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June 3 2024 2.14pm

Roy Hodgson

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 19 Dec 23 11.38am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

I find it extraordinary that a manager can avoid the holistic nature of the game and coach a side of 11 players in only one aspect of the totality of the game.
Our lowly position is no surprise, goals win games yet only Burnley and Sheffield United have scored less, unsurprisingly reflected in their league position, just as the teams above us have scored more goals and won more games.
Brighton, our next opponents, have score 33 thus far and have a goal difference of +3, we on the other hand have scored 17 and have a goal difference of -8. The difference in vision of how the game should be played is telling, they are 9 points ahead of us and also playing in Europe this season.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (19 Dec 2023 10.59am)

The empirical evidence is there if you want to find it. Success is more about not conceding than scoring.

The stats you cite reveal Brighton have conceded 30 goals and us only 25.

But for the injuries and teams improbably hitting form just as we play them (e.g. booed off after Bournemouth, but then look what the Cherries did next), we would have conceded a few less less, and possibly scored a few more. That would have us on course for safe mid-table.

 

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View Eaglecoops's Profile Eaglecoops Flag CR3 19 Dec 23 11.58am Send a Private Message to Eaglecoops Add Eaglecoops as a friend

Originally posted by monkey

Trouble is a lot of posters don’t get that with our finances or lack of them and the squad we’ve got or lack of, especially with injuries, new school football could get us relegated

That’s where I wholly disagree. We could easily get relegated this season given our dire performances against very mediocre teams. Roy gets paralysed with fear when it comes to picking younger players. He has history of it so it cannot be disputed that he only trusts old pros to implement his defensive strategy. There is more than one way to utilise a squad however and that doesn’t mean relegation is a certainty because of it.

 

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View southnorwoodhill's Profile southnorwoodhill Flag 19 Dec 23 12.27pm Send a Private Message to southnorwoodhill Add southnorwoodhill as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

The empirical evidence is there if you want to find it. Success is more about not conceding than scoring.

The stats you cite reveal Brighton have conceded 30 goals and us only 25.

But for the injuries and teams improbably hitting form just as we play them (e.g. booed off after Bournemouth, but then look what the Cherries did next), we would have conceded a few less less, and possibly scored a few more. That would have us on course for safe mid-table.

Sure, but as I mentioned, they have a goal difference of +3 while ours is -8. And to reiterate, they are 9 points ahead of us whilst also playing in Europe. What I can conclude from this is that scoring is actually important to one's overall position.
Which returns me to the point I was making: how can a manager who doesn't coach forward play have any say in how to win a game or even which forwards to use? What's his criteria? How can a manager focus on one aspect of the game and ignore the rest? It's ridiculous. How does Hodgson remain in the post?

Edited by southnorwoodhill (19 Dec 2023 12.30pm)

 

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View Putitout's Profile Putitout Flag Oxford 19 Dec 23 12.33pm Send a Private Message to Putitout Add Putitout as a friend

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

That’s where I wholly disagree. We could easily get relegated this season given our dire performances against very mediocre teams. Roy gets paralysed with fear when it comes to picking younger players. He has history of it so it cannot be disputed that he only trusts old pros to implement his defensive strategy. There is more than one way to utilise a squad however and that doesn’t mean relegation is a certainty because of it.

For every Brighton, there are any number of clubs that tried to please people with your attitude, and have failed miserably . All three clubs relegated just last year could play, an tried to play with a bit of flare, they are in the Championship because they wouldn’t play to win in any other way. This season Burnley come up full of promise , and they do try, to play with flare .adapt or perish though . Even Forest at the moment, at home they go for it doesn’t happen though does it. .Every season has at least one club goes down like this ,Norwich , come to mind twice since we entered the league, both times trying to impress fans with your ideas of how little clubs should play even though they don’t have the means. The problem being , they tried to be entertaining many times to often, for clubs like those I mention and us that’s not how you stay in this league as long as we have.
We are only in this league because of never getting above our capabilities, this season so far our squad has never been able to do otherwise. Because our injuries have highlighted how close to not adequate it is. And Hodgson has had to deal with this more so than any other manager in the whole period., Go to the Championship and in no time the gates half. Why ? It’s football but not as entertaining.. My feeling is so many modern fans are more for the entertainment ,than the real game. Players know it their all frigging actors now..

