Plymouth shooting

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Plymouth shooting

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kennybrowns leftfoot Reigate 19 Aug 21 12.52am
Very very sad and tragic incident. Thoughts go out obviously to the families of the victims but also to anyone who witnessed the shootings and the Police Officers and Paramedics who were first on scene in the aftermath... As much as they are expected to deal mentally with tragedy it still takes its toll and seeing a 3 year old who has been shot is not a regular occurrence.. Very sad. RIP to the victims bless them Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

kennybrowns leftfoot

Reigate 19 Aug 21 12.52am

Very very sad and tragic incident. Thoughts go out obviously to the families of the victims but also to anyone who witnessed the shootings and the Police Officers and Paramedics who were first on scene in the aftermath...

As much as they are expected to deal mentally with tragedy it still takes its toll and seeing a 3 year old who has been shot is not a regular occurrence.. Very sad. RIP to the victims bless them

Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

PalazioVecchio south pole 19 Aug 21 2.48pm
Anders Breivik, who shot up dozens of kids at a Norway Socialist summer camp. He was an Incel, angry about multiculturalism growing in his country. ................ how many of our islamist terrorists have also been Incels ? Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

PalazioVecchio

south pole 19 Aug 21 2.48pm

Anders Breivik, who shot up dozens of kids at a Norway Socialist summer camp.

He was an Incel, angry about multiculturalism growing in his country.

................

how many of our islamist terrorists have also been Incels ?

Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 2.56pm
Originally posted by PalazioVecchio Anders Breivik, who shot up dozens of kids at a Norway Socialist summer camp. He was an Incel, angry about multiculturalism growing in his country. ................ how many of our islamist terrorists have also been Incels ? Probably most of them I’d wager.

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 2.56pm

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

Anders Breivik, who shot up dozens of kids at a Norway Socialist summer camp.

He was an Incel, angry about multiculturalism growing in his country.

................

how many of our islamist terrorists have also been Incels ?

Probably most of them I’d wager.

PalazioVecchio south pole 19 Aug 21 3.17pm
Originally posted by DanH Probably most of them I’d wager. if you look online, our islamic terrorists ? they seem to be either single Incels or got a young wife and a whole clatter of kids. not so many terrorists with a childless longterm girlfriend. Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

PalazioVecchio

south pole 19 Aug 21 3.17pm

Originally posted by DanH

Probably most of them I’d wager.

if you look online, our islamic terrorists ?

they seem to be either single Incels or got a young wife and a whole clatter of kids.

not so many terrorists with a childless longterm girlfriend.

Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 4.02pm
Originally posted by PalazioVecchio if you look online, our islamic terrorists ? they seem to be either single Incels or got a young wife and a whole clatter of kids. not so many terrorists with a childless longterm girlfriend. I think bizarrely we’re kind of on the same wavelength here, although as always your point is difficult to actually decipher. I think there’s probably a lot of things common that the Plymouth shooter had that the Manchester bomber had, religion aside. Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.03pm)

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 4.02pm

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

if you look online, our islamic terrorists ?

they seem to be either single Incels or got a young wife and a whole clatter of kids.

not so many terrorists with a childless longterm girlfriend.

I think bizarrely we’re kind of on the same wavelength here, although as always your point is difficult to actually decipher.

I think there’s probably a lot of things common that the Plymouth shooter had that the Manchester bomber had, religion aside.

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.03pm)

Stirlingsays 19 Aug 21 4.08pm
Originally posted by DanH I think bizarrely we’re kind of on the same wavelength here, although as always your point is difficult to actually decipher. I think there’s probably a lot of things common that the Plymouth shooter had that the Manchester bomber had, religion aside. Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.03pm) Some. Easier to recruit. Still, it's also true that members have been highly educated and quite successful. It's not an incel army....Religion finds all types. Every group has an intelligentsia......A high or higher IQ doesn't mean cultural or political agreement. Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.10pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

19 Aug 21 4.08pm

Originally posted by DanH

I think bizarrely we’re kind of on the same wavelength here, although as always your point is difficult to actually decipher.

