Selfish Firefighters on Strike
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 kennybrowns leftfoot  Reigate 01 Nov 14 2.07am |
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I have read this thread with interest. Fireman are doing what they are entitled to and that is strike. Personally it is poinleS's. They have to step into line just like the old bill and the ambulance service have had to. What u need to remember is that alot of them like me were promised something when they signeed up and now the goalposts have been moved. Like me in the old bill. I joined in 2000 and was told I would do 30 years and get a decent pension at the end. Now after 15 years I've been told by the government 'actually your going to do another 9 years on top until your 60 and get less than you thought Yes still an ok pension but it wasn't what I signed up for. That's a bitter pill to swallow when you've spent half of your supposed service making plans and thinking you were getting a certain deal. There's no love lost between the old bill and the fire service but I don't blame them for striking which they are entitled to. If the old bill were allowed to strike I would strike tomor row against this government. Theresa May is to the emergency services what Maggie Thatcher is to the miners..... Awful woman.
Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!! |
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| timmyb Banstead 01 Nov 14 8.12am |
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Never been a militant leftie, but always intrigued by striking fireman with their burning brazier outside their stations. What would happen if the brazier got out of control and the station caught fire? If they dialled 999 would their striking colleagues elsewhere come and put it out or not? would be ironic if they had to be bailed out by the RAF firemen in their 1970s green wagon things.
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| Helmet46 Croydon 01 Nov 14 8.15am |
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I don't have a major problem with a strike - if they really feel that is their last resort and they feel it may work. What I DO have a problem with is the timing. Sure they have to give 7 days notice, so give 14 and do it the following week. Anyone who thinks that the timing of the strike is solely the fault of the Govt is nuts. The Union had a choice and chose the first possible date, which was fireworks time, and hang the consequences. They did not have to do that and knew what they were doing.
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| gbox82 Meols, Wirral 01 Nov 14 9.00am |
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Quote Mapletree at 31 Oct 2014 9.06pm
This is one topic that really rings my bells The ridiculous pension arrangements entered into with the baby boom generation are going to cripple the newer generations It simply isn't fair Just look at the smug generation currently in their 60s, 70s and 80s. They are effectively taking money from my children. There is no way they paid enough in for the benefits they are now receiving. As you can tell by the way BA is on it's knees. 75% of final salary index linked, you're having a laugh. It needs reforming and fast. Nobody should be immune. DB schemes are massively immoral, everyone knows it yet people will fight tooth and nail to keep them for obvious reasons. There is nothing more special about the previous generation, why should the young be forced to pay for one golden generation that designed a scheme that benefited it but would never be sustainable. Biggest con ever. Couldn't agree more, well said.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 01 Nov 14 9.10am |
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Personally, I think the Police service, Army and Ambulance service have been specifically hard done by because they cannot take industrial action, leading them to be targeted. We could have chosen to honour our collective emergency services by allowing them to retain these privillages, as a sign of respect to the essential services they perform for our society, as well as recognising the dangers inherent in those jobs (psychologically and physically). In turn this could well have served as an incentive for people to remain in and join these services, as well as a means of valuing that their contribution to society deserves specific reward. I exclude the RAF and Navy, largely because the specific risks for most in those services is fairly minimal.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 01 Nov 14 9.13am |
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Quote Jimenez at 31 Oct 2014 8.58pm
Quote nickgusset at 31 Oct 2014 8.54pm
Quote Stuk at 31 Oct 2014 8.39pm
Quote Kermit8 at 31 Oct 2014 8.11pm
Quote Stuk at 31 Oct 2014 8.08pm
I posted this earlier in the week. There's nothing unreasonable about the changes that are needed. The argument of no one wanting 60 year old firemen is a non-starter.
60 is cutting them some slack when they want everyone else to go to 68, and surely rising.
It is, but the construction industry is not one in which the risks are taken entirely on the behalf of other people. Of course if Construction was as well unionised as the Fire Brigade that might not be the case....
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Jimenez  SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 01 Nov 14 9.30am |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 01 Nov 2014 9.13am
Quote Jimenez at 31 Oct 2014 8.58pm
Quote nickgusset at 31 Oct 2014 8.54pm
Quote Stuk at 31 Oct 2014 8.39pm
Quote Kermit8 at 31 Oct 2014 8.11pm
Quote Stuk at 31 Oct 2014 8.08pm
I posted this earlier in the week. There's nothing unreasonable about the changes that are needed. The argument of no one wanting 60 year old firemen is a non-starter.
60 is cutting them some slack when they want everyone else to go to 68, and surely rising.
It is, but the construction industry is not one in which the risks are taken entirely on the behalf of other people. Of course if Construction was as well unionised as the Fire Brigade that might not be the case.... If it was unionized believe me carpenters would be earning 12 quid an hour(If they were lucky)instead of a decent(ish)30 quid an hour
Pro USA & Israel |
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| Hoof Hearted 01 Nov 14 10.20am | |
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Quote Mapletree at 31 Oct 2014 9.06pm
This is one topic that really rings my bells The ridiculous pension arrangements entered into with the baby boom generation are going to cripple the newer generations It simply isn't fair Just look at the smug generation currently in their 60s, 70s and 80s. They are effectively taking money from my children. There is no way they paid enough in for the benefits they are now receiving. As you can tell by the way BA is on it's knees. 75% of final salary index linked, you're having a laugh. It needs reforming and fast. Nobody should be immune. DB schemes are massively immoral, everyone knows it yet people will fight tooth and nail to keep them for obvious reasons. There is nothing more special about the previous generation, why should the young be forced to pay for one golden generation that designed a scheme that benefited it but would never be sustainable. Biggest con ever.
Most schemes in the private sector have made dramatic cutbacks in benefits to cut costs - some have been shut down. The public sector workers have yet to admit they are still receiving unsustainable benefits from their pension schemes (topped up by taxpayers whereas private schemes aren't!). The Fire Brigade will have to conform, but the biggest winners in the pensions stakes are MP's, Judges, High Ranking Civil Servants etc., who are bleeding us dry.
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| Mapletree Croydon 01 Nov 14 10.29am |
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Let's get this into perspective Being a fire fighter is not especially dangerous Far less dangerous than being a builder, a rubbish collection operative We don't give special allowances to them, even though for example the dustmen also do a crucial role for us. And the point that they work shifts can be seen two ways. Last I knew it was 4 on 4 off and all firefighters I knew did additional work outside their main jobs. I know, I employed them back in the day. And by the way, if you can't be a firefighter after 60 does that really make you incapable of doing anything else up to normal retirement age? Especially when you have in all probability been doing your second job for the past 35 years in any case? I have way more sympathy for farmworkers who both do a more dangerous job and get paid a pittance. I am not saying it doesn't stick in the throat when the goal posts get moved but they moved for everyone in the country not specifically for firefighters, Police etc. It's the economy stupid.
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or a farmworker.| Eustace H. Plimsoll Aldershot 01 Nov 14 10.54am |
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Can anyone help? - I can't decide if withdrawal of labour is understandable and justified or a wicked disgrace. When it's argued that the elite shouldn't be made worse-off through higher taxation etc., lest they hitch up their expensive skirts and scurry off, this seems generally accepted by some as a given and reasonable way of things. When the working class (if you will. You won't?? Please yourself...) strike, the same group of people seem to view this as the work (arf!) of scum and parasites. Lumme, it's a minefield, innit? (Let's hope bomb-disposal are fabulously wealthy or don't expect robust pension agreement if not.) Edited by Eustace H. Plimsoll (01 Nov 2014 10.57am)
As a woman, I can step aside, or step up my game... |
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| rob1969 Banstead Surrey 01 Nov 14 10.57am |
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Quote gbox82 at 01 Nov 2014 9.00am
Quote Mapletree at 31 Oct 2014 9.06pm
This is one topic that really rings my bells The ridiculous pension arrangements entered into with the baby boom generation are going to cripple the newer generations It simply isn't fair Just look at the smug generation currently in their 60s, 70s and 80s. They are effectively taking money from my children. There is no way they paid enough in for the benefits they are now receiving. As you can tell by the way BA is on it's knees. 75% of final salary index linked, you're having a laugh. It needs reforming and fast. Nobody should be immune. DB schemes are massively immoral, everyone knows it yet people will fight tooth and nail to keep them for obvious reasons. There is nothing more special about the previous generation, why should the young be forced to pay for one golden generation that designed a scheme that benefited it but would never be sustainable. Biggest con ever. Couldn't agree more, well said. Nobody gave me anything - I'm as entitled to my state pension as were your parents and no doubt you will ne in due course. regarding any occupational pension I have - I paid into it for 30 years! I retired at 65 having stated work at 16. I played by the rules that applied then - you must do the same by the current rules.
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| Helmet46 Croydon 01 Nov 14 11.01am |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 01 Nov 2014 10.20am
Quote Mapletree at 31 Oct 2014 9.06pm
This is one topic that really rings my bells The ridiculous pension arrangements entered into with the baby boom generation are going to cripple the newer generations It simply isn't fair Just look at the smug generation currently in their 60s, 70s and 80s. They are effectively taking money from my children. There is no way they paid enough in for the benefits they are now receiving. As you can tell by the way BA is on it's knees. 75% of final salary index linked, you're having a laugh. It needs reforming and fast. Nobody should be immune. DB schemes are massively immoral, everyone knows it yet people will fight tooth and nail to keep them for obvious reasons. There is nothing more special about the previous generation, why should the young be forced to pay for one golden generation that designed a scheme that benefited it but would never be sustainable. Biggest con ever.
Most schemes in the private sector have made dramatic cutbacks in benefits to cut costs - some have been shut down. The public sector workers have yet to admit they are still receiving unsustainable benefits from their pension schemes (topped up by taxpayers whereas private schemes aren't!). The Fire Brigade will have to conform, but the biggest winners in the pensions stakes are MP's, Judges, High Ranking Civil Servants etc., who are bleeding us dry.
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