Kit Malthouse -wheres Boris?

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BlueJay UK 11 Oct 21 2.51pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Politicians are more like national supervisors and are a part of a global system where money has always sat at the top.....most people still think that everything is national and self contained when in truth that rarely occurs. Money rules the system completely, you don't get to the top without kneeling at its altar as Corbyn found out. When a global crises happens like this they just revert to whatever the consensus is....they even all copy each other and say 'build back better' for example. There is safely in numbers....hide behind your experts, say 'yes' to the monied interests and the media won't turn against you as that would mean recognising their culpability as well. To an extent it's understandable that political parties act in lockstep to both get things done, and as you say when acting together it's hard to point the finger. There's no doubt that monied interests and corporations always hold enough sway at any given moment to call the shots, and that genuinely principled people get shot down before they get a sniff of power. It's within a system like this that even optional acts of rampant greed, as was the case with the PPE situation are likely. Never let a good crisis go to waste and all that.
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BlueJay

UK 11 Oct 21 2.51pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Politicians are more like national supervisors and are a part of a global system where money has always sat at the top.....most people still think that everything is national and self contained when in truth that rarely occurs.

Money rules the system completely, you don't get to the top without kneeling at its altar as Corbyn found out.

When a global crises happens like this they just revert to whatever the consensus is....they even all copy each other and say 'build back better' for example.

There is safely in numbers....hide behind your experts, say 'yes' to the monied interests and the media won't turn against you as that would mean recognising their culpability as well.

To an extent it's understandable that political parties act in lockstep to both get things done, and as you say when acting together it's hard to point the finger. There's no doubt that monied interests and corporations always hold enough sway at any given moment to call the shots, and that genuinely principled people get shot down before they get a sniff of power. It's within a system like this that even optional acts of rampant greed, as was the case with the PPE situation are likely. Never let a good crisis go to waste and all that.

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croydon proud Any european country i fancy! 11 Oct 21 2.54pm
Originally posted by Phil’s Barber Thank you for confirming that you ‘mis-spoke’ croydon proud. I like to remain open minded and neutral in terms of the Politics of this Country, hence my noticeable lack of participation in this News/Politics message board sub-section. One thing I do take issue with though is when people invent facts or make things up purely to support their argument. It is not helpful and makes people a lot less likely to take notice of anything else that they say. No problem, yeah, I thought he had said it and actually searched for it- to no avail!I"m all for being corrected if i"m wrong, if only to learn the truth, but never make things up that I didn"t think true, fair play Phil.
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croydon proud

Any european country i fancy! 11 Oct 21 2.54pm

Originally posted by Phil’s Barber

Thank you for confirming that you ‘mis-spoke’ croydon proud.

I like to remain open minded and neutral in terms of the Politics of this Country, hence my noticeable lack of participation in this News/Politics message board sub-section.

One thing I do take issue with though is when people invent facts or make things up purely to support their argument. It is not helpful and makes people a lot less likely to take notice of anything else that they say.

No problem, yeah, I thought he had said it and actually searched for it- to no avail!I"m all for being corrected if i"m wrong, if only to learn the truth, but never make things up that I didn"t think true, fair play Phil.

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Phil’s Barber Crowborough 11 Oct 21 6.58pm
Originally posted by croydon proud No problem, yeah, I thought he had said it and actually searched for it- to no avail!I"m all for being corrected if i"m wrong, if only to learn the truth, but never make things up that I didn"t think true, fair play Phil. Very gracious of you cp, I fully accept what you say and did so following your first reply however Wisbech posted something completely unrelated to what we had been discussing and I was just putting him/her right.
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Phil’s Barber

Crowborough 11 Oct 21 6.58pm

Originally posted by croydon proud

Very gracious of you cp, I fully accept what you say and did so following your first reply however Wisbech posted something completely unrelated to what we had been discussing and I was just putting him/her right.

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Wisbech Eagle Online Truro Cornwall 11 Oct 21 7.03pm
Originally posted by Phil’s Barber I don’t care to comment Wisbech. The one and ONLY point I specifically outlined for clarification or supporting evidence on was the claim made by croydon proud that ‘Boris had promised them (doctors) a big pay rise.’ At no time did the PM do such a thing. If people are going to debate a topic then the participants should stick to the facts and not make false claims or fabricate things. Edited by Phil’s Barber (11 Oct 2021 1.41pm) Maybe you don't care to comment, and I have no evidence that he made the promise to doctors. It would not though surprise me as he lied in the way I described over the student nurse's grant. Johnson is an attention-seeking populist. The USA got rid of theirs at the first opportunity. Will we? For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle Online

Truro Cornwall 11 Oct 21 7.03pm

Originally posted by Phil’s Barber

I don’t care to comment Wisbech.

The one and ONLY point I specifically outlined for clarification or supporting evidence on was the claim made by croydon proud that ‘Boris had promised them (doctors) a big pay rise.’

At no time did the PM do such a thing.

If people are going to debate a topic then the participants should stick to the facts and not make false claims or fabricate things.

Edited by Phil’s Barber (11 Oct 2021 1.41pm)

Maybe you don't care to comment, and I have no evidence that he made the promise to doctors. It would not though surprise me as he lied in the way I described over the student nurse's grant.

Johnson is an attention-seeking populist. The USA got rid of theirs at the first opportunity. Will we?

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Phil’s Barber Crowborough 11 Oct 21 7.20pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Maybe you don't care to comment, and I have no evidence that he made the promise to doctors. It would not though surprise me as he lied in the way I described over the student nurse's grant. Members of Parliament (from all sides) get more than enough stick as it is without un-evidenced speculation adding to it.
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Phil’s Barber

Crowborough 11 Oct 21 7.20pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Maybe you don't care to comment, and I have no evidence that he made the promise to doctors. It would not though surprise me as he lied in the way I described over the student nurse's grant.

Members of Parliament (from all sides) get more than enough stick as it is without un-evidenced speculation adding to it.

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Helmet46 Croydon 11 Oct 21 9.12pm
Originally posted by Phil’s Barber Members of Parliament (from all sides) get more than enough stick as it is without un-evidenced speculation adding to it. I think you’re absolutely right. A lot of the debates on here are littered with unsubstantiated comments and some posters are so entrenched in their politics that they are incapable of giving credit or balance, even where due. It’s needless, as well, as our politicians - representing all parties - say and do so many ridiculous things that they really don’t need their oppositions fan club members to make stuff up. In my opinion we can probably blame a lot of this on a Brexit attitude as it’s screwed the country up. NOT, in my view, completely down to the actual Brexit itself. I mean, don’t get me wrong, there’s a healthy slug of utter s***e caused by it but we could probably have made inroads to move beyond that were it not for the absolute inability of many to accept the result and work to make the best of it, rather than seek to disrupt it in order to prove others wrong. That’s what’s causing most division - people being obstructive and divisive and going so far as to make up random stuff that sounds credible. Too many are still sulking and that’s clouding their judgement. That extends to the media, those idiots on GMB and the BBC etc. Once we can move on from that I genuinely believe that we can and will progress. However, the caveat is that I remain unconvinced that we have a single politician from any party, presently in parliament, that would make a capable and credible leader. Not one, in my opinion. Edited by Helmet46 (12 Oct 2021 7.38am)
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Helmet46

Croydon 11 Oct 21 9.12pm

Originally posted by Phil’s Barber

Members of Parliament (from all sides) get more than enough stick as it is without un-evidenced speculation adding to it.

I think you’re absolutely right. A lot of the debates on here are littered with unsubstantiated comments and some posters are so entrenched in their politics that they are incapable of giving credit or balance, even where due. It’s needless, as well, as our politicians - representing all parties - say and do so many ridiculous things that they really don’t need their oppositions fan club members to make stuff up.

In my opinion we can probably blame a lot of this on a Brexit attitude as it’s screwed the country up. NOT, in my view, completely down to the actual Brexit itself. I mean, don’t get me wrong, there’s a healthy slug of utter s***e caused by it but we could probably have made inroads to move beyond that were it not for the absolute inability of many to accept the result and work to make the best of it, rather than seek to disrupt it in order to prove others wrong. That’s what’s causing most division - people being obstructive and divisive and going so far as to make up random stuff that sounds credible. Too many are still sulking and that’s clouding their judgement. That extends to the media, those idiots on GMB and the BBC etc.

Once we can move on from that I genuinely believe that we can and will progress. However, the caveat is that I remain unconvinced that we have a single politician from any party, presently in parliament, that would make a capable and credible leader. Not one, in my opinion.

Edited by Helmet46 (12 Oct 2021 7.38am)

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