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BBC (again)


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Stirlingsays Flag 10 May 22 12.35pm

Originally posted by silvertop

I'm with you on this one Hrolf. It was always an all the family drama, albeit with a mild undercurrent of progressive politics (the Daleks as the racially pure, master race etc.). Now it is just an exercise in inclusivity presented as drama. It is very bad indeed.

BTW, I am becoming a bore on this, but the BBC have to do this inclusivity thing as there is secondary legislation tied to the Equality Act that requires it. If you don't like it, stop moaning on message boards and write to your MP.

Yeah, that's gonna work.

Wouldn't not moaning about this on forums come across as manufactured consent?

Besides, we all know that all this is only the letting off of steam. Despite some thinking what's said on here as having dramatic consequences we are but a grain of opinion sand on a world's worth of beaches.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

CrazyBadger Flag Ware 10 May 22 12.51pm

The Problem with Dr Who has been the quality and ludicrousness of the storylines.. ever since Russell T Davies left.
I hated Tennants Dr (it was the way he Gurns whilst running!), but the Storylines were excellent. Conversely, Loved Matt Smiths Dr, but they had confusing, overly woke sensationalist crappy plots, each episode trying to usurp the last big doctor revelation.

Thats continued to this day with Capaldi and Whittaker. One can only hope that Davies' return brings with it a return to watchable TV.

 


"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"

ASCPFC Flag Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 10 May 22 1.13pm

Originally posted by CrazyBadger

The Problem with Dr Who has been the quality and ludicrousness of the storylines.. ever since Russell T Davies left.
I hated Tennants Dr (it was the way he Gurns whilst running!), but the Storylines were excellent. Conversely, Loved Matt Smiths Dr, but they had confusing, overly woke sensationalist crappy plots, each episode trying to usurp the last big doctor revelation.

Thats continued to this day with Capaldi and Whittaker. One can only hope that Davies' return brings with it a return to watchable TV.

One suspects not.

 


Red and Blue Army!

Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 10 May 22 1.23pm

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

Silvertop, are you able to provide any more specific details (which section of which Act, any accompanying guidance etc?).

I have become increasingly concerned about this. My place of work is proudly compelling me to discriminate, very much against my will. Specifically:

1. When I interview candidates, I must form a panel which is diverse in terms of race and gender. I am so dull as to only occupy one of each, so I had to ask a female colleague of Asian heritage to join me on the panel regardless of her personal suitability for the task, and also explain that if she can't make it, I need to find another non-white female because in the eyes of this insane woke legislation, you lot are all the same.

2. They are introducing targets (quotas) regarding the racial composition of the workplace, which they want me to factor in when deciding who to employ. I researched this, and found that generally speaking positive discrimination is illegal under (then EU, perhaps now just UK?) law, because any form of discrimination is illegal. However, there is a clause allowing a place of employment to introduce race as a criterion for employment if that organisation feels that a particular racial group is disadvantaged at that time.

I looked into this further. From what I could gather, firstly, race could only be used as a kind of tie-breaker (i.e two candidates had to be equally appointable before race could be used to separate them). Secondly, the employing company doesn't need to demonstrate to anyone that a particular race is, as a matter of fact, disadvantaged in order to introduce positive discrimination - they just have to believe it is so. Thirdly, even if an employer feels a racial group is disadvantaged there is no compulsion to use positive discrimination, it is a choice an employer can make.

It seems to me that far from positive discrimination being forced upon my employer by the regulations, it is my employer who has actively chosen this path.

TBTP:

I encountered similar problems:

1. When Interviewing candidates we had to have a diverse panel
2. When compiling a shortlist from applicants we needed at least one female applicant to be selected for interview.
3. We were subject to scrutiny if nobody with a disability or 'BAME' was interviewed or even employed within a set number of appointments.
5 We had a quota to meet for female employees appointed.
3. If you ticked a 'diversity' box on applications, you were immediately put through to interview without any meritocracy, or at least the very minimum being applied. This was literally a 'box' to be ticked by the applicant.

Often organisations will develop their own 'diversity' policies, usually to meet either legal or self imposed 'quotas'. Apologies as I am unable to provide any factual information for help but I actually work in a smaller team now and am unaware of how this might of changed. Just thought I'd let you know you're not alone but my strong suspicion would be that your company will be scrutinised by certain public bodies if they do not meet any 'diversity' targets and therefore have self imposed certain practices. At the very least, god forbid, somebody may stir up the weakest in society by 'leaking' on social media and cause uproar.

It is nice to see that rather then tackling any problems however the world is still committed to going to the other extreme as a counter-action.


 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

Badger11 Flag Beckenham 10 May 22 1.54pm

I often came across this corporate group think when I was working. This is a general comment not specific to diversity.

I would be told we had to do something a certain way because it was the law which was actually incorrect. What they meant to say was that our company in order to confirm to regulations had decided on a certain policy which of course is not the same thing.

 


One more point

PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 10 May 22 2.47pm

Originally posted by silvertop

the BBC have to do this inclusivity thing as there is secondary legislation tied to the Equality Act that requires it.

.


true, i do recall some presumably-straight white British men on one of their Crime documentaries. Locked up and banging on the door of their cell.

 


Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards georgenorman Flag 10 May 22 2.52pm

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

he is a Lefty climate change bore. Like a white Sadiq Khan.

try again.

a BBC white Straight ( non lefty) British man ? any takers ?

Edited by PalazioVecchio (09 May 2022 6.37pm)

Rab C. Nesbitt?

 

PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 10 May 22 4.07pm

Originally posted by georgenorman

Rab C. Nesbitt?

a straight white british man ? on the bbc ? is he a joke Right-winger ? a shoe-in to lampoon the ridiculousness of Tory voters.

alan partridge, alf Garnet , Rab Nesbitt ?

 


Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

Badger11 Flag Beckenham 11 May 22 7.39am

Originally posted by georgenorman

Rab C. Nesbitt?

Last on the BBC over 10 years ago.

 


One more point

silvertop Flag Portishead 11 May 22 11.03am

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

Silvertop, are you able to provide any more specific details (which section of which Act, any accompanying guidance etc?).

I have become increasingly concerned about this. My place of work is proudly compelling me to discriminate, very much against my will. Specifically:

1. When I interview candidates, I must form a panel which is diverse in terms of race and gender. I am so dull as to only occupy one of each, so I had to ask a female colleague of Asian heritage to join me on the panel regardless of her personal suitability for the task, and also explain that if she can't make it, I need to find another non-white female because in the eyes of this insane woke legislation, you lot are all the same.

2. They are introducing targets (quotas) regarding the racial composition of the workplace, which they want me to factor in when deciding who to employ. I researched this, and found that generally speaking positive discrimination is illegal under (then EU, perhaps now just UK?) law, because any form of discrimination is illegal. However, there is a clause allowing a place of employment to introduce race as a criterion for employment if that organisation feels that a particular racial group is disadvantaged at that time.

I looked into this further. From what I could gather, firstly, race could only be used as a kind of tie-breaker (i.e two candidates had to be equally appointable before race could be used to separate them). Secondly, the employing company doesn't need to demonstrate to anyone that a particular race is, as a matter of fact, disadvantaged in order to introduce positive discrimination - they just have to believe it is so. Thirdly, even if an employer feels a racial group is disadvantaged there is no compulsion to use positive discrimination, it is a choice an employer can make.

It seems to me that far from positive discrimination being forced upon my employer by the regulations, it is my employer who has actively chosen this path.

The Equality Act 2010 (Public Authorities and Consequential and Supplementary Amendments) Order 2011.

It widened the definition of "public authority" to include the BBC and Ch4 (both publicly owned).

From that enactment, the BBC was subject to the same legislative woke directive as your workplace.

I fully accept that it is in the interpretation where the issue may lie. Thus, even without the fear of losing Charter and the endless flow of complaints which will be determined by the complaints body in line with the Act, the BBC is staffed with sufficient media lovelies to still knock out largely woke crud.

However, we will also get humour that rubs against it and engage e.g., people who are funny rather than just diverse. And it will also permit documentaries that scrutinize and critique policies, supposedly made in the name of the Act that, in their true effect, actively discriminate against 87% of the population. That is, after all, one of the supposed purposes of the Fourth Estate which the BBC still proudly believes it is an important part of.

Thus, on your issue, I am no employment law expert. I would imagine (without looking it up) that the Act applies in full force to all public authorities and to any private body employing over a certain number of staff (50?).

But does the Act REQUIRE all those things you have highlighted? As in all things of this nature, whether it be health and safety or insurance conditions, certainly not. It it is all about risk aversion. The Act sets a minimum standard not some micro-managed dogma.

Nevertheless, employment lawyers and other HR experts have seen the Act, trawled through the case law interpreting it, and come up with a policy in place that is at the far end of the risk spectrum. They must create THE IMAGE of a "safe space" working environment with the thought only of avoiding expensive claims and reputational damage.

