if it passes through Parliament or not.

That said, it may also be that there is a solution found to the backstop and so on before the clock ticks down. It's a bit of a coin toss situation right now.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 22 Aug 19 9.41pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You waffle on with wordy posts when all you need to say is that you wish to thwart Brexit by any means.

From a no deal Brexit for sure because it wasn't what people voted for and it would do our country great harm.

No government should ever do anything that they know will harm the country.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 22 Aug 19 9.46pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Do you include Mark Carney who changed his mind?

Yes, because he hasn't. All he has done is to try to warn the EU that the impact on them of a no deal will be greater than on us. Which is hardly new news is it?

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 22 Aug 19 9.53pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

'BBC Admits To FAKE NEWS EU Election Coverage' [Link]

What a load of tosh.

They separated out those who are 100% for or against and kept the main parties, Tory and Labour, who have a division of views in their ranks out.

The BBC have nothing to apologise for and to promote this story as "Fake News" is fake itself.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 23 Aug 19 4.29am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Johnson is just playing for the cameras right now to put on record that he attempted a reconfiguration. He knows that the EU probably aren't going to offer anything until they know leaving is imminent and can't be stopped.

The whole EU strategy is based upon trying to make leaving the EU look terrible to the significant anti EU sentiment within many of its cohorts.

To do that they have to stop the UK from making significant deals with outside nations.....that's the real reason for the 'backstop' excuse.....everyone in the know realises that....it's an excuse for the normies.

This is a security issue for the Irish and UK. The EU is not Ireland. It's yet another example of the disfigurement of previous power giveaways that sees the EU even thinking it has a say......and as things stand the Irish are going to pay a heavy price for sticking with that 27.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Aug 2019 4.31am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 23 Aug 19 6.18am Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

From a no deal Brexit for sure because it wasn't what people voted for and it would do our country great harm.

How do you know what people voted for and saying that it would do our country great harm is a typical remainer overblown reaction

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 23 Aug 19 7.50am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

What a load of tosh.

They separated out those who are 100% for or against and kept the main parties, Tory and Labour, who have a division of views in their ranks out.

The BBC have nothing to apologise for and to promote this story as "Fake News" is fake itself.

My complaint which has now been upheld was that both Tory and Labour official policy at the time was pro Brexit and the chart did not reflect that.

I challenged why the nationalist parties and the Lib Dems had been included in the remain camp and got the ludicrous response that this was their main policy whereas the Tory and Labour parties have other policies. Try telling an SNP supporter the reason their party exists is to oppose Brexit, Scottish independence has nothing to do with being an SNP supporter?

There were only 2 parties that can be said to exist because of Brexit and that is UKIP and the Brexit party all other parties have other policies e.g. the Greens are about the environment. So lumping Remain parties into one group but not lumping all Brexit parties into another was simply nonsense and the BBC has finally recognised that.

As another poster said at the time even if the BBC had done that it was still a nonsense chart because there will be Green supporters who voted for Brexit and yes Tory and Labour supporters who voted to Remain.

In other words apart from the Brexit party and UKIP you can only speculate as to voter intentions for the other parties.

Anyway the BBC has now admitted it was a mistake in the scheme of things it wasn't that important.

 


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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 23 Aug 19 7.55am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

From a no deal Brexit for sure because it wasn't what people voted for and it would do our country great harm.

No government should ever do anything that they know will harm the country.

And how do we know what Remainers voted for?

Your argument works both ways. Some people will have voted to Remain because they believe 100% in the EU project, others may have voted for a status quo which doesn't exist as the EU is continuing to evolve and some may have reluctantly voted to Remain in the hope that we could get some more exceptions as David Cameron tried to.

In short we can speculate about voter intentions but we don't know. The question itself was simple and did not mention leaving with a deal.

 


One more point

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 23 Aug 19 8.33am Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

How do you know what people voted for and saying that it would do our country great harm is a typical remainer overblown reaction

He doesn’t, which is a point in its own right

But he does know that the referendum campaign never even mentioned a no deal Brexit so nobody can have actively voted for that. In fact the campaign always spoke about ‘the deal’ so if a no deal happens the referendum will have been fought on misinformation. Who’d a thought it

 

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