A collection of problems

MrRobbo Purley 07 Dec 23 10.18am
Last night really was the pits. The game was terrible, the worst I can remember, but our problems are much bigger than just one performance. In reality, I think it’s a mixture of a lot of things, and a lot intertwine. Roy is catching the flack this morning, but IMO most to be fair land at the feet of SP and DF: Squad Our squad has been paper thin for years, 1 LB, old RB's, only 2 real attacking players with quality etc. We also know that players get injured, it happens. I wouldn’t say its unusual for every team to have a player our for the season. Yet there seams to be no desire to effectively strengthen it. We play with 2 DCMs, we now only have 1, we also now don’t have a LB. Is there any team in the league so short? Transfer market We had reasonable funds, but spent them poorly, especially considering some of the players our peers picked up. And as a result its likely that none of the money spent in the window will really get on the pitch this season. To top it off there were some excellent free transfers (we got one), but look at Ross Barkley’s performances against us and Arsenal. He’s better than all of our CM’s. We also didn’t utilise the loan market, which with a small squad seams criminal. Wilf Wilf has almost singlehandedly carried us for the best part of a decade. To think that he can be replaced with a combination of Franca and Jeff, is either ignorant or at best plan stupid. It was right for him to go but where was the succession planning Plan for youth We are all on board with buying young and planning for hte future, but I’m not really sure what the plan is. When Brighton signed McAlister and Mitoma, they were immediately put back out on loan. We however have Franca and Ebiowei sat on the bench. Never getting on. Is that useful for their progress? Jes RS? Would he have been better off at a chanps club. It all stinks of a complete lack of joined up thinking. Game plan Watching the game last night was difficult, but the one thing that was really clear was the fact that they had a game plan, and we didn’t really. Every time they got possession, they put a cross in, there must have been about 10 in 5 mins. The last of which they scored from. We in comparison, looked slow and lost for most of the game. Most spells of possession ended without an ‘attack’. We don’t really have a style, we find it impossible to be direct. And most odd, we don’t seam to have a plan B.
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MrRobbo

Purley 07 Dec 23 10.18am

Last night really was the pits. The game was terrible, the worst I can remember, but our problems are much bigger than just one performance.

In reality, I think it’s a mixture of a lot of things, and a lot intertwine. Roy is catching the flack this morning, but IMO most to be fair land at the feet of SP and DF:

Squad
Our squad has been paper thin for years, 1 LB, old RB's, only 2 real attacking players with quality etc. We also know that players get injured, it happens. I wouldn’t say its unusual for every team to have a player our for the season. Yet there seams to be no desire to effectively strengthen it.

We play with 2 DCMs, we now only have 1, we also now don’t have a LB. Is there any team in the league so short?

Transfer market
We had reasonable funds, but spent them poorly, especially considering some of the players our peers picked up. And as a result its likely that none of the money spent in the window will really get on the pitch this season.

To top it off there were some excellent free transfers (we got one), but look at Ross Barkley’s performances against us and Arsenal. He’s better than all of our CM’s.

We also didn’t utilise the loan market, which with a small squad seams criminal.

Wilf
Wilf has almost singlehandedly carried us for the best part of a decade. To think that he can be replaced with a combination of Franca and Jeff, is either ignorant or at best plan stupid. It was right for him to go but where was the succession planning

Plan for youth
We are all on board with buying young and planning for hte future, but I’m not really sure what the plan is. When Brighton signed McAlister and Mitoma, they were immediately put back out on loan. We however have Franca and Ebiowei sat on the bench. Never getting on. Is that useful for their progress? Jes RS? Would he have been better off at a chanps club. It all stinks of a complete lack of joined up thinking.

Game plan
Watching the game last night was difficult, but the one thing that was really clear was the fact that they had a game plan, and we didn’t really. Every time they got possession, they put a cross in, there must have been about 10 in 5 mins. The last of which they scored from.

We in comparison, looked slow and lost for most of the game. Most spells of possession ended without an ‘attack’. We don’t really have a style, we find it impossible to be direct. And most odd, we don’t seam to have a plan B.

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palace99 New Mills 07 Dec 23 10.59am
can't disagree with anything you have said. Other than flashes from Olise and Ayew we looked toothless and so one paced. We build slowly from the back which gives teams time to regroup and none of the midfield 3 are great passers to get things going. At one point a Guehi ran into the corner as he didn't have a pass on. With our fall backs not overly attacking it allows teams to double up on Olise whereas when they attack it is often a 1 on 1 against Ward. As for the squad - players like Hughes and Schlupp are paid over £50k a week and have years of prem experience. They are on paper at their peak, aged 28 and 30 years respectively. Yet both have shown this season how off the pace they are and yesterday Hughes was dropped in place of a defender with limited passing. When Lerma made his run early in the 2nd half and hit the post that showed the way forward, however, no similar runs were made. Surely that was Schlupp's role, yet he never made a run behind once. Jairo has been with us for years and is also paid £50k a week. He can play as a CM or a LB. Yesterday we needed both and yet Roy didn't risk him . These players are just not good enough. As for transfers the 2 wingers for Bournemouth last night, both of whom looked good could easily have been purchased by us. One was bought in Jan for £10m (the same as we spent on Ahamada) and the lad from Leeds is on loan.
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palace99

New Mills 07 Dec 23 10.59am

can't disagree with anything you have said.

