This quote from Macron shows where he thinks the future of the EU is heading; (my bold)

"European unity and firmness have paid off. The agreement with the United Kingdom is essential to protect our citizens, our fishermen, our producers.

We will make sure this is the case. Europe is moving forward and can look to the future, united, sovereign and strong."

OK, then what sites do you get your ideas from for they seem to accurately match those found on several?

What real benefit accrues from "taking back control" of the kind of areas of law we delegated the detail of to the EU? All it does is encumber us with the laborious task of writing and administering things that we almost certainly would be doing anyway and will be continuing to do as we maintain the "level playing field".

The most important issues were always in our hands. Subsidiarity being the key.

This is, and always has been, a huge red herring which appeals only to emotion and not at all to reality.

Where the EU is headed seems to me much more likely to be a looser arrangement than a tighter one. A two speed Europe has been discussed, in which a small northern group move closer, whilst the others don't. I think we may well see a multi-speed EU emerge where the Euro is abandoned everywhere other than the core, with everyone retaining the benefits to be gained from working together in some areas. I remain convinced that we would have been better off staying as a member and helping steer changes to our benefit. However, we didn't so now we will have to rejoin at a level which suits us on the best terms we can manage.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Why wait, hop over to Ireland and be a citizen of the world.

It never ceases to amaze me how many fifth columnists love to suckle at a teat they so clearly dislike....then again, that's what fifth columnists do I suppose.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

One of the oddities about it is that it could have been a an Anglo-French project. The actual distant roots of the current EU go back to the first world war when the convoy system was first introduced and there was talk of serious co-operation between the two countries militarily that continues to this day on a surprising level (for example at the moment the British are providing logistical support for French operations in Mali) that people are not made that aware of and I believe the new generation of French aircraft carriers will have the capacity to operate British F35's. One of the issues around our departure from the EU is that it does weaken its military capacity significantly given that it is only France that comes close to matching our spending and global operational capacity. On that level at least the UK and France did dominate the EU far more than Germany.

There was also talk in 1940 of actually combining France and the UK into a single national entity by way of allowing France to continue as a sovereign nation in WW2. Nothing much came of it but the idea was given a level of serious discussion.

Strange how history might have taken different turns.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

Following Palace since 25 Feb 1978

About time, new EU workers can no longer claim benefits for 5 years.

[Link]

I have posted before that it costs the taxpayer a fortune to subsidize a minimum wage worker who may pay 3k in taxes but claim ten times that much. If they have kids over hear that does not include the cost of education and healthcare.

If the greedy employers are so desperate for EU workers then they will have to offer them a better pay deal to make it attractive to come here.

Now we need to ensure that these jobs are taken up by the unemployed.

One more point

I already posted in reply to Bluejay a couple of pages back. It’s time for change, but not to the detriment of the British people or British investors.

[quote=Wisbech Eagle;3588240

There is absolutely no desire to dominate anyone. You probably won't believe it though.

History would tend to disagree with you. Throw in geography and language and you have a nation that appears more prone than most to have a desire to interfere in the affairs of others even if only because it harbours deep insecurity (let's not forget that it has only existed as one country since 1871 and was divided into two for forty years of that period) France to its West, Russia to its East and with its access to the oceans always done so purely with the blessing, or not, of the UK

Throw in a history of economic colonisation out to the east (modern-day Germany has a huge chunk of what it might be able to claim a legitimate ownership of to the East) and you have a nation that always needs keeping a wary eye on. Both enjoying a huge positive in terms of some natural resources such as coal whilst being almost completely lacking in others such as oil and various ores, and you have a nation-state that has to secure a variety of commodities to ensure its well being.

The EU tempers Germanys worst instincts. But the Euro has completely thrown that balancing act and handed Berlin far to much power. Europe will rue that day eventually.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

This is the absolute crux of it. For example, the big building companies were desperate for us to remain in Europe as their profits, boosted by utilising cheap European labour have rocketed in the last 10-20 years.

Let’s get back to British workers getting paid decent money for a decent days work. Let’s have British sub contractors being able to win tenders because they are not up against crews from Eastern Europe pricing jobs at cost to kill British crews off.

The net result? The big companies don’t make obscene profits, the ground workers, carpenters, fixers, plasterers, bricklayers, plumbers, electricians and let’s not forget the labourers start to earn fair money, are able to contribute more in taxes, etc,etc. This is my business and it’s what I understand, but I’m sure it would apply to many other businesses that can see a positive out of being hamstrung by European tender rules.

'They don't like it up em'.

A sign that should be on every nightclub door for lesbian night.

Edited by Stirlingsays (30 Dec 2020 11.39am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)