I think there’s probably a lot of things common that the Plymouth shooter had that the Manchester bomber had, religion aside.

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.03pm)

Some.

Easier to recruit.

Still, it's also true that members have been highly educated and quite successful. It's not an incel army....Religion finds all types.

Every group has an intelligentsia......A high or higher IQ doesn't mean cultural or political agreement.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.10pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 4.12pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Some. Easier to recruit. Still, it's also true that members have been highly educated and quite successful. It's not an incel army....Religion finds all types. Every group has an intelligentsia......A high or higher IQ doesn't mean cultural or political agreement. Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.10pm) Yep completely agree. Genuine question as well as I know you put a lot to IQ; do you think IQ automatically means someone who should be in charge of making decisions? Or is EQ equally important? Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.12pm)

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 4.12pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Some.

Easier to recruit.

Still, it's also true that members have been highly educated and quite successful. It's not an incel army....Religion finds all types.

Every group has an intelligentsia......A high or higher IQ doesn't mean cultural or political agreement.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.10pm)

Yep completely agree. Genuine question as well as I know you put a lot to IQ; do you think IQ automatically means someone who should be in charge of making decisions? Or is EQ equally important?

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.12pm)

Stirlingsays 19 Aug 21 4.24pm
Originally posted by DanH Yep completely agree. Genuine question as well as I know you put a lot to IQ; do you think IQ automatically means someone who should be in charge of making decisions? Or is EQ equally important? Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.12pm) It's a very good question. I think the manner of the job matters....obvioiusly you don't want highly intelligent sociopaths. I'd say that If the decisions involve building a bridge or something technical like that, then as long as the law is followed then yes IQ matters more than EI. If the job involves people, then having social skills will matter more. Not that from my perspective that those skills means someone's a particular type. It's job dependent......At the very top end you'd hope that meritocracy meant that they had both. Still, when it comes down to it high IQ matters more.....too much empathy is cufflinks to shirt fronts, in other words decisions made purely on emotion are rarely good ones.....though a very high IQ is nearly always a life benefit in comparison to its alternative. Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.25pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

19 Aug 21 4.24pm

Originally posted by DanH

Yep completely agree. Genuine question as well as I know you put a lot to IQ; do you think IQ automatically means someone who should be in charge of making decisions? Or is EQ equally important?

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.12pm)

It's a very good question.

I think the manner of the job matters....obvioiusly you don't want highly intelligent sociopaths. I'd say that If the decisions involve building a bridge or something technical like that, then as long as the law is followed then yes IQ matters more than EI.

If the job involves people, then having social skills will matter more. Not that from my perspective that those skills means someone's a particular type.

It's job dependent......At the very top end you'd hope that meritocracy meant that they had both.

Still, when it comes down to it high IQ matters more.....too much empathy is cufflinks to shirt fronts, in other words decisions made purely on emotion are rarely good ones.....though a very high IQ is nearly always a life benefit in comparison to its alternative.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.25pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 4.45pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays It's a very good question. I think the manner of the job matters....obvioiusly you don't want highly intelligent sociopaths. I'd say that If the decisions involve building a bridge or something technical like that, then as long as the law is followed then yes IQ matters more than EI. If the job involves people, then having social skills will matter more. Not that from my perspective that those skills means someone's a particular type. It's job dependent......At the very top end you'd hope that meritocracy meant that they had both. Still, when it comes down to it high IQ matters more.....too much empathy is cufflinks to shirt fronts, in other words decisions made purely on emotion are rarely good ones.....though a very high IQ is nearly always a life benefit in comparison to its alternative. Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.25pm) I agree with you on about 90% of that I’d say. I think the only bit I differ to on that is what you call emotion I call empathy, which is a huge part of leadership. Also, unless something is fully automated or AI smart enough to do it then it involves humans to some extent so it will always be crucial. Until the robots are smarter than us anyway. Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.46pm)

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 4.45pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

It's a very good question.

If the job involves people, then having social skills will matter more. Not that from my perspective that those skills means someone's a particular type.

