Gaza Strip 'invades' Israel.
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  HKOwen  Hong Kong 01 Apr 24 9.26am |
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ah, did not see the link
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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Forest Hillbilly  in a hidey-hole 01 Apr 24 9.48am |
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Rather sweeping statements for your summary from a 'newbie' NJ CLOCTOWER And rather partisan expressions of why resolution has thus far failed. I am more concerned with the human tragedy that most countries seem to be allowing to unfold, except in the case of the USA, where they are actually assisting in genocide of the Palestinian people. These are non-combatant families who have had family members and friends killed, homes and livelihoods destroyed by military action, and now being subjected to a slow death, via exposure, starvation and deprivation of medical aid. The Western world offers words of platitude and long-term resolvent, but we know any help will be far too little and way too late. Edited by Forest Hillbilly (01 Apr 2024 9.52am)
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georgenorman  01 Apr 24 10.12am |
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Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly
Rather sweeping statements for your summary from a 'newbie' NJ CLOCTOWER And rather partisan expressions of why resolution has thus far failed. I am more concerned with the human tragedy that most countries seem to be allowing to unfold, except in the case of the USA, where they are actually assisting in genocide of the Palestinian people. These are non-combatant families who have had family members and friends killed, homes and livelihoods destroyed by military action, and now being subjected to a slow death, via exposure, starvation and deprivation of medical aid. The Western world offers words of platitude and long-term resolvent, but we know any help will be far too little and way too late. Edited by Forest Hillbilly (01 Apr 2024 9.52am) Hamas does nothing to support their own people and are the principal reason for aid problems. The more Palestinians that die, the happier Hamas are to use it for propaganda purposes that useful idiots swallow hook line and sinker.
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| Stirlingsays 01 Apr 24 10.14am |
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Originally posted by NJ CLOCKTOWER
This is what they teach children in Palestine do you really want these people to have their own country
Edited by NJ CLOCKTOWER (01 Apr 2024 9.07am) Of course I don't agree with the indoctrination of children's minds. I don't agree with it in many forms, including this country but it happens whether I like it or not. As for what goes on there....Sure, there are plenty of quite frankly horrible people both Jewish and Palestinian. However, that's the nature of a blood feud. However, I understand why it happens. I don't have to like it or agree with it.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 01 Apr 24 10.29am |
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Originally posted by NJ CLOCKTOWER
Peace deals Palestine rejected...!. 1. Peel Commission (1937): The Peel Commission recommended the partition of Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states. The Arab Higher Committee rejected the proposal as it granted only a limited portion of the land to the Arabs. 2. UN Partition Plan (1947): The United Nations General Assembly proposed the partition of Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states. The Arab states, including the Palestinian Arab leadership, rejected the plan as they believed it was unfair and violated their rights. 3. Camp David Summit (2000): The Camp David Summit, mediated by US President Bill Clinton, aimed to resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat rejected the proposal put forward by Israel, stating it did not meet their minimum requirements, such as the status of Jerusalem and the right of return for Palestinian refugees. 4. Taba Summit (2001): Following the failure of the Camp David Summit, negotiations continued at the Taba Summit in Egypt. Despite progress being made on issues like borders, Israel's then-Prime Minister Ehud Barak claimed the Palestinian side rejected the offer without counterproposals. 5. Annapolis Conference (2007): The Annapolis Conference aimed at reinvigorating Israeli-Palestinian peace negotiations. However, the Palestinian Authority under President Mahmoud Abbas rejected subsequent proposals by Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, claiming they did not fully meet their demands. Hamas has openly said it wants to eradicate Israel and all the Jews. this is common knowledge. anybody who supports these idiots are idiots... Just saying 🤦 🤷 Well I like the fact that you've dropped the diplomatic language at least. Look, the creation of Israel required a lot of terrorism and hundreds of thousands of people losing their homes/land and lives. A fist is always going to beget a fist. Do you support the Ukrainians fighting the Russians? Or should they come to a deal with the Russians and give them the land they want? Personally being a utilitarian I'd agree with you....If people were sensible both should come to terms. But that isn't how it works....Boundaries are kept via power and people sleep safe at night because certain men are willing to use violence....not always justly or fairly. From looking into the history Jews have always been in Palestine (though not European Jews for nearly 2000 years). If what the UN had offered back in 48 had been agreed with the Arabs then it was workable.....but that's not what happened. The whole thing was a huge failure in understanding human nature that continues to this day. When you look into it more deeply I think the Jewish terrorist elements take a lot of the blame for convincing the British to leave too early.....but then again you wouldn't have the Israel you have today would you....all won in blood with mostly 'American' funding and arms (and stolen technology). The two state solution was always an attempt to solve this from a liberal....mainly American Jewish perspective. To be honest in my view it was never that workable because one side will always feel aggrieved. The human tragedy will play out one way or the other proving once again that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Apr 2024 10.33am)