Other than flashes from Olise and Ayew we looked toothless and so one paced.
We build slowly from the back which gives teams time to regroup and none of the midfield 3 are great passers to get things going. At one point a Guehi ran into the corner as he didn't have a pass on.

With our fall backs not overly attacking it allows teams to double up on Olise whereas when they attack it is often a 1 on 1 against Ward.

As for the squad - players like Hughes and Schlupp are paid over £50k a week and have years of prem experience. They are on paper at their peak, aged 28 and 30 years respectively. Yet both have shown this season how off the pace they are and yesterday Hughes was dropped in place of a defender with limited passing.
When Lerma made his run early in the 2nd half and hit the post that showed the way forward, however, no similar runs were made. Surely that was Schlupp's role, yet he never made a run behind once.

Jairo has been with us for years and is also paid £50k a week. He can play as a CM or a LB. Yesterday we needed both and yet Roy didn't risk him .
These players are just not good enough.

As for transfers the 2 wingers for Bournemouth last night, both of whom looked good could easily have been purchased by us. One was bought in Jan for £10m (the same as we spent on Ahamada) and the lad from Leeds is on loan.

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Nicholas91 The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Dec 23 11.41am
Originally posted by palace99 can't disagree with anything you have said. Other than flashes from Olise and Ayew we looked toothless and so one paced. We build slowly from the back which gives teams time to regroup and none of the midfield 3 are great passers to get things going. At one point a Guehi ran into the corner as he didn't have a pass on. With our fall backs not overly attacking it allows teams to double up on Olise whereas when they attack it is often a 1 on 1 against Ward. As for the squad - players like Hughes and Schlupp are paid over £50k a week and have years of prem experience. They are on paper at their peak, aged 28 and 30 years respectively. Yet both have shown this season how off the pace they are and yesterday Hughes was dropped in place of a defender with limited passing. When Lerma made his run early in the 2nd half and hit the post that showed the way forward, however, no similar runs were made. Surely that was Schlupp's role, yet he never made a run behind once. Jairo has been with us for years and is also paid £50k a week. He can play as a CM or a LB. Yesterday we needed both and yet Roy didn't risk him . These players are just not good enough. As for transfers the 2 wingers for Bournemouth last night, both of whom looked good could easily have been purchased by us. One was bought in Jan for £10m (the same as we spent on Ahamada) and the lad from Leeds is on loan. They started with Sinisterra, Solanke, Kluivert and Semenyo last night. Any one of them would do. If B'mouth can get those 4 why have we not got a single player in up top, especially with Zaha leaving? None of it makes sense. Three transfer fees paid with not one of those players even remotely close to being in the first XI. At what point do you stop saying to yourself 'well, what do I know' and start firmly believing that nobody knows anything at the club. I didn't expect us to have Guehi, Andersen, Olise, Eze etc. transfer windows every time they roll around but I certainly expected some continuation of that, even in drips and drabs. Doucoure and Johnstone have been the only additions to it since and we had a whole squad that needed replacing, least of all the mitigating for the loss of a player who may have claim to singlehandedly keeping us in the top flight for a decade. Didn't happen. Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!
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Nicholas91

The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Dec 23 11.41am

Originally posted by palace99

can't disagree with anything you have said.

With our fall backs not overly attacking it allows teams to double up on Olise whereas when they attack it is often a 1 on 1 against Ward.

Jairo has been with us for years and is also paid £50k a week. He can play as a CM or a LB. Yesterday we needed both and yet Roy didn't risk him .
These players are just not good enough.

They started with Sinisterra, Solanke, Kluivert and Semenyo last night. Any one of them would do. If B'mouth can get those 4 why have we not got a single player in up top, especially with Zaha leaving?

None of it makes sense. Three transfer fees paid with not one of those players even remotely close to being in the first XI. At what point do you stop saying to yourself 'well, what do I know' and start firmly believing that nobody knows anything at the club.

I didn't expect us to have Guehi, Andersen, Olise, Eze etc. transfer windows every time they roll around but I certainly expected some continuation of that, even in drips and drabs. Doucoure and Johnstone have been the only additions to it since and we had a whole squad that needed replacing, least of all the mitigating for the loss of a player who may have claim to singlehandedly keeping us in the top flight for a decade. Didn't happen.

Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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southnorwoodhill 07 Dec 23 11.55am
Let's have a look at the first 11 - how many are PL capable, and if and when Hodgson departs how many would like to take up the challenge, stick around for the new manager, and make a good go of it? Johnstone, Andersen, Guehi, Doucoure, Lerma, Eze, Olise, arguably good enough and some have been valued as high as £80m and are internationals too, wow. It all depends if they want to stay or see their futures elsewhere. In addition maybe Ayew for another year, and Edouard as he does know where the goal is, although currently we don't play to his strengths and he has mentioned that he wants off. All the rest are bit part fill in not good enough. Any new manager would have to be extremely mindful of what he is taking on, and if no transfer funds were available would have to rely on loans, or indeed, use our much lauded "future of the club" youngsters. A positive outlook essential. Must have experience of working with youngsters and evidence of bringing them through onto the larger stage. Interesting times ahead. Edited by southnorwoodhill (07 Dec 2023 1.06pm)
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southnorwoodhill

07 Dec 23 11.55am

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Let's have a look at the first 11 - how many are PL capable, and if and when Hodgson departs how many would like to take up the challenge, stick around for the new manager, and make a good go of it?
Johnstone, Andersen, Guehi, Doucoure, Lerma, Eze, Olise, arguably good enough and some have been valued as high as £80m and are internationals too, wow. It all depends if they want to stay or see their futures elsewhere. In addition maybe Ayew for another year, and Edouard as he does know where the goal is, although currently we don't play to his strengths and he has mentioned that he wants off.
All the rest are bit part fill in not good enough.
Any new manager would have to be extremely mindful of what he is taking on, and if no transfer funds were available would have to rely on loans, or indeed, use our much lauded "future of the club" youngsters. A positive outlook essential. Must have experience of working with youngsters and evidence of bringing them through onto the larger stage.
Interesting times ahead.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (07 Dec 2023 1.06pm)

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Dangermouse Hastings 07 Dec 23 12.51pm
We paid £26m for França to play, it really is that simple. If you spend £2-8m on young South Americans then you send them on loan into Europe like Brighton do to acclimatise and be ready. Roy's refusal to play young players is limiting him and damaging those who play every minute of every game. The 5 sub rule actually makes it less of a risk for Roy, cos he can always make changes if he really feels he needs to. Right now though, I actually don't want him to play the youth, cos they will be being brought into a struggling side, playing a totally negative alien system to them and have the negative words of their manager still ringing in their ears. I don't want to see anyone else getting 'Meyered' by Roy. What sums up Roy is that when Rak-Sakyi had that good appearance, what he praised was his defending. Expressing yourself is frowned upon. Why we didn't use the loan market in the Summer to bring in a couple of players he would use totally baffles me. I've never enjoyed Royball but I appreciate all he's done for the club and really wanted him to leave as a hero last season. Sadly he looks like he will leave as a villain. Very short sighted Mr Parish. Edited by Dangermouse (07 Dec 2023 12.54pm) That's Life And as funny as it may seem Some people get their kicks stompin' on a Dream. KEEP THE FAITH!!!!!
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Dangermouse

Hastings 07 Dec 23 12.51pm

We paid £26m for França to play, it really is that simple. If you spend £2-8m on young South Americans then you send them on loan into Europe like Brighton do to acclimatise and be ready. Roy's refusal to play young players is limiting him and damaging those who play every minute of every game. The 5 sub rule actually makes it less of a risk for Roy, cos he can always make changes if he really feels he needs to.
Right now though, I actually don't want him to play the youth, cos they will be being brought into a struggling side, playing a totally negative alien system to them and have the negative words of their manager still ringing in their ears. I don't want to see anyone else getting 'Meyered' by Roy. What sums up Roy is that when Rak-Sakyi had that good appearance, what he praised was his defending. Expressing yourself is frowned upon.

Why we didn't use the loan market in the Summer to bring in a couple of players he would use totally baffles me.

I've never enjoyed Royball but I appreciate all he's done for the club and really wanted him to leave as a hero last season. Sadly he looks like he will leave as a villain.
Very short sighted Mr Parish.

Edited by Dangermouse (07 Dec 2023 12.54pm)

That's Life
And as funny as it may seem
Some people get their kicks stompin' on a Dream.
KEEP THE FAITH!!!!!

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palace99 New Mills 07 Dec 23 6.00pm
supposedly the young LW at Burnley who has looked really good this season, but just got injured, cost £2.7m this summer and already plays for Italy u21. For any decent scout he should have at least been on someone's radar. We don't have a LW, want young, up and coming players yet don't seem to have a scouting network. Franca might be a great player but when Chelsea showed an interest and pushed the price up we should have walked away. Surely £5m upfront is the tops we should be gambling on a guy who was never going to make an impact this season. Of the youth players surely David Ozoh should at least be on the bench. After all he is a defensive CM, so the only natural replacement we have for Doucoure.
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palace99

New Mills 07 Dec 23 6.00pm

supposedly the young LW at Burnley who has looked really good this season, but just got injured, cost £2.7m this summer and already plays for Italy u21. For any decent scout he should have at least been on someone's radar.

We don't have a LW, want young, up and coming players yet don't seem to have a scouting network.

Franca might be a great player but when Chelsea showed an interest and pushed the price up we should have walked away. Surely £5m upfront is the tops we should be gambling on a guy who was never going to make an impact this season.

Of the youth players surely David Ozoh should at least be on the bench. After all he is a defensive CM, so the only natural replacement we have for Doucoure.

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