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This (Cameron protest)

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View Mr_Gristle's Profile Mr_Gristle Flag In the land of Whelk Eaters 11 Apr 16 12.49pm Send a Private Message to Mr_Gristle Add Mr_Gristle as a friend

Nearly laughed out loud on seeing a fellow commuter's Daily Mail scream "Enough is Enough!" this morning. Our poor PM....

I'm sure there will be a benefits cheat scandal along soon enough.

All sarcasm aside, Jamie's points about what can be thought of as little bits of flex around the edges (in both tax and benefits creativity) are very strong.

"Aggressive" (to use HMRC's own language) tactics are where the attention of law makers and law enforcers needs to be. Cameron is guilty of being evasive and hypocritical - we're all in this together Dave - but there are many much bigger schemes and sums out there that need proper scrutiny.

Perhaps they should pursue them with the same vigour that self-employed low earning taxpayers and benefit claimants are policed with?

 


Well I think Simon's head is large; always involved in espionage. (Name that tune)

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 11 Apr 16 12.51pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Why on earth are MPs declaring their tax returns? It's absolutely ludicrous, it's their personal finances. Clue is in the word, PERSONAL. Surely we shouldn't be making the idea of being an MP even more undesirable, we want to attract the best people to run the country, this is not the way to do it!

They shouldn't, except of course to HMRC etc.

No ones personal information should be available except with a) their consent b) public necessity.

Of course it'll be interesting in the light of these Panama leaks whether the declarations of earnings to HMRC in a given year, from various sources, listed those held in obfuscated accounts.

And this is I think the key issue, not appearances, but actual 'wrong doing'.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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View Canterbury Palace's Profile Canterbury Palace Flag Whitstable 11 Apr 16 1.07pm Send a Private Message to Canterbury Palace Add Canterbury Palace as a friend

Originally posted by We are goin up!

The complete tw*t in that video went on This Week (political programme that's on after Question Time) trying to convince everyone that they shouldn't vote. He was also privately educated, nice place to have socialist views from, isn't it? BBC's wet dream. Watch Andrew Neil tearing him apart here:

[Link]

When will the left learn that the more they moan, the less appealing their cause is to the average man? It's pathetic. They think because they shout the loudest that they are winning the argument, even though time and again this is proved to not be the case.

Cameron has clearly not done anything wrong, his crime is to wisely manage his personal finances. I'd be more worried if he hadn't. Having said that, he hasn't covered himself in glory in his handling of it. Calls for him to resign are ludicrous.


Edited by We are goin up! (11 Apr 2016 11.25am)

The fact that he opened his mouth to drink before he had even picked up his glass at about 1:28 has angered me more than it probably should. What a loathsome individual.

 


We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold...

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View Kingvagabond's Profile Kingvagabond Flag London 11 Apr 16 3.27pm Send a Private Message to Kingvagabond Add Kingvagabond as a friend

See there's a thing about all this totally legal ergo not immoral stuff. Just because you canlegallydo something doesn't mean it is morally right. Tax planning is finding loopholes to be used to pay less tax than you might have to right? If you are intended to have to pay X amount of tax and instead pay Y is that not morally dubious? Especially, when generally screaming from the rooftops about so called benefits cheats.

 


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Quote cornwalls palace at 24 Oct 2012 9.37am

He was right!!!...and we killed him!!... poor Orpinton Eagles........

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View JL85's Profile JL85 Flag London,SE9 11 Apr 16 4.20pm Send a Private Message to JL85 Add JL85 as a friend

Originally posted by Kingvagabond

See there's a thing about all this totally legal ergo not immoral stuff. Just because you canlegallydo something doesn't mean it is morally right. Tax planning is finding loopholes to be used to pay less tax than you might have to right? If you are intended to have to pay X amount of tax and instead pay Y is that not morally dubious? Especially, when generally screaming from the rooftops about so called benefits cheats.

A point that seem's totally lost on the right. They love a hard line approach, until it's aimed at them, then they scuttle back to the left.

 

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View susmik's Profile susmik Flag PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 11 Apr 16 5.00pm Send a Private Message to susmik Add susmik as a friend

Originally posted by phil19750

Yeah, he hasn't handled it particularly well, but then again, what has his private finances got to do with anyone else?

If he acted illegally, then that is a matter for the courts.

Who can honestly say that they have never paid a builder cash in hand, or bought foreign fags that were not subject to import duty?

It's all b0llocks.

