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Originally posted by Mstrobez
The thing is I've seen your previous posts and you're not stupid so surely you don't really believe that's the reason do you? She doesn't want to debate because she doesn't have the nerve or skill set, simple as that. If the outcome of the election hinged on pantomimes like this, I think you'd have a point. But it doesn't and it won't. And this wasn't even a debate - just a bunch of people shouting at each other with a partisan crowd thrown in. I think she's come out of it pretty well, and without firing a shot. Anyone making their mind up about who to vote for based on a shouting match needs help. Edited by Cucking Funt (31 May 2017 9.25pm)
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
She won't participate in any televised debate. She cannot campaign to the electorate without carefully choosing who will challenge her and the scale of the challenge. She hasn't had to face a flicker of scrutiny since calling this election on. Forget what side you're on, this is clear. I have some sympathy with May regarding Brexit. No one knows what it is going to look like and she can't be seen to be giving up anything even before negotiations have started. As far as the electorate go, it has been a very bizarre campaign, especially as she had quite a high personal rating. I don't know why she has chosen to hide away.
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Originally posted by Y Ddraig Goch
I have some sympathy with May regarding Brexit. No one knows what it is going to look like and she can't be seen to be giving up anything even before negotiations have started. As far as the electorate go, it has been a very bizarre campaign, especially as she had quite a high personal rating. I don't know why she has chosen to hide away. I was genuinely rooting for her (as much as I can root for a Tory) up until she called this election but this whole campaign seems to of exposed a lot of her weakness. She seems to be many of the things her and others label Corbyn and I personally think God help us if this is the one to lead the country and brexit negotiations. "No deal is better than a bad deal" is quite obviously a true statement - shouting that from the roof tops every 10 minutes is an extremely naive strategy in my opinion though. Edited by Mstrobez (31 May 2017 10.52pm)
We're the Arthur over ere! |
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Originally posted by Cucking Funt
If the outcome of the election hinged on pantomimes like this, I think you'd have a point. But it doesn't and it won't. And this wasn't even a debate - just a bunch of people shouting at each other with a partisan crowd thrown in. I think she's come out of it pretty well, and without firing a shot. Anyone making their mind up about who to vote for based on a shouting match needs help. Edited by Cucking Funt (31 May 2017 9.25pm) I agree to a certain extent but at the end of the day it all adds up and throughout this campaign she's appeared to be either completely disinterested or just simply out of her depth. One things for sure, this whole slogan of "strong and stable" is complete bulls***. Edited by Mstrobez (31 May 2017 10.51pm)
We're the Arthur over ere! |
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
I agree to a certain extent but at the end of the day it all adds up and throughout this campaign she's appeared to be either completely disinterested or just simply out of her depth. One things for sure, this whole slogan of "strong and stable" is complete bulls***. Edited by Mstrobez (31 May 2017 10.51pm) "Strong and stable" or "No deal is better than a bad deal" - terrible soundbite politics, but here's the reality: The alternative is Corbyn. That would be neither strong nor stable given sentiment in the PLP. Corbyn has indicated he would never walk away if the EU offered him a terrible deal. It actually doesn't matter how terrible May is. The choice is May or Corbyn. With Corbyn (by proxy) on any ballot paper, there can only ever be one choice for me. Not Corbyn. Every. Single. Day.
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| nickgusset |
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Originally posted by davenotamonkey
"Strong and stable" or "No deal is better than a bad deal" - terrible soundbite politics, but here's the reality: The alternative is Corbyn. That would be neither strong nor stable given sentiment in the PLP. Corbyn has indicated he would never walk away if the EU offered him a terrible deal. It actually doesn't matter how terrible May is. The choice is May or Corbyn. With Corbyn (by proxy) on any ballot paper, there can only ever be one choice for me. Not Corbyn. Every. Single. Day.
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| hedgehog50 |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
He's doing a lot better than you imagined though. You've got to concede that at least. Yes he certainly is. However, the Tories' campaign has been the worst by a party that I can remember. I think they should have made more use of Boris Johnson and David Davis. Boris was on TV this morning and came across well.
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
surely you don't really believe that's the reason do you? She doesn't want to debate because she doesn't have the nerve or skill set, simple as that. Not true as her weekly performances in Prime Ministers Question Time show where she regularly makes mince meat out of Corbyn Why should she join these bun fights as we are voting for a government and not a president so it doesn't really matter who represents the Conservatives as long as somebody does.
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Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
Not true as her weekly performances in Prime Ministers Question Time show where she regularly makes mince meat out of Corbyn Why should she join these bun fights as we are voting for a government and not a president so it doesn't really matter who represents the Conservatives as long as somebody does. So the public can see how she handles being properly pressed on issues she otherwise refuses to acknowledge. I've never seen her make mince meat of Corbyn on PMQs, just heard the media act as if she did.