Thus, even if the staff are all males and a complainant woman gets turned down for a role, if they can demonstrate to the Tribunal that she is unsuitable AND can show a track record of preferentially interviewing women, they may have a successful defence. They are even more likely to win if they can show a high % of women properly employed and appearing on interview panels.

It is partly about compliance and partly about presentation via computer readable box-tick. It is the world in which we live.

 

Stirlingsays Flag 11 May 22 11.16am

Remember when the Tories were against this stuff.....and since taking over from New Labour they have done nothing to roll it back.

In fact the 'online safety' bill is coming with their blessing.

This party may call itself conservative but it doesn't represent its base.

All mainstream parties should reflect their bases, otherwise they are disfigurements of our supposed democracy.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 May 2022 11.16am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

W12 11 May 22 11.18am

There are plenty of straight white men on the BBC, trouble is they are generally poor role models, flawed, stupid, physically weak, cowardly, feminine stereotypes etc

 

TheBigToePunt Flag 11 May 22 11.46am

Originally posted by silvertop

The Equality Act 2010 (Public Authorities and Consequential and Supplementary Amendments) Order 2011.

It widened the definition of "public authority" to include the BBC and Ch4 (both publicly owned).

From that enactment, the BBC was subject to the same legislative woke directive as your workplace.

I fully accept that it is in the interpretation where the issue may lie. Thus, even without the fear of losing Charter and the endless flow of complaints which will be determined by the complaints body in line with the Act, the BBC is staffed with sufficient media lovelies to still knock out largely woke crud.

However, we will also get humour that rubs against it and engage e.g., people who are funny rather than just diverse. And it will also permit documentaries that scrutinize and critique policies, supposedly made in the name of the Act that, in their true effect, actively discriminate against 87% of the population. That is, after all, one of the supposed purposes of the Fourth Estate which the BBC still proudly believes it is an important part of.

Thus, on your issue, I am no employment law expert. I would imagine (without looking it up) that the Act applies in full force to all public authorities and to any private body employing over a certain number of staff (50?).

But does the Act REQUIRE all those things you have highlighted? As in all things of this nature, whether it be health and safety or insurance conditions, certainly not. It it is all about risk aversion. The Act sets a minimum standard not some micro-managed dogma.

Nevertheless, employment lawyers and other HR experts have seen the Act, trawled through the case law interpreting it, and come up with a policy in place that is at the far end of the risk spectrum. They must create THE IMAGE of a "safe space" working environment with the thought only of avoiding expensive claims and reputational damage.

Thus, even if the staff are all males and a complainant woman gets turned down for a role, if they can demonstrate to the Tribunal that she is unsuitable AND can show a track record of preferentially interviewing women, they may have a successful defence. They are even more likely to win if they can show a high % of women properly employed and appearing on interview panels.

It is partly about compliance and partly about presentation via computer readable box-tick. It is the world in which we live.

Thanks silvertop.

As per my last posts, my own research strongly suggested that it was an active choice on the part of my employer (a Local Council) to pursue race quota targets in employment, and not something the law compelled them to do.

My surprise was not that anyone would engage in such an enterprise, but (firstly) that it was legal, and (secondly) that in order to exercise the legal right to discriminate, an employer apparently only needs to believe/think/feel that a group or groups are disadvantaged. They don't seem to have to evidence it, or convince an independent adjudicator of their case. There is no obvious check and balance exercise required before an employer can exercise the right to discriminate.

 

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 11 May 22 12.10pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Remember when the Tories were against this stuff.....and since taking over from New Labour they have done nothing to roll it back.

In fact the 'online safety' bill is coming with their blessing.

This party may call itself conservative but it doesn't represent its base.

All mainstream parties should reflect their bases, otherwise they are disfigurements of our supposed democracy.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 May 2022 11.16am)

It is basically saying that we will force the population to accept mass immigration and the integration of immigrants into society, institutions and the work place, and criminalize or vilify any attempt to subvert it.

There is our democracy.

The elites control our lives, and useful idiots and ambitious fools help them do it.

 

Stirlingsays Flag 11 May 22 12.16pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

It is basically saying that we will force the population to accept mass immigration and the integration of immigrants into society, institutions and the work place, and criminalize or vilify any attempt to subvert it.

There is our democracy.

The elites control our lives, and useful idiots and ambitious fools help them do it.