 

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View Croydon-Trucker's Profile Croydon-Trucker Flag 19 Dec 23 12.36pm Send a Private Message to Croydon-Trucker Add Croydon-Trucker as a friend

Originally posted by Jacey

Surely,we have more ambition than appointing Cooper ??

Edited by Jacey (19 Dec 2023 11.39am)

One would imagine so , but i think Steve seems to have a hardon for him for some reason , he was interviewed for the job before and rumour has it he turned it down .

 

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View Eaglecoops's Profile Eaglecoops Flag CR3 19 Dec 23 2.09pm Send a Private Message to Eaglecoops Add Eaglecoops as a friend

Originally posted by Putitout

For every Brighton, there are any number of clubs that tried to please people with your attitude, and have failed miserably . All three clubs relegated just last year could play, an tried to play with a bit of flare, they are in the Championship because they wouldn’t play to win in any other way. This season Burnley come up full of promise , and they do try, to play with flare .adapt or perish though . Even Forest at the moment, at home they go for it doesn’t happen though does it. .Every season has at least one club goes down like this ,Norwich , come to mind twice since we entered the league, both times trying to impress fans with your ideas of how little clubs should play even though they don’t have the means. The problem being , they tried to be entertaining many times to often, for clubs like those I mention and us that’s not how you stay in this league as long as we have.
We are only in this league because of never getting above our capabilities, this season so far our squad has never been able to do otherwise. Because our injuries have highlighted how close to not adequate it is. And Hodgson has had to deal with this more so than any other manager in the whole period., Go to the Championship and in no time the gates half. Why ? It’s football but not as entertaining.. My feeling is so many modern fans are more for the entertainment ,than the real game. Players know it their all frigging actors now..

Jeez, what the hell do you mean by my attitude? Firstly you have got completely the wrong end of the stick and secondly you are so into your own mindset that you are as intransigent as Roy when it comes to looking at tools at your disposal.

I’m not asking for a change in the way we play, I’m saying trust the players who are our future to play more than 10 minutes per game. I’m saying stop picking your favourites when they are clearly incapable of playing the modern game and I’m saying take the occasional risk with players who are natural in their positions rather than trying to wedge square pegs into round holes. None of that is asking for a different way to play.

 

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View Car54's Profile Car54 Flag Lower Upington 19 Dec 23 2.15pm Send a Private Message to Car54 Add Car54 as a friend

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

Sure, but as I mentioned, they have a goal difference of +3 while ours is -8. And to reiterate, they are 9 points ahead of us whilst also playing in Europe. What I can conclude from this is that scoring is actually important to one's overall position.
Which returns me to the point I was making: how can a manager who doesn't coach forward play have any say in how to win a game or even which forwards to use? What's his criteria? How can a manager focus on one aspect of the game and ignore the rest? It's ridiculous. How does Hodgson remain in the post?

Edited by southnorwoodhill (19 Dec 2023 12.30pm)

You really must be the grumpiest poster, completely ignoring our three american backers who do not want too, or haven't got the relevant financial capabilities, try looking a the overall situation and not just the league table, Jesus Christ

 


There will always be rocks in the road ahead of us. They will be stumbling blocks or stepping stones; it all depends on how you use them.