We're the Arthur over ere! |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
Shame most of his MPs don't like what he says - if they did, perhaps we could take him more seriously. tho I'm not sure that's true. I think it's more of a case that they felt that he was seen by the general public as unelectable and most were pro-remain and thought he was not doing enough to hide his ambivalence with the EU. I understand that many Labour MPs like most of the policies, and certainly like the messaging around being against more cuts and proper funding for public services and ensuring access to the single market. All Labour MPs are behind the manifesto and respect how Labour policies are made (by the NEC and not simply by Corbyn).
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Originally posted by thechaddyboy
The Labour / Corbyn manifesto is a fantastic 'wish list' for many of the UK's working class & he's made more of an effort recently with regards to his public approach but, regardless of how much i dislike the Tories the thought of Corbyn in power gives me no confidence. He'd promise the EU anything just to secure a deal, the immigration issue would not improve & more than likely get worse, whilst the promises he's making in the manifesto may come into effect but at the expense of borrowing. £10 an hour minimum wage is fine but can small businesses afford to pay out 25% more & if you earn below £80k a year you get no tax increases for 5 years, pretty sure many are lucky if they earn £80k in 5 years nevermind in one. Have you been watching May recently? She's all over the gaff. I've tried to remain open minded as I'm not 100% convinced by labour as a whole and I personally feel they would have no choice but to water down a few policies if they were to get into power, but May has done nothing to convince me she will take this country forward at all. As the election goes on she just appears more and more of a car crash.
We're the Arthur over ere! |
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Originally posted by susmik
She has more sense than to stand amongst those other idiots that cannot debate and with the "hand" picked audience it makes it all one big joke. "The BBC insisted they had used polling company ComRes "to recruit an audience that is representative of the country demographically and politically". They claimed the audience was balanced between "age; gender; ethnicity; socio-economic; party politics; how they voted in EU referendum; and some undecided voters"." Perhaps the Corbyn supporters were just more vocal? Perhaps people find it risible (hence the laughter) that the Tories say they should be judged on their record on the economy. Perhaps members of the public do think that inequality is too high, public services dangerously underfunded, aren't happy with stagnant wages for most but huge gains for the super rich. But then again maybe it was all a plot by the BBC to enrage the right wing press and commentators. There is no evidence that the audience was picked in a biased way. It seems a lot more plausible that the anti-Tory faction in the audience just made more noise. In the last election 11m voted Tory and there are c.52m adults in the UK so 21% of a representative audience would be Tory voters. Not hard to envisage a representative audience being anti-Tory. Even with an increase in vote this time the percentage wouldn't be above 25%.
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
I was genuinely rooting for her (as much as I can root for a Tory) up until she called this election but this whole campaign seems to of exposed a lot of her weakness. She seems to be many of the things her and others label Corbyn and I personally think God help us if this is the one to lead the country and brexit negotiations. "No deal is better than a bad deal" is quite obviously a true statement - shouting that from the roof tops every 10 minutes is an extremely naive strategy in my opinion though. Edited by Mstrobez (31 May 2017 10.52pm) No deal is a bad deal More than that, there is no such thing as "no deal". Supply chains, travel, financial services, visas, transitional arrangements. We will need some sort of rules of engagement with Europe. You can't just cut the UK off and stop any movement of good, services and people. All of these things need some sort of "deal". Falling back on WTO trade deals would be madness. You'd see utter pandemonium up and down the UK in such a situation. People expect to be able to buy tomatoes from Spain in February and a huge list of other produce in addition. The tariffs on such items would make them prohibitively expensive. Add to that the fact that we'd not be able to export our produce to the EU without huge tariffs and the impact would be massively negative. We need someone committed to working with the EU to get a good deal for both sides not a bunch of posturing bullies.
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| nickgusset |
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3%! Down from a 24% lead in April. Remarkable.
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Reliant on getting the young vote out.
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
Have you been watching May recently? She's all over the gaff. I've tried to remain open minded as I'm not 100% convinced by labour as a whole and I personally feel they would have no choice but to water down a few policies if they were to get into power, but May has done nothing to convince me she will take this country forward at all. As the election goes on she just appears more and more of a car crash. Granted, Paxman had her flustered but then he rattled Corbyn too. Still wouldn't trust Corbyn to run the country, you seen the state of his front garden when the press are outside waiting for him ? If he can't manage to weed a small garden he'd trash our economy
Red & Blue since 73' |
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Originally posted by thechaddyboy
Granted, Paxman had her flustered but then he rattled Corbyn too. Still wouldn't trust Corbyn to run the country, you seen the state of his front garden when the press are outside waiting for him ? If he can't manage to weed a small garden he'd trash our economy I assume you'll be voting for Laurence Llewelyn-Bowen then?
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