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Jeremy Corbyn
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nickgusset  Shizzlehurst 06 May 16 10.56pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
It's a common sense thing, nothing to do with generations! Foot, Kinnock, Miliband, were dismissed because they looked and acted like complete bozo's. The public has made it's mind up about Corbyn too.... and it aint good! The Labour Party are wasting their time supporting him as no matter how bad the Tories are, most people will not support Compo... err.. I meant...Corbyn. Seems a lot stuck with Labour in the south where the labour vote was expected to collapse.
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 matt_himself Matataland 07 May 16 6.17am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Seems a lot stuck with Labour in the south where the labour vote was expected to collapse. Not a surprise. London is left and always will have a large core Labour support. If I was a Socialist (horrific thought) I would be more bothered about Labour's collapse in support in its traditional heartlands of Wales and Scotland.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Mr_Gristle In the land of Whelk Eaters 07 May 16 8.16am |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
Not a surprise. London is left and always will have a large core Labour support. If I was a Socialist (horrific thought) I would be more bothered about Labour's collapse in support in its traditional heartlands of Wales and Scotland. I guess in Scotland people see the SNP as the real force for "socialism" and, given how right of centre recent labour governments have been, I don't blame them.
Well I think Simon's head is large; always involved in espionage. (Name that tune) |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 07 May 16 10.37am |
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Originally posted by Mr_Gristle
I guess in Scotland people see the SNP as the real force for "socialism" and, given how right of centre recent labour governments have been, I don't blame them. SNP got votes from those who want Scotland to leave the UK. The Tories appealed to the no voters in the referendum. Labour, through their own actions in the referendum have been left in the cold. According to some, the labour vote was going to disintegrate everywhere. It didn't. In fact it's noticeable that where they did well,the press said it was in spite of Corbyn, where they did badly, it was Corbyn's fault!
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| Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 07 May 16 10.47am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
According to some, the labour vote was going to disintegrate everywhere. It didn't. ! Overall, the elections appear to be the best possible result for us Conservatives. They are dire enough for Corbyn to represent no real progress, but not so bad to be likely to trigger a coup. May Corbyn continue until the 'General Election' !
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| matt_himself Matataland 07 May 16 10.51am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
SNP got votes from those who want Scotland to leave the UK. The Tories appealed to the no voters in the referendum. Labour, through their own actions in the referendum have been left in the cold. According to some, the labour vote was going to disintegrate everywhere. It didn't. In fact it's noticeable that where they did well,the press said it was in spite of Corbyn, where they did badly, it was Corbyn's fault! It's not as simple as that Gusset. There are people who vote SNP who want to stay in the union. The success of the SNP has been to mix so-called 'anti austerity' politics, although Nicola Sturgeon is ironically cutting public spending at the moment, with a 'standing up for Scotland' message. Labour has imploded in Scotland and there is a feeling that the Corbyn led agenda is a very London centric programme, of ideals and concepts that appeal to the pseudo intellectual members of the party and not its traditional support. This is why UKIP is taking votes off of Labour in its traditional heartlands in England and Wales.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 07 May 16 11.10am |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
It's not as simple as that Gusset. There are people who vote SNP who want to stay in the union. The success of the SNP has been to mix so-called 'anti austerity' politics, although Nicola Sturgeon is ironically cutting public spending at the moment, with a 'standing up for Scotland' message. Labour has imploded in Scotland and there is a feeling that the Corbyn led agenda is a very London centric programme, of ideals and concepts that appeal to the pseudo intellectual members of the party and not its traditional support. This is why UKIP is taking votes off of Labour in its traditional heartlands in England and Wales. There is a feeling that... Any concrete evidence. Edited by nickgusset (07 May 2016 11.13am)
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Attachment: | Hoof Hearted 07 May 16 11.23am | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
There is a feeling that... Any concrete evidence. Edited by nickgusset (07 May 2016 11.13am) Foot, Kinnock and Miliband all made substantial gains in local elections before taking on the Tories and losing at a General Election. Are you suggesting that Corbyn is doing a "rope-a-dope" by deliberately losing seats now in order to tire out the Tories in 2020?
