Boris standing down

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Matov 15 Jun 23 6.44pm
Originally posted by Lanzo-Ad You are correct, you can probably count on one hand the decent ones, although i dont know who they would be, the trouble was Boris was steering the ship at the time. Quite. And as Captain, showed APPALLING judgment. At that time, given what the wider populace were having to endure, even entertaining the notion of having any kind of soiree at work should have been not even on the agenda. The mere suggestion enough for immediate dismissal. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.
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Matov

15 Jun 23 6.44pm

Originally posted by Lanzo-Ad

You are correct, you can probably count on one hand the decent ones, although i dont know who they would be, the trouble was Boris was steering the ship at the time.

Quite. And as Captain, showed APPALLING judgment. At that time, given what the wider populace were having to endure, even entertaining the notion of having any kind of soiree at work should have been not even on the agenda. The mere suggestion enough for immediate dismissal.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 6.53pm
Originally posted by Slimey Toad A major criticism of 'wokeness' is claiming personal truths. What is truth then if it is not simply 'the truth'? It has nothing to do with "wokeness", that slur by the right to denigrate anything which they regard as unacceptable progressiveness. It's true that most of what is claimed as true is only what some believe to be true. Facts are slippery beasts and have a nasty habit of being shown to be untrue as new evidence arrives. Nevertheless, they do exist, and "proven beyond any reasonable doubt" is a useful concept when dealing with others. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 6.53pm

Originally posted by Slimey Toad

A major criticism of 'wokeness' is claiming personal truths. What is truth then if it is not simply 'the truth'?

It has nothing to do with "wokeness", that slur by the right to denigrate anything which they regard as unacceptable progressiveness.

It's true that most of what is claimed as true is only what some believe to be true. Facts are slippery beasts and have a nasty habit of being shown to be untrue as new evidence arrives.

Nevertheless, they do exist, and "proven beyond any reasonable doubt" is a useful concept when dealing with others.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Hrolf The Ganger 15 Jun 23 6.59pm
Originally posted by Matov Quite. And as Captain, showed APPALLING judgment. At that time, given what the wider populace were having to endure, even entertaining the notion of having any kind of soiree at work should have been not even on the agenda. The mere suggestion enough for immediate dismissal. I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months. The truth is that however arrogant or contemptuous Boris was, his downfall has been engineered simply because he got Brexit over the line. In other circumstances, his misdemeanours would have been brushed under the carpet. As we have previously discussed, the Remainers in the Tory Party are prepared to lose the next election to get a chance at reversal, with then eager help of Labourites.
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Hrolf The Ganger

15 Jun 23 6.59pm

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Originally posted by Matov

I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months.

The truth is that however arrogant or contemptuous Boris was, his downfall has been engineered simply because he got Brexit over the line.
In other circumstances, his misdemeanours would have been brushed under the carpet.
As we have previously discussed, the Remainers in the Tory Party are prepared to lose the next election to get a chance at reversal, with then eager help of Labourites.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.05pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 The damage Johnson has inflicted on the country and by all who supported his lies, is incalculable. To think he is still squirming and his motley gang of toffs they should be dropped off a cliff. Lower taxes. Law and order. Interest rates. Inflation. Cost of living. Home ownership. Privatisations. Economic growth. All the tory reasons for being, are all unmitigated disasters. Borrowing out of sight, only the few rich benefit in tory Britain. Off he goes with his new millions having left his country with his rotten brexit deal which looks irrecoverable. You cannot blame all of those on the Tories. The problem is that the Tory Party is an unrealistic coalition of very different views loosely stitched together by history. There are many decent, hard-working members in their ranks. The Labour Party is little different. The Tories made the fatal error in 2016 by holding the referendum to ward off UKIP, expecting their right to disappear with it. That failed, the right gained control and we got Trump-light in No 10. Hopefully, there will now be a reappraisal and a return to decency. Starmer is attempting to do the same for Labour, despite all the snide comments to be read here. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.05pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

The damage Johnson has inflicted on the country and by all who supported his lies, is incalculable.

To think he is still squirming and his motley gang of toffs they should be dropped off a cliff.

Lower taxes.
Law and order.
Interest rates.
Inflation.
Cost of living.
Home ownership.
Privatisations.
Economic growth.

All the tory reasons for being, are all unmitigated disasters.

Borrowing out of sight, only the few rich benefit in tory Britain.

Off he goes with his new millions having left his country with his rotten brexit deal which looks irrecoverable.

You cannot blame all of those on the Tories. The problem is that the Tory Party is an unrealistic coalition of very different views loosely stitched together by history. There are many decent, hard-working members in their ranks.

The Labour Party is little different. The Tories made the fatal error in 2016 by holding the referendum to ward off UKIP, expecting their right to disappear with it. That failed, the right gained control and we got Trump-light in No 10.

Hopefully, there will now be a reappraisal and a return to decency. Starmer is attempting to do the same for Labour, despite all the snide comments to be read here.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.10pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I doubt Boris is any more contemptuous of the people than most other politicians. What is more significant is the agenda to attack him and others simply because they made Brexit happen and upset the globalists. It's Trump all over again. Politics in the West is now like in Third World countries. They remove leaders by any foul means they choose. Trump and Johnson are both tarred with the same populist brush. Say anything that gets them elected. Both ignored the rules/laws and both are now reaping the consequences. There is nothing foul about the law. It applies to everyone. The poor might have more excuses when forced by circumstances to break it, but those in the top office have none at all. Both deserve everything they get. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.10pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I doubt Boris is any more contemptuous of the people than most other politicians.

What is more significant is the agenda to attack him and others simply because they made Brexit happen and upset the globalists.

It's Trump all over again. Politics in the West is now like in Third World countries. They remove leaders by any foul means they choose.

Trump and Johnson are both tarred with the same populist brush. Say anything that gets them elected.

Both ignored the rules/laws and both are now reaping the consequences. There is nothing foul about the law. It applies to everyone. The poor might have more excuses when forced by circumstances to break it, but those in the top office have none at all. Both deserve everything they get.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.13pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You just described all the things politicians rarely have. Don't fall into the trap of thinking that it's all about one man. That's what they want you to think. Is untrue. Many politicians are genuinely motivated by a desire to serve their country. I have met a few and always get on well with them. Johnson may not be alone, but he is unique in his particular style of incompetence. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.13pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You just described all the things politicians rarely have.

Don't fall into the trap of thinking that it's all about one man.

That's what they want you to think.

Is untrue. Many politicians are genuinely motivated by a desire to serve their country. I have met a few and always get on well with them.

Johnson may not be alone, but he is unique in his particular style of incompetence.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.23pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You mean the party and the man the electorate chose in a democratic election? We shouldn't forget that you don't like democracy. You proved that over Brexit. Those damn 'populists'. What a shame they don't all share your overgrown student politics. Wrong, as is depressingly usual. I very much value our Parliamentary Democracy in which we elect representatives to take decisions for us. I don't like referendums, especially when they concern such a fundamental issue as membership of the EU and all it involves. Throwing our country's future to the winds of chance, blown by lies and foreign interference on social media, was an experience I sincerely hope we never repeat. I expect MPs to collectively decide on our behalf. That's how our democracy actually works. Passing the buck to us, because they wanted to see off UKIP was a monumental error and something history will not see kindly. Ending up with Johnson pushing the Brexit beast over the finishing line was the most unedifying piece of politics in my lifetime. Hopefully, today marks another step on the road to recovery. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.23pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You mean the party and the man the electorate chose in a democratic election?

We shouldn't forget that you don't like democracy. You proved that over Brexit.

Those damn 'populists'. What a shame they don't all share your overgrown student politics.

Wrong, as is depressingly usual.

I very much value our Parliamentary Democracy in which we elect representatives to take decisions for us.

I don't like referendums, especially when they concern such a fundamental issue as membership of the EU and all it involves.

Throwing our country's future to the winds of chance, blown by lies and foreign interference on social media, was an experience I sincerely hope we never repeat.

I expect MPs to collectively decide on our behalf. That's how our democracy actually works. Passing the buck to us, because they wanted to see off UKIP was a monumental error and something history will not see kindly. Ending up with Johnson pushing the Brexit beast over the finishing line was the most unedifying piece of politics in my lifetime.

Hopefully, today marks another step on the road to recovery.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.27pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months. The truth is that however arrogant or contemptuous Boris was, his downfall has been engineered simply because he got Brexit over the line. In other circumstances, his misdemeanours would have been brushed under the carpet. As we have previously discussed, the Remainers in the Tory Party are prepared to lose the next election to get a chance at reversal, with then eager help of Labourites. You're nuts. No one would get off the hook for this! Almost anyone else would have resigned in shame months ago and disappeared to work with the disadvantaged to try to restore his reputation. Not Jonhson. He will write books protesting his innocence, and make millions from speaking tours. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Jun 23 7.27pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months.

The truth is that however arrogant or contemptuous Boris was, his downfall has been engineered simply because he got Brexit over the line.
In other circumstances, his misdemeanours would have been brushed under the carpet.
As we have previously discussed, the Remainers in the Tory Party are prepared to lose the next election to get a chance at reversal, with then eager help of Labourites.

You're nuts. No one would get off the hook for this!

Almost anyone else would have resigned in shame months ago and disappeared to work with the disadvantaged to try to restore his reputation.

Not Jonhson. He will write books protesting his innocence, and make millions from speaking tours.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

Hrolf The Ganger 15 Jun 23 7.51pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Is untrue. Many politicians are genuinely motivated by a desire to serve their country. I have met a few and always get on well with them. Johnson may not be alone, but he is unique in his particular style of incompetence. I seriously doubt't many would trust your judgement on character. Yours is dubious to say the least.
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Hrolf The Ganger

15 Jun 23 7.51pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Is untrue. Many politicians are genuinely motivated by a desire to serve their country. I have met a few and always get on well with them.

Johnson may not be alone, but he is unique in his particular style of incompetence.

I seriously doubt't many would trust your judgement on character.

Yours is dubious to say the least.

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Hrolf The Ganger 15 Jun 23 7.52pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle You're nuts. No one would get off the hook for this! Almost anyone else would have resigned in shame months ago and disappeared to work with the disadvantaged to try to restore his reputation. Not Jonhson. He will write books protesting his innocence, and make millions from speaking tours. Spoken like a rabid Remainer.
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Hrolf The Ganger

15 Jun 23 7.52pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

You're nuts. No one would get off the hook for this!

Almost anyone else would have resigned in shame months ago and disappeared to work with the disadvantaged to try to restore his reputation.

Not Jonhson. He will write books protesting his innocence, and make millions from speaking tours.

Spoken like a rabid Remainer.

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Hrolf The Ganger 15 Jun 23 7.56pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Wrong, as is depressingly usual. I very much value our Parliamentary Democracy in which we elect representatives to take decisions for us. I don't like referendums, especially when they concern such a fundamental issue as membership of the EU and all it involves. Throwing our country's future to the winds of chance, blown by lies and foreign interference on social media, was an experience I sincerely hope we never repeat. I expect MPs to collectively decide on our behalf. That's how our democracy actually works. Passing the buck to us, because they wanted to see off UKIP was a monumental error and something history will not see kindly. Ending up with Johnson pushing the Brexit beast over the finishing line was the most unedifying piece of politics in my lifetime. Hopefully, today marks another step on the road to recovery. We have heard that twaddle a million times. There was a referendum, like it or not, and you lost. I know your kind will try everything to overturn it, which is an indication of your narcissism.
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Hrolf The Ganger

15 Jun 23 7.56pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Wrong, as is depressingly usual.

I very much value our Parliamentary Democracy in which we elect representatives to take decisions for us.

I don't like referendums, especially when they concern such a fundamental issue as membership of the EU and all it involves.

Throwing our country's future to the winds of chance, blown by lies and foreign interference on social media, was an experience I sincerely hope we never repeat.

Hopefully, today marks another step on the road to recovery.

We have heard that twaddle a million times.

There was a referendum, like it or not, and you lost.

I know your kind will try everything to overturn it, which is an indication of your narcissism.

Alert a moderator to this post

Matov 15 Jun 23 9.14pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months. The truth is that however arrogant or contemptuous Boris was, his downfall has been engineered simply because he got Brexit over the line. In other circumstances, his misdemeanours would have been brushed under the carpet. As we have previously discussed, the Remainers in the Tory Party are prepared to lose the next election to get a chance at reversal, with then eager help of Labourites. Sorry, have to vehemently disagree. He led a government who imposed all kinds of limits on people which had a massive impact on a multiple of levels. Normal life, including jollies at work, were suspended. Now as to the wisdom of those impositions, for a different debate but the reality was that Johnson was leading the country. And he effectively broke his own rules. Even if he only bent them, it does not matter. True leadership has basic rules. And leading by example is one of them. An act of utter, moronic stupidity on Johnson part to even be in same post-code when those parties happened, let alone present. Whitehall should have been locked down tighter than anywhere else. He failed a crucial leadership test through nothing more than hubris. He is simply not fit to lead the country. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.
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Matov

15 Jun 23 9.14pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I'm prepared to cut some slack for a man who had to win an election, win Brexit and deal with a pandemic all in a few months.

Sorry, have to vehemently disagree. He led a government who imposed all kinds of limits on people which had a massive impact on a multiple of levels. Normal life, including jollies at work, were suspended.

Now as to the wisdom of those impositions, for a different debate but the reality was that Johnson was leading the country. And he effectively broke his own rules. Even if he only bent them, it does not matter. True leadership has basic rules. And leading by example is one of them.

An act of utter, moronic stupidity on Johnson part to even be in same post-code when those parties happened, let alone present. Whitehall should have been locked down tighter than anywhere else. He failed a crucial leadership test through nothing more than hubris.

He is simply not fit to lead the country.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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