Well said that man....... Dave has done nothing wrong or illegal.

 


Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

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View Kingvagabond's Profile Kingvagabond Flag London 11 Apr 16 5.16pm Send a Private Message to Kingvagabond Add Kingvagabond as a friend

Originally posted by susmik

Well said that man....... Dave has done nothing wrong or illegal.

Other than deliberately misleading the public for five days until he was sure that he hadn't. However, being that he has released a summary of his tax returns not his full financial accounts we actually have no idea of whether he has or not.

 


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Quote cornwalls palace at 24 Oct 2012 9.37am

He was right!!!...and we killed him!!... poor Orpinton Eagles........

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View npn's Profile npn Flag Crowborough 11 Apr 16 5.29pm Send a Private Message to npn Add npn as a friend

Originally posted by Kingvagabond

See there's a thing about all this totally legal ergo not immoral stuff. Just because you canlegallydo something doesn't mean it is morally right. Tax planning is finding loopholes to be used to pay less tax than you might have to right? If you are intended to have to pay X amount of tax and instead pay Y is that not morally dubious? Especially, when generally screaming from the rooftops about so called benefits cheats.

I do get that, it's just that you can't really define what you're 'intended' to pay. For instance, ISAs are, presumably, considered legitimate tax efficient mechanisms, intended to be taken advantage of, but as you get deeper into the ins and outs of tax law, the rules get more complex and difficult to compartmentalise into "legit" and "taking liberties". For instance, I have no idea why the 'gift' rules (exempt from inheritance tax) are in place - it makes no sense to me. What is the difference between someone giving me 10 grand as a gift, and someone bequeathing me 10 grand in their will for me to receive once they know they won't be needing it any more - why is one subject to tax and the other isn't?

I don't know all the rules, and I'd wager nobody on here (unless we have a few accountants) does. I claimed CGT back on a failed business venture against a CGT profit on a house sale purely because my accountant told me I could. That's what he's paid for, and it saved me a good few quid. There was no hiding funds, or avoiding tax going on. I suspect one way we could alleviate the p*ss-taking is to somehow make the facilitating of schemes designed to hide funds from the tax man illegal so that someone is ultimately held responsible, which again comes down to chucking money at HMRC to plug the holes in some way.

Set a thief to catch a thief - chuck the top accountants at HMRC with a remit to plug the holes and come up with a solution

 

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View Kingvagabond's Profile Kingvagabond Flag London 11 Apr 16 6.04pm Send a Private Message to Kingvagabond Add Kingvagabond as a friend

I think the problem is the HMRC is a completely morally corrupt, inefficient and completely inept organisation who commit 'legal' harassment on a regular basis usually whilst acting on totally erroneous information based on their own mistakes and then are completely backed up by unfair tax collection laws unless you prove completely that it's them who have f***ed up, whilst they continue to pass your information onto violent debt collection agencies. All whilst making deals with multinational conglomerates to pay 1% of the amount they should be paying.

 


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Quote cornwalls palace at 24 Oct 2012 9.37am

He was right!!!...and we killed him!!... poor Orpinton Eagles........

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 11 Apr 16 6.09pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by npn

For instance, I have no idea why the 'gift' rules (exempt from inheritance tax) are in place - it makes no sense to me. What is the difference between someone giving me 10 grand as a gift, and someone bequeathing me 10 grand in their will for me to receive once they know they won't be needing it any more - why is one subject to tax and the other isn't?

I believe that only gifts given a certain number of years before the person's death will be exempt from inheritance tax.

 

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View npn's Profile npn Flag Crowborough 11 Apr 16 6.22pm Send a Private Message to npn Add npn as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

I believe that only gifts given a certain number of years before the person's death will be exempt from inheritance tax.

It's 7, I think, and it still makes bugger all sense to me!

 

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View Lyons550's Profile Lyons550 Flag Shirley 11 Apr 16 6.44pm Send a Private Message to Lyons550 Add Lyons550 as a friend

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

Well said npn.

Morality shouldn't come into it.

If Cameron, or any other MP or celebrity has invested in a totally legal tax efficient instrument that is their business and HRMC's - nobody elses.

If you don't like it, form your own political party, get elected and change the tax laws.


Morality is the weakest stance to make an argument anyway...after everything that Camerons been accused of they've been deflected one by one...and now this is all they have.

Yes its important to change the tax legislation...but for everyone. Its the system that needs to be addressed not the individuals whatever their background...or seemingly more importantly class

 


The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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