Succinctly put.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

W12 11 May 22 1.33pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Remember when the Tories were against this stuff.....and since taking over from New Labour they have done nothing to roll it back.

In fact the 'online safety' bill is coming with their blessing.

This party may call itself conservative but it doesn't represent its base.

All mainstream parties should reflect their bases, otherwise they are disfigurements of our supposed democracy.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 May 2022 11.16am)

While we are on the subject of legislation here are a few gems that have either been proposed, passed or are in the works as it stands:

1. Covert Human Intelligence (Criminal Conduct) Act - these will legalise government agencies to commit crime with no limitations on what type of crime and is not restricted even to security services

2. Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill - effectively removing the right to protest

3. Online Safety bill - will criminalise "misinformation"

4. Counter State Threats Bill - will criminalise whistleblowers

5. Human Rights Act Reform Bill - will remove individual rights in favour of the "common good"

6. Living with COVID plan - some COVID laws made permanent

7. WHO pandemic treaty - will allow the WHO to set criteria and control of declaration of any new pandemic and centrally control he response to it in terms of mandates, laws etc

All the above include deliberately vague language that is entirely at the discretion of government agencies to interpret.

There is no democracy.

 

Stirlingsays Flag 11 May 22 1.42pm

Originally posted by W12

While we are on the subject of legislation here are a few gems that have either been proposed, passed or are in the works as it stands:

1. Covert Human Intelligence (Criminal Conduct) Act - these will legalise government agencies to commit crime with no limitations on what type of crime and is not restricted even to security services

2. Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill - effectively removing the right to protest

3. Online Safety bill - will criminalise "misinformation"

4. Counter State Threats Bill - will criminalise whistleblowers

5. Human Rights Act Reform Bill - will remove individual rights in favour of the "common good"

6. Living with COVID plan - some COVID laws made permanent

7. WHO pandemic treaty - will allow the WHO to set criteria and control of declaration of any new pandemic and centrally control he response to it in terms of mandates, laws etc

All the above include deliberately vague language that is entirely at the discretion of government agencies to interpret.

There is no democracy.

Fully agree.

Democracy is largely a myth....choice is deliberately narrowed to what the system wants there to be choice between.

The Brexit referendum for example was a situation where the public where given a vote on a topic that neither mainstream parties wanted to offer them and were all against......despite it being a highly popular issue amongst the public for decades.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 May 2022 1.43pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

BlueJay Flag UK 11 May 22 2.33pm

Originally posted by W12

While we are on the subject of legislation here are a few gems that have either been proposed, passed or are in the works as it stands:

1. Covert Human Intelligence (Criminal Conduct) Act - these will legalise government agencies to commit crime with no limitations on what type of crime and is not restricted even to security services

2. Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill - effectively removing the right to protest

3. Online Safety bill - will criminalise "misinformation"

4. Counter State Threats Bill - will criminalise whistleblowers

5. Human Rights Act Reform Bill - will remove individual rights in favour of the "common good"

6. Living with COVID plan - some COVID laws made permanent

7. WHO pandemic treaty - will allow the WHO to set criteria and control of declaration of any new pandemic and centrally control he response to it in terms of mandates, laws etc

All the above include deliberately vague language that is entirely at the discretion of government agencies to interpret.

There is no democracy.

I agree with you on much of this. Much of whatever 'culture war' is going is build around this really, as they pit left against right when bringing in restrictions to make one artificially sculpted clan think that they've got one other on their imagined opposites. The end game of course is just to strip away more and more rights from all people, so that they never bothersome to the power structures and those with 'actual' say and influence.

 

PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 11 May 22 3.45pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Democracy is largely a myth....choice is deliberately narrowed to what the system wants there to be choice between.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 May 2022 1.43pm)

99% of the irish public did not want WarPlanes using Shannon airport as a stop-over.

How many Brits supported Tony Bliar going into Iraq ?

democracy ? yeah, right.

[Link]

Edited by PalazioVecchio (11 May 2022 3.51pm)

 


Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

W12 11 May 22 4.42pm

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

99% of the irish public did not want WarPlanes using Shannon airport as a stop-over.

How many Brits supported Tony Bliar going into Iraq ?

democracy ? yeah, right.

[Link]

Edited by PalazioVecchio (11 May 2022 3.51pm)

I supported the Iraq war and voted for Blair in 1997 to my eternal shame. I was clearly wrong on both and can offer no excuse for that.

Edited by W12 (11 May 2022 4.42pm)

 

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