Friedrich Nietzsche

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View southnorwoodhill's Profile southnorwoodhill Flag 19 Dec 23 2.35pm Send a Private Message to southnorwoodhill Add southnorwoodhill as a friend

I've just gone through the list of games played thus far and tallied up our attempts on target according to the BBC match stats and it appears we are averaging 4 a game. This total is enhanced by good showings against Sheffield United, Wolves, and Luton. Two games we won and one we somehow contrived to lose.
My initial conclusion is that we don't get the ball forward enough when the opportunity arises because the focus is on defence and despite the bemoaning of Edouard and Mateta they don't have much to work with. Ayew's role seems less focussed on forward play than covering for defence.
Again, I have to ask what Hodgson expects from his attack when there is no coaching in that area? For example Pulis had an average side but made sure that we were strong on the set-piece.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (19 Dec 2023 2.38pm)

 

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View Putitout's Profile Putitout Flag Oxford 19 Dec 23 2.38pm Send a Private Message to Putitout Add Putitout as a friend

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Jeez, what the hell do you mean by my attitude? Firstly you have got completely the wrong end of the stick and secondly you are so into your own mindset that you are as intransigent as Roy when it comes to looking at tools at your disposal.

I’m not asking for a change in the way we play, I’m saying trust the players who are our future to play more than 10 minutes per game. I’m saying stop picking your favourites when they are clearly incapable of playing the modern game and I’m saying take the occasional risk with players who are natural in their positions rather than trying to wedge square pegs into round holes. None of that is asking for a different way to play.

Yes it is otherwise you would be satisfied that we play as well as is possible under our present circumstances. You want a change of personal, what for to play the same way?
No point , more kids would not have beaten Man Unt, or City playing tight as we did. Or even a smart Everton, hoping we would try to get at them, how did that work out? Or even a very smart Bournemouth bang in form.
Roy has not yet let us get relegated.must be because he doesn’t look at his tools. Really.. There is no clear evidence more use of young players ,would help the team greatly ,and none it wouldn’t cause problems in the young players future development
You’re guessing when you question him using or or not using any players young or old.
He is not guessing, he works with them every frigging day, and if he doesn’t know a frigging sight more about these fellas inside and out than either you or me or 27,000 Palace fans then he really has led a wasted life.


Edited by Putitout (19 Dec 2023 2.41pm)

 

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View Eaglecoops's Profile Eaglecoops Flag CR3 19 Dec 23 2.42pm Send a Private Message to Eaglecoops Add Eaglecoops as a friend

Originally posted by Car54

You really must be the grumpiest poster, completely ignoring our three american backers who do not want too, or haven't got the relevant financial capabilities, try looking a the overall situation and not just the league table, Jesus Christ

The post concerns the manager and not the spendthrift owners. We all know what we have and haven’t got in terms of players but how you utilise what you have is solely down to the manager.

 

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View Eaglecoops's Profile Eaglecoops Flag CR3 19 Dec 23 2.44pm Send a Private Message to Eaglecoops Add Eaglecoops as a friend

Originally posted by Putitout

Yes it is otherwise you would be satisfied that we play as well as is possible under our present circumstances. You want a change of personal, what for to play the same way?
No point , more kids would not have beaten Man Unt, or City playing tight as we did. Or even a smart Everton, hoping we would try to get at them, how did that work out? Or even a very smart Bournemouth bang in form.
Roy has not yet let us get relegated.must be because he doesn’t look at his tools. Really.. There is no clear evidence more use of young players ,would help the team greatly ,and none it wouldn’t cause problems in the young players future development
You’re guessing when you question him using or or not using any players young or old.
He is not guessing, he works with them every frigging day, and if he doesn’t know a frigging sight more about these fellas inside and out than either you or me or 27,000 Palace fans then he really has led a wasted life.


Edited by Putitout (19 Dec 2023 2.41pm)

You are like an apologetic broken record. Just because you bang on about the same thing time and time again doesn’t make you right.

 

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View Putitout's Profile Putitout Flag Oxford 19 Dec 23 2.57pm Send a Private Message to Putitout Add Putitout as a friend

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

You are like an apologetic broken record. Just because you bang on about the same thing time and time again doesn’t make you right.

Fair enough, .

 

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