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| NJ CLOCKTOWER Tarragona 01 Apr 24 12.34pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Well I like the fact that you've dropped the diplomatic language at least. Look, the creation of Israel required a lot of terrorism and hundreds of thousands of people losing their homes/land and lives. A fist is always going to beget a fist. Do you support the Ukrainians fighting the Russians? Or should they come to a deal with the Russians and give them the land they want? Personally being a utilitarian I'd agree with you....If people were sensible both should come to terms. But that isn't how it works....Boundaries are kept via power and people sleep safe at night because certain men are willing to use violence....not always justly or fairly. From looking into the history Jews have always been in Palestine (though not European Jews for nearly 2000 years). If what the UN had offered back in 48 had been agreed with the Arabs then it was workable.....but that's not what happened. The whole thing was a huge failure in understanding human nature that continues to this day. When you look into it more deeply I think the Jewish terrorist elements take a lot of the blame for convincing the British to leave too early.....but then again you wouldn't have the Israel you have today would you....all won in blood with mostly 'American' funding and arms (and stolen technology). The two state solution was always an attempt to solve this from a liberal....mainly American Jewish perspective. To be honest in my view it was never that workable because one side will always feel aggrieved. The human tragedy will play out one way or the other proving once again that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Apr 2024 10.33am)
The establishment of Israel in 1948 was a result of complex historical, political, and religious factors. It involved the displacement of many Palestinians who lost their homes and land, and this continues to be a significant source of tension and conflict in the region. Regarding the situation in Ukraine and the conflict with Russia, it is a complex geopolitical issue with no easy solutions. As I said before I am biased against the Russians as a first generation Pole. Different people have different opinions on how the situation should be resolved. Some argue for the Ukrainians to fight against Russian aggression which is basically what we are seeing here, while others believe that negotiations and compromises are necessary to achieve peace. It is true that power dynamics and violence have often influenced the establishment and maintenance of borders throughout history. However, there are also instances where peaceful negotiations and diplomatic efforts have successfully resolved conflicts and led to fair agreements. .
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| NJ CLOCKTOWER Tarragona 01 Apr 24 12.36pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Well I like the fact that you've dropped the diplomatic language at least. Look, the creation of Israel required a lot of terrorism and hundreds of thousands of people losing their homes/land and lives. A fist is always going to beget a fist. Do you support the Ukrainians fighting the Russians? Or should they come to a deal with the Russians and give them the land they want? Personally being a utilitarian I'd agree with you....If people were sensible both should come to terms. But that isn't how it works....Boundaries are kept via power and people sleep safe at night because certain men are willing to use violence....not always justly or fairly. From looking into the history Jews have always been in Palestine (though not European Jews for nearly 2000 years). If what the UN had offered back in 48 had been agreed with the Arabs then it was workable.....but that's not what happened. The whole thing was a huge failure in understanding human nature that continues to this day. When you look into it more deeply I think the Jewish terrorist elements take a lot of the blame for convincing the British to leave too early.....but then again you wouldn't have the Israel you have today would you....all won in blood with mostly 'American' funding and arms (and stolen technology). The two state solution was always an attempt to solve this from a liberal....mainly American Jewish perspective. To be honest in my view it was never that workable because one side will always feel aggrieved. The human tragedy will play out one way or the other proving once again that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Apr 2024 10.33am) The population of Palestine has historically been diverse in terms of religious faiths, including Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. Jerusalem, in particular, is considered a holy city by all three of these major monotheistic religions. Over time, the demographics and dominance of each faith have varied due to historical events and migrations.
