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The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
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 susmik  PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 02 Dec 16 11.54am |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
So you're saying the police and government had been ignoring hate crime or wrongly classifying hate crimes? Sounds worse to me than an actual spike. No not at all but a lot of crimes have not been logged by the police as well you know. Excuse being they are too busy for all of them and to be honest cannot be arsed as well you know again.
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Dec 16 11.54am |
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Originally posted by Sedlescombe
The other reason there wont be a snap election is because the Government would have to repeal the fixed term Parliament Act through the Commons and the Lords. Or table a vote of no confidence in itself
Which I suspect may be the outcome of the Article 50 parliament act.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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 Hrolf The Ganger 02 Dec 16 12.01pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
"The Lib Dems overturned an enormous Conservative majority to beat the former mayoral candidate in a by-election defined by Brexit" I thought you guys believed the voice of the people was legitimate and should be taken note of? Edited by legaleagle (02 Dec 2016 7.51am) You guys are hilarious. So a constituency that voted 70% remain, something totally out of line with the country, votes a Remainer into power with the main opposition quitting his party and becoming an independent and you think this means that the country want a second referendum? You couldn't make it up.
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.| Sedlescombe Sedlescombe 02 Dec 16 12.02pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Which I suspect may be the outcome of the Article 50 parliament act. Leaving aside the rights and wrongs of whether there should be an election - calling an election for party advantage seems precisely why it is right to have fixed terms parliaments but there are two routes to an election. First is two thirds of MPs to vote for an election - which would mean Labour would have to support the motion OR the Government lose a confidence motion. In effect government would have to table a vote of no confidence in itself. That would be a huge risk for May to take
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| Hoof Hearted 02 Dec 16 12.06pm | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
Richmond is a hot-bed of Leftist activity. Moscow-on-Thames. The people have spoken. I see what you did there Michael.... The conclusions that you and Tim Farron are grasping vainly to are not that straightforward sadly.... Here are the results from Richmond Park by election last night and comparison with May 2015 (and EU Referendum) on Wiki: 1. The Tories and UKIP didn't even field a candidate. Last night's result was very predictable and comes as no surprise to me or any other Brexiteer. Mother Theresa will still press on next March and invoke article 50.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 02 Dec 16 12.10pm |
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Originally posted by npn
Interesting result in the by-election last night. I have a couple of remain friends who have joined the Lib Dems as they consider themselves to now be "single policy voters" and the Lib Dems are the only ones offering to reverse the brexit plan. If they can effectively mobilise the 48% to do similar, it could be a very interesting next general election. Interesting times indeed If you like fairy tales. The Liberals often do well in By elections and this constituency has a particularly strong remain support.
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| Sedlescombe Sedlescombe 02 Dec 16 12.13pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
I see what you did there Michael.... The conclusions that you and Tim Farron are grasping vainly to are not that straightforward sadly.... Here are the results from Richmond Park by election last night and comparison with May 2015 (and EU Referendum) on Wiki: 1. The Tories and UKIP didn't even field a candidate. Last night's result was very predictable and comes as no surprise to me or any other Brexiteer. Mother Theresa will still press on next March and invoke article 50.
I think the most important things to come out of the by-election is first that the Lib Dems are back in business and for the purposes of this discussion the claim that around a third of Tories switching to the Lib Dems voted Leave - but who are concerned about the move towards Hard Brexit. Is it a coincidence that Davis was already hinting at remaining in the single market? Interesting times
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| susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 02 Dec 16 12.19pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
I see what you did there Michael.... The conclusions that you and Tim Farron are grasping vainly to are not that straightforward sadly.... Here are the results from Richmond Park by election last night and comparison with May 2015 (and EU Referendum) on Wiki: 1. The Tories and UKIP didn't even field a candidate. Last night's result was very predictable and comes as no surprise to me or any other Brexiteer. Mother Theresa will still press on next March and invoke article 50. WHO is Tim Farron ???? I heard that name mentioned years ago when Paddy pants down was in charge and now it crops up again.. insignificant little man and squeaks when he talks. Paddy pants down was giving his usual clap chat this morning and was so embarrassing himself by saying the Lib dems were on the up and could take over as official opposition very soon he was cut short in his interview. Quite rightly so IMO.
