I agree with what you’re saying.

Lots of us were aware that things would be difficult. We didn’t vote leave because we didn’t know what we were voting for. Most people are not stupid enough to think that either side of ‘deals made tomorrow’ or ‘financial ruin’ were 100% correct and that the reality wasn’t somewhere in between.

I do want us to leave because the lack of planning and gradual decline of everything other than rigid large companies and this ponzi immigration policy, or no policy, has to stop imo. But ultimately I won’t give a flying fvck when they’re all regretting remaining, being tied up in this when I’m dying. Everyone is becoming so self interested or selfish, why should I? Btw, I voted in the belief that Brexit would give us the chance, motivation and impetus to change course, because we won’t do it for any other reason.

It’s a shame we don’t have more balls any more like Germany, although we have the sense of humour they don’t, even if Hennimg Berg is pretty funny. But soon we won’t have a sense of humour if the people at the forefront of social media almost steering opinion and thinking get their way.

Britain is dying and ceasing to exist. May as well watch them kill it off as they want to.

COYP

What failure is that?

We won the Referendum and no one has screwed up this process except Remainers.

[Link]

Anyone can prep-end a sentence with "The truth about...." and claim anything. Politicians in particular seem to do this a lot.

Personally I'm against what the US call "rent seekers" i.e. people that make money whilst providing no value especially in financial markets, it needs to stop. I would like to regulation that prevents this and you will find many if not most right wing people will agree with you on that. The mainstream media also fall into that category as they have given up on journalism and decided to specialize in political punditry. All this is doing is adding to the polarization coming from social media.

That doesn't take away from the fact that leaving the EU allows us to make our own laws, vote for our leaders (and vote them out) and take control of our own resources and borders. At the moment if we fish out an immigrant from the channel they belong to the UK, if we fish out a cod it generally belongs to the EU.

Edited by W12 (12 Sep 2019 1.14pm)

I have to agree here, but in slightly less aggressive terms

There's no way you can make the claim that leaving the EU would provide no benefits. It's simply untrue, and impossible to verify.

Less benefits and more problems in the short term than remaining? Check.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

The primary benefit is simply not being in the EU. Period. It is a failing organisation. The Euro is an absolute disaster that has bought more misery and destitution to the Continent than anything else ever inflicted on it during peacetime. Huge debts, massive unemployment (especially amongst the young) and generally an organisation that offers the last refuge for a political class increasingly out of touch with the realities of the modern world especially in light of increasing globalisation.

Oddly enough I think that a truly federal EU might actually offer something. That there is a case to be made for it but I want it out in the open. In plain sight.

As it is though, all it is at the moment is this soft-focus virtue signalling comfort blanket for soc.libs. I know that clip from QT where the Remainer asks where the people in Pret who make her coffee will come from is a little overdone now but ultimately that is what concerns Remainers. They like having their gardens tended to by Romanians, whilst Poles make their coffee and Albanians, who they are more than happy to turn a blind eye to even being in the country, wash their cars. Makes them feel special. Far more grateful than their own fellow countrymen who are unpleasant and crass.

Our class struggle, writ large with a 21st century spin. That is Brexit now. And always was.

Edited by Matov (12 Sep 2019 1.23pm)

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

2. Which is why I asked. Or it’s a status quo of the same groups that benefit and get rich from EU membership and EU migration.

1. I’m well aware of markets and shorting. They’d make just as much or potentially more if the whole thing was called off. The uncertainty also provides volatility and short term opportunity.

There is also the history of buy or sell the rumour and do the opposite on the fact. If ever you needed evidence of this then go to leading up to the Iraq invasion and the invasion itself.

I’ve run the risk of contradicting myself on market action there but that’s the nature of market behaviour. Different timeframes and therefore opinions, which is where we are on here on Brexit.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (12 Sep 2019 1.30pm)

COYP

Excellent post as usual. A lot of remainers are also about self interest or selfishness. The talk of ‘think about the disconnect’ lasted about a month. It then became ‘I’m European, not British’ and ‘You’ve ruined my future.’

That’s human nature and I wouldn’t expect anything else no matter how virtuous they believe they are.

Get a Lib Dem leader to invite millions of high quality Mediterranean graduates in as Tony Bliar did with 2004+ cheap labour and then see how much their future is protected or ruined.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (12 Sep 2019 1.35pm)

COYP

I say this hand on heart that it’s a shame there has been no control of immigration from the EU or any member states when all EU migrants I’ve met have been good to meet.

But that isn’t the full story.

COYP

Depends what you value in terms of being informed about. I am sure the 'experts' who assured us that 500,000 of us would lose our jobs in the event of just voting 'Leave' or the recession our economy would sink into if we had the audacity to ignore what the likes of Goldman Sachs were telling us would define themselves as 'well informed' and yet were proved glaringly wrong.

Brexit is about emotions. About how we define ourselves. And why Remainers have acted in the way they have. Because Brexit makes them 'lesser'. I confess, I never got it before. For me, the notion of being a 'European Citizen' always felt so ludicrous that I dismissed it as pure froth. Nothing other than some ludicrous political piece of theatre that meant nothing to me on an emotional level. Never really gave a s*** about the colour of my passport and always saw it as nothing more than a document I needed to travel abroad. A tool really.

But for Remainers, it is all about that concept. They truly see themselves as European. Us Leavers need to accept that. Try to understand their illogical, at least to us, behaviour. Their reaction has actually been a form of mourning. Grief even.

Edited by Matov (12 Sep 2019 1.40pm)

Edited by Matov (12 Sep 2019 1.44pm)

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.