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| matt_himself Matataland 07 May 16 2.21pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
There is a feeling that... Any concrete evidence. Edited by nickgusset (07 May 2016 11.13am) Ha ha ha! You really are deluded. How can Labour win an election without significant gains in Scotland? How can Labour win an election of their support is being eroded in Wales? This was not a good election for Labour. OI know they should have done better, given the Tory fiasco's recently.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 07 May 16 2.50pm |
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Yep labour did disastrously.
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| matt_himself Matataland 07 May 16 5.51pm |
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Originally posted by leifandersonshair
It's very odd in politics at the moment- voters flocking to the small parties, and the two main parties both having a damn good go at tearing themselves apart (Tories over Europe, Labour over Corbyn). The local election results sort of reflected this- Labour did okay, but not great. Gained some seats and councils they probably weren't expecting to but lost some as well (to Plaid Cymru for one). Similar for the Tories- didn't get as much of a kicking as the party in government normally does, but again, lost a few seats and councils they weren't expecting to, but lost some too. Next 12 months will be crucial for both parties in terms of the next GE. If Labour (the PLP) can actually get behind Corbyn and stop the infighting they should do okay. Tories prospects will depend on the EU Referendum- an In vote and the Brexit wing will be unhappy, out vote and Cameron is probably a goner. Either might be good- an Out vote, with Cameron replaced by someone a bit more palatable could be dynamite at the ballot box. Similarly, an In vote, if the Brexit campaigners then tow the party line once the vote is done and unite behind the leadership, again could do well. Basically? These local elections don't really tell us diddly squat about the next GE. Quite how you can say Labour did OK when they were forced into third place in Scotland and got a shoeing in Wales is bizarre. And contrary to your statement, this election tells us that at the next GE, Conservatives will win or there will be a hung Parliament. Labour will not be elected until it starts winning seats in Scotland.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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Y Ddraig Goch  In The Crowd 07 May 16 6.31pm |
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Tories are in disarray and Labour have been unable to capitalise. They should be embarrassed.
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| Bert the Head Epsom 07 May 16 10.47pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
At best Labour's performance across the whole of the UK was disappointing... at worst disastrous. Even Michael Foot managed to gain 1000+ seats in his first local elections. If Corbyn's team failed to make any gains, getting wiped out in the process in Scotland, and losing seats to UKIP in Wales, it is obvious he is not connecting with the voting public. SadIq Khan's victory was down to a very weak Tory candidate who adopted a disastrous campaign against Khan's Islamic faith AND Khan distanced himself from Corbyn and Livingstone, his best move. Labour vote share 31 Conservative 30. Without the Tory press being able to say a vote for Labour was a vote or a Scottish dictatorship of England Labour did ok. Anyway London 1 Racist 0 if we agree on that great. Look at Guido Fawks site and see how racist your fellow travelers are (though I don't mean you I mean a disturbing pocket of the right wing). Labour took Bristol as well and the Tory targets so I think you are being harsh. In Scotland Labour and the Tories are like two bald men fighting over a comb. All the parties are centre left apart from the Tories so of course they will get a few votes (at long last).
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 May 16 9.08am |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
One wonders whether this is the launch of a leadership contest: I don't think so...
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| Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 08 May 16 9.24am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
I don't think so... Since the mid 70s, the average 'Council Election' gain for the Opposition in a year without a General Election has been over 400 seats - Labour LOST seats in this week's election.Furthermore, when an Opposition has a new leader the average gains are over 500 seats.Even Michael Foot's first local elections as leader saw Labour gain nearly 1,000 seats.Contrast this with the Labour performance under Corbyn. Edited by Willo (08 May 2016 9.26am)
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| matt_himself Matataland 08 May 16 9.36am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
I don't think so... What has that graphic got to do with anything? Debate the case. Khan appears to be ambitious, he did not tow Corbyn/McLoony line during the Mayoral's and has openly criticised the current leadership. There appears to be no love lost between the two and an open call for Labour to once again become a 'big tent' does appear to be shots fired in a power battle. If you choose to ignore this and hide behind pointless and partisan graphics found on your leftie blogs, so be it. However it appears that the opposition to Corbyn/McLoony is not going to be from the 'embittered Blairites' of the party but the person with the largest elected mandate in the Party. That is a different dynamic.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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