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| Sedlescombe Sedlescombe 02 Dec 16 12.21pm |
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Originally posted by susmik
WHO is Tim Farron ???? I heard that name mentioned years ago when Paddy pants down was in charge and now it crops up again.. insignificant little man and squeaks when he talks. Paddy pants down was giving his usual clap chat this morning and was so embarrassing himself by saying the Lib dems were on the up and could take over as official opposition very soon he was cut short in his interview. Quite rightly so IMO. Right now I would say he is Leader of the Opposition
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| Hoof Hearted 02 Dec 16 12.31pm | |
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Originally posted by Sedlescombe
Right now I would say he is Leader of the Opposition Not quite.... I'd say it was Jimmy Krankie the noo. It definitely isn't Corbyn though.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Dec 16 12.38pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
If you like fairy tales. The Liberals often do well in By elections and this constituency has a particularly strong remain support. Oddly that's what everyone was saying about UKIP. What is interesting here is that a well established well known Conservative MP seat, with a staggering majority, was overturned by an unknown Lib Dem, who's party was still staggering after the beating they took at the last election. Goldsmith had even stepped down over a key local issue, that had a lot of popular support, and still lost a 23000 majority. Of course he wasn't 'standing as a Conservative' but as an Independent, but its still a stunning victory for the Lib Dems. Remain is a big thing, and the party that effectively manages to capitalise on the Remain vote, will massively benefit - Especially if its seen as more significant than anything else. The percentage majority in the referendum was very slim.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 02 Dec 16 12.40pm |
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Originally posted by Sedlescombe
Right now I would say he is Leader of the Opposition BEST laugh I have had all week LOL
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| OknotOK Cockfosters, London 02 Dec 16 12.41pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
I see what you did there Michael.... The conclusions that you and Tim Farron are grasping vainly to are not that straightforward sadly.... Here are the results from Richmond Park by election last night and comparison with May 2015 (and EU Referendum) on Wiki: 1. The Tories and UKIP didn't even field a candidate. Last night's result was very predictable and comes as no surprise to me or any other Brexiteer. Mother Theresa will still press on next March and invoke article 50. On 2: Zac Goldsmith massively increased his majority at the last election and was generally well regarded at the start of 2015. Across the political spectrum. To suggest he was a loser is a huge stretch. He struggled in London and when he and his team tried to appeal to the lowest denominator, he was quite rightly and robustly beaten. But he was also still expected to win the seat again. Even with his Brexit stance. So it is a big shock and it is a big deal. And the Tories and UKIP effectively *did* field a candidate - his name was Zac Goldsmith. Both parties actively campaigned for him. Having said that I agree that arguably Labour should be more worried. To poll 1,500 in a seat where you apparently have 1,600 members is pretty dire. Labour at risk of becoming irrelevant all over the country. The main narrative in Scotland remains independence - and Labour have managed to make themselves irrelevant on that point. And the main narrative in England is Brexit and by confusing and contradictory messages, Labour has managed to make themselves irrelevant on that as well. Plenty of people would agree with Corbyn politically, but he and his team as politicians have made and continue to make massive - and almost certainly terminal - mistakes in their campaigning and policy-making. Edited by OknotOK (02 Dec 2016 12.42pm)
"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show |
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| Hoof Hearted 02 Dec 16 12.43pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Oddly that's what everyone was saying about UKIP. What is interesting here is that a well established well known Conservative MP seat, with a staggering majority, was overturned by an unknown Lib Dem, who's party was still staggering after the beating they took at the last election. Goldsmith had even stepped down over a key local issue, that had a lot of popular support, and still lost a 23000 majority. Of course he wasn't 'standing as a Conservative' but as an Independent, but its still a stunning victory for the Lib Dems. Remain is a big thing, and the party that effectively manages to capitalise on the Remain vote, will massively benefit - Especially if its seen as more significant than anything else. The percentage majority in the referendum was very slim. Not in Richmond Park it wasn't... 72.3% voted for Remain.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Dec 16 12.48pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