It's job dependent......At the very top end you'd hope that meritocracy meant that they had both.

Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Aug 2021 4.25pm)

I agree with you on about 90% of that I’d say. I think the only bit I differ to on that is what you call emotion I call empathy, which is a huge part of leadership. Also, unless something is fully automated or AI smart enough to do it then it involves humans to some extent so it will always be crucial.

Until the robots are smarter than us anyway.

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.46pm)

Stirlingsays 19 Aug 21 5.12pm
Originally posted by DanH I agree with you on about 90% of that I’d say. I think the only bit I differ to on that is what you call emotion I call empathy, which is a huge part of leadership. Also, unless something is fully automated or AI smart enough to do it then it involves humans to some extent so it will always be crucial. Until the robots are smarter than us anyway. Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.46pm) Probably not a long way off. Mark Zuckerberg being the first. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

19 Aug 21 5.12pm

Originally posted by DanH

Until the robots are smarter than us anyway.

Edited by DanH (19 Aug 2021 4.46pm)

Probably not a long way off.

Mark Zuckerberg being the first.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

becky over the moon 19 Aug 21 5.15pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Probably not a long way off. Mark Zuckerberg being the first. I think Elon Musk may have an edge...... A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

becky

over the moon 19 Aug 21 5.15pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Probably not a long way off.

Mark Zuckerberg being the first.

I think Elon Musk may have an edge......

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 5.35pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Probably not a long way off. Mark Zuckerberg being the first. You’d still claim you were smarter

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 5.35pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Probably not a long way off.

Mark Zuckerberg being the first.

You’d still claim you were smarter

Matov 19 Aug 21 5.35pm
This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls*. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right? He was a f* up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

Matov

19 Aug 21 5.35pm

This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls***. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right?

He was a f*** up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

DanH SW2 19 Aug 21 5.39pm
Originally posted by Matov This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls*. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right? He was a f* up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be. Yes completely the biggest issue. But the other issue is still a big issue.

DanH

SW2 19 Aug 21 5.39pm

Originally posted by Matov

This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls***. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right?

He was a f*** up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be.

Yes completely the biggest issue. But the other issue is still a big issue.

Matov 19 Aug 21 5.50pm
Originally posted by DanH Yes completely the biggest issue. But the other issue is still a big issue. But it's not. They are freaks. Weirdo's. There is no central organisation, there is no hierarchy, there is no majority agreed tenets of belief or ideology. They just have mother issues. Does that mean they should just be ignored? Then no. But I suspect the pathology is far more akin to Serial Killers than terrorists. These gimps have always existed. Only difference now is that can rant on message boards with each other. A manifestation of the modern world us lot are probably guilty than most in embracing whole heartedly, hence this conversation. You want him classified as a terrorist because he is white Dan. And that can then assuage the unease you feel about the predominance of non-white terrorists over the last few decades. Anders Brevik was a terrorist. He attacked people based on a political ideology. This moron was just a fruit-loop. But a fruit-loop with a gun. That's the issue. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

Matov

19 Aug 21 5.50pm

Originally posted by DanH

Yes completely the biggest issue. But the other issue is still a big issue.

But it's not. They are freaks. Weirdo's. There is no central organisation, there is no hierarchy, there is no majority agreed tenets of belief or ideology.

They just have mother issues.

Does that mean they should just be ignored? Then no. But I suspect the pathology is far more akin to Serial Killers than terrorists.

These gimps have always existed. Only difference now is that can rant on message boards with each other. A manifestation of the modern world us lot are probably guilty than most in embracing whole heartedly, hence this conversation.

You want him classified as a terrorist because he is white Dan. And that can then assuage the unease you feel about the predominance of non-white terrorists over the last few decades.

Anders Brevik was a terrorist. He attacked people based on a political ideology. This moron was just a fruit-loop. But a fruit-loop with a gun. That's the issue.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

BlueJay UK 19 Aug 21 6.21pm
Originally posted by Matov This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls*. