What have I done....

"They got his own song 'He's just too good for you', it's quite unbelievable but when you see it and he's facing up someone - I actually feel sorry for them, 'Cos he actually is" - Ian Holloway

Jamie, it's clear that appealing to logic and reason is wasted in this thread. There are obviously a number of people who value their freedom of expression above the club's reputation, and are willing to let the chips fall where they may.

I suspect that most of this discussion is somewhat moot anyway. The club is already well aware of the negative feedback that arose from a brief TV closeup in the home game again Man City, and in discussion with the HF was able to prevent further escalation of the issue in subsequent games. Knowing this, I can't seem them allowing anybody to display the flag at Selhurst. They were certainly not shy about inhibiting Man U supporters freedom of expression to wear Cantona masks, since it would cause offence to a large number of Palace supporters.

Edited by MikeT (15 Jul 2014 7.52pm)

Like it or not a huge number of English/ british are more than proud of our flag and will never feel embarrassed to fly it .
Regardless of what group uses it or is offended by it.
I couldn't give 2 f-cks who is upset by it.
This is England after all

The world was a mess but his hair was perfect!

It was not the only reason but is was the primary cause of the civil war and almost all other issues still had their roots in the southern states wanting to retain slavery. It wasn't the last straw at all, it was the primary cause.

Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand!

My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right.

(Member of the School of Optimism 1969-2016 inclusive)

Definitely, and eventually it would have ended as industrialisation took over. However, the key point is that a flag is a symbol, and represents the presentation of a series of concepts associated with it society.

The Confederate Battle Flag cannot be separated from what it represents historically: its a flag that's associated with the Confederacy, slavery, the anti-desegregation movements and of course the KKK.

Its possible to reclaim symbols, such as the St Union flag from the NF etc but the Confederate Battle Flag has never really represented anything much beyond 'Southern US Politics' which has been stepped in racialism and racial prejudice since its inception.

Its only other association is with 'Rebellion', but again its the rebellion in which the South claimed independency from the North, and one of the key issues in the right of independency was retention of slave labour and racialism - That's why the Klan adopted it because it represented their beliefs.

Its a shame, because for Palace it could be a great symbolic flag, it being red and blue, with an association to the 'Rise of the South' / 'The South will Rise Again' only needing the word London added to give it a Selhurst poignancy.

All the talk about honouring the confederate dead seems a bit bizarre, as they represented a US that never was (and radically departed from the current US that the same people tend to talk about patriotically).

Its interesting that its reappearance in US culture was only really in the 1950s, when Georgia adopted the flag as its state flag whilst presenting a defence of segregation. I think a lot of people who claim the defence of honouring the dead great-great grandfather have essentially picking up on a discourse of 'defence of the indefensible' presented by certain factions in US Southern Politics that represent 'them good old days'. Kind of how politicians talk about 'supporting the troops' rather than discussing the war.

Certainly before the 1950s, hardly anyone down south was using the Confederate Battle Flag.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Although in fairness I've never really understood why people feel the need to fly flags all the time in the first place to show 'pride'. Whilst some of those I've met turn out to be decent people, most of them have tended to be fairly lowly educated stupid people, who use phrases 'I'm not a racist but...'.

Bloke over the road from my parents flies a Union Jack, as he calls it, I didn't have the heart to tell him that its only the Union Jack if flown from a Ship, or that its upside down.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]