>> Which benefitted Goldsmith more than the Lib dems. If Goldsmith had won, he'd have been back in the tory fold. 2. Zac Goldsmith was fcuked from the start.... He is openly a Brexiteer and 72.3% of Richmond Park voted for Remain in the EU Referendum. He is a loser anyway and fought a disastrous campaign for London Mayor then pulled this stunt which was political suicide. 3. The LibDems are opportunists - they effectively had a free hit last night pulled out all their "Big Guns"and even then only just about scraped home. 4. If I was a Labour supporter I'd be very worried only coming 3rd with a paltry 1515 votes... maybe at the next election they will be no better than 4th in the pecking order behind the Tories, UKIP and LibDems? 5. When a by election comes along in a northern town or rural area then the gloves will be off. The Tories and UKIP will see off the LibDems "revival" and once again Labour will struggle to avoid losing their deposit. Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Mother Theresa will still press on next March and invoke article 50. It'll be interesting, pressing on without any manifesto's on Brexit is a mistake, for the Conservatives party. They really don't have much of a mandate, and with 48% of the country or more still against the idea, its a tactical risk, especially when the short term consequences bite. Especially if Parliament votes down their proposals. The political party that champions Remain will benefit the most at the next election. The Conservatives have the higher ground so far, but that's reliant on Labour not sorting themselves out, and the Lib Dems remaining battered. Edited by jamiemartin721 (02 Dec 2016 12.51pm)
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Dec 16 12.50pm |
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Which could be a major concern when you move from the idea of a referendum to a constitutional system. I think its likely that a lot of Conservative remain voters would vote Lib Dem. I still think in most Labour heartlands, very few Labour votes will vote conservative, even if its a Exit strong area. Maybe UKIP, but that won't help the Tories as much as Lib Dems hovering up remaininers in the South East.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| Hoof Hearted 02 Dec 16 1.02pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Which could be a major concern when you move from the idea of a referendum to a constitutional system. I think its likely that a lot of Conservative remain voters would vote Lib Dem. I still think in most Labour heartlands, very few Labour votes will vote conservative, even if its a Exit strong area. Maybe UKIP, but that won't help the Tories as much as Lib Dems hovering up remaininers in the South East. You're reacting to a false dawn jamie. THe Libdems are like a drunken girl at a party trying to get off with anyone and everyone. Richmond Park was a Remainers stronghold and the LibDems exploited it, with the only serious contender to spoil their party was a Brexiteer who had just lost the Mayoral election. Come back to me with your theories when a decent straightforward by election has been contested.
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| steeleye20 Croydon 02 Dec 16 2.29pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
You're reacting to a false dawn jamie. THe Libdems are like a drunken girl at a party trying to get off with anyone and everyone. Richmond Park was a Remainers stronghold and the LibDems exploited it, with the only serious contender to spoil their party was a Brexiteer who had just lost the Mayoral election. Come back to me with your theories when a decent straightforward by election has been contested. So the Libdems are restoring inappropriate touching?
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| matt_himself Matataland 02 Dec 16 5.24pm |
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Originally posted by mezzer
So how I read it is that come the next General Election, all of the North and Wales will become a Tory stronghold because they want to leave, while the true blue dyed in the wool Tory South will turn to the Lib Dems and the Green Party because they want to remain. Corbyn may hold Islington. The really funny things is that Labour claims to have 1,600 members in the Richmond constituency. They polled less than that last night. Viva la revolution!
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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