Ukraine Situation - Should We Be Worried?
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 Jimenez  SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 16 Nov 22 11.00pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
Only Russians call it ‘the’ Ukraine. Because they like to consider it their borderland. The country is Ukraine, it is NOT Russia’s borderland. Are you a Russian bot? Actually Obama got pulled up on this a few years back.
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Stirlingsays  16 Nov 22 11.11pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
I wonder why. Did it occur to you that the terrorism is most likely PKK. The same organisation dumped by Sweden in order to overcome Turkey’s objections to it joining NATO?
Security services don't work with and fund different terrorist organisations around the world. I'm so thankful that you put me right on that. I was in danger of thinking that they could be used by them when interests align. Me thinking that they aren't entirely independent at all times and that they receive no input from anywhere else is just the usual conspiracy theory stuff......all that Iran Contra, funding Bin Laden when Russia were in Afghanistan and countless other examples is kind of just book stuff that people write. Ok boomer.
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| Stirlingsays 16 Nov 22 11.15pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
Only Russians call it ‘the’ Ukraine. Because they like to consider it their borderland. The country is Ukraine, it is NOT Russia’s borderland. Are you a Russian bot? Could you be anymore pedantic? Could you be further up the establishment's backside? I guess the answer is 'Nyet' to both. Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Nov 2022 11.17pm)
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| Eaglehamster Storrington 16 Nov 22 11.19pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
My view is that Russia isn't the west's friend, however it has been turned into the west's enemy when this never needed to happen. I regard it as deliberate. Our policy is regime change in Russia, which we lie about and it's about as dangerous as it gets....we are back in cold war with nukes that make those used on Japan look like toys. For example, the US shouldn't have been in the Ukraine helping overthrown a democratically elected pro-Russian government in 2014 and which started the civil war. None of our media seemed to have an issue with a coup, when it benefits us. Biden, as part of the Obama administration and the State department had been in the Ukraine interfering for years before 2014. The fact that a significant part of Ukraine is pro Russia is continually ignored and omitted in any reasoning behind this conflict. The Ukraine we continually refer to is in fact Western Ukraine, who are far more Polish and other former Soviet occupied countries in their attitudes and heritage, than the south and east of Ukraine. Some might ask themselves just what the hell were we doing there, in that particular country before 2014....Much less other border countries with Russia, it was specifically Ukraine where the main interests were....all conveniently memory holed. If the Ukrainians hadn't broken the Minsk agreements that would have helped as well.....not having Russia hating Biden in would also have helped. I didn't agree with the February invasion, however this war has its roots in 2014 and before that in our expansionism of Nato as a confrontation of Russia. Please tell me who forced those former satellite state of the SU into joining NATO? And haven't they been rather more successful since leaving the SU?
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| Stirlingsays 16 Nov 22 11.34pm |
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Originally posted by Eaglehamster
Please tell me who forced those former satellite state of the SU into joining NATO? And haven't they been rather more successful since leaving the SU? What is in the interests of individual eastern European countries isn't the same thing as saying that's in the interest of our future of and more so world peace. Nato was not designed for what happened, it's a north Atlantic alliance that expanded beyond its remit. I've answered this point before in the thread. I understand what the Soviet Union did in these countries and the historical memory and hatred that is there, even an inattentive student knows that......A slightly more attentive one also knows that us getting involved in regional hatreds was the cause of the first world war....A war where we lost more troops than in the second. A third that involved nuclear war would risk mankind itself. I certainly feel that after the Berlin war fell, the future of eastern Europe and Russia itself needed to be far more collegiately handled....the fact that it wasn't and that post communism failed in Russia is why we have Putin. Putin himself started out as far more pro western and you would need to be a student of that history to understand how we got here. Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Nov 2022 11.46pm)
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| Mapletree Croydon 17 Nov 22 12.05am |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Could you be anymore pedantic? Could you be further up the establishment's backside? I guess the answer is 'Nyet' to both. Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Nov 2022 11.17pm) You really don’t understand do you. Your lack of attention to detail and any form of scientific rigour is a major reason you get suckered in to those conspiracy theory sites you so love. You are exactly the target demographic. Yes, it matters. Ask a Ukrainian or indeed a Russian. Ukraine is not part of Russia despite its rhetoric.
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| Stirlingsays 17 Nov 22 12.13am |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
You really don’t understand do you. Your lack of attention to detail and any form of scientific rigour is a major reason you get suckered in to those conspiracy theory sites you so love. You are exactly the target demographic. Yes, it matters. Ask a Ukrainian or indeed a Russian. Ukraine is not part of Russia despite its rhetoric. The arrogance of someone who spends his time constructing strawmans yet talks of attention to detail. What 'conspiracy theory sites'? You are so full of BS Maple that you could fertilize enough crops to lower the food prices.
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| Stirlingsays 21 Nov 22 2.20am |
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Iraq is currently being bombed by both Turkey and Iran. I suspect there is a hell of a lot going on that's under our radar.....Again, let's hope for de-escalation, unfortunately something that's not in vogue since supposedly the 'adults' got back in the room.
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| steeleye20 Croydon 23 Dec 22 1.08pm |
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Over 100,000 Russian military now perished, mind-boggling. No sign of a let-up either, or the remotest chance of a deal. Ukrainians having a very tough winter, our hearts go out to them.
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ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 23 Dec 22 1.34pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
Over 100,000 Russian military now perished, mind-boggling. No sign of a let-up either, or the remotest chance of a deal. Ukrainians having a very tough winter, our hearts go out to them.
I would nowhere near believe 100,000 dead. Putin is not Stalin.
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| footythoughts Beckenham 23 Dec 22 2.21pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
I would nowhere near believe 100,000 dead. Putin is not Stalin. In the fog of war it's so hard to know the numbers. Possibly half war between their ultra low declared figure and the high one given elsewhere isn't a bad rule of thumb as that dials down propoganda on both sides. Whatever the number they were sent to die by inept leadership who thought they could basically take over a country overnight. An outlook that comes about when anyone aside from unquestioning yes men have a habit and misfortune of ingesting poison or falling over balconies.
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cryrst  The garden of England 23 Dec 22 8.01pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
I would nowhere near believe 100,000 dead. Putin is not Stalin. Correct as Stalin would have taken Ukraine by now !
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