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| NJ CLOCKTOWER Tarragona 01 Apr 24 12.56pm |
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Hamas "living the life of Reilly" Cowardly, Hamas leaders have sought refuge in Qatar, where their leaders maintain offices and reside. Attending, the football world cup. Owning yachts, going to extravagant parties. Meanwhile their people are suffering. Qatar has played a role in hosting various Palestinian factions, including Hamas, in an effort to support a Palestinian unity government. Qatar's hosting of Hamas leaders draws my criticism and from some parties who argue that it provides them with a safe haven while Palestinians in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank face various challenges and conflicts, including political, social, and economic issues. Including, a war Hamas started. Which everyone seems to forget. Hamas is also backed by Iran. which means if you support them you don't like women gays or lgbtq community. Israel is the only free democracy in that region. It has legalized gay marriage it gives free education as far as I know to all its citizens including Arabs. Which is what Palestinians really are. Personally myself, I don't want another Islamic state. That's going backwards in my opinion. And let's not forget all the hostages who have to hear, from vape laughing captors who are no doubt winding them up about it on how the world has forgotten about them and how somehow a terrorist group has managed to manipulate the world into believing that they are the victims. Yes ,the bombing is horrific. what is happening in Palestine now is not human. However, how would you look like Israel to respond ?would you like them to respond proportionally for example? This means that they go into Palestine. They interrupt a party or a outside festival. They shoot people indiscriminately. They go to a town and knock down every door house by house shooting wives ,husbands, babies, children and then posting them back to their mothers. And finally for good measure take some hostages. Well! these are not the type of people that I want to run a country and anybody who does well that's your opinion.
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| Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 01 Apr 24 1.11pm |
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Hamas "living the life of Reilly" Cowardly, Hamas leaders have sought refuge in Qatar, where their leaders maintain offices and reside. Attending, the football world cup. Owning yachts, going to extravagant parties. Meanwhile their people are suffering. Sounds like most Governments across the globe ^^. Most recently the UK Government during Covid
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| Stirlingsays 01 Apr 24 1.23pm |
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Originally posted by NJ CLOCKTOWER
The population of Palestine has historically been diverse in terms of religious faiths, including Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. Jerusalem, in particular, is considered a holy city by all three of these major monotheistic religions. Over time, the demographics and dominance of each faith have varied due to historical events and migrations. Before the immigration allowed by the ruling British after WW1 the population of Palestine had been mostly Islamic for hundreds of years....a little case of the Ottoman empire don't you know. You seem to be presenting it as a picture of a 'little bit of this, a little bit of that'.....We looked into this, while that region has been ruled by many different rulers the population has been largely Islamic because of that long term affect. The fact that Jews and Christians have been there was never contested. Oh and this implication that I should support the Israeli administration rather than the Palestinians (I don't really support either of their leaders, just the good individuals) does kind of require a lack of historical knowledge on the matter. Incoming Jews to Palestine after didn't just build new homes and look to integrate did they....After world war 2 once they felt strong enough, they hung two British sergeants and bombed an hotel of British soldiers to get us to leave Palestine....after which they really got to work. By the way the leader of the terrorist group that killed those British soldiers later became Israeli PM in the 70s. Lovely stuff. Those British soldiers strangled and bombed to death deserve far more memory than we have given them. Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Apr 2024 1.59pm)
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| Stirlingsays 01 Apr 24 2.03pm |
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Originally posted by NJ CLOCKTOWER
It is true that power dynamics and violence have often influenced the establishment and maintenance of borders throughout history. However, there are also instances where peaceful negotiations and diplomatic efforts have successfully resolved conflicts and led to fair agreements. . On what religion holds control of what land? What are those examples? Northern Ireland was negotiated by a then secular British State and the religious aspect had long since died.....when it mattered there was zero chance. And on that matter I decline to say much of what I think of that particular 'agreement' (betrayal). Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Apr 2024 2.06pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| HKOwen Hong Kong 01 Apr 24 11.19pm |
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Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly
Hamas "living the life of Reilly" Cowardly, Hamas leaders have sought refuge in Qatar, where their leaders maintain offices and reside. Attending, the football world cup. Owning yachts, going to extravagant parties. Meanwhile their people are suffering. Sounds like most Governments across the globe ^^. Most recently the UK Government during Covid You are seriously equating Hamas with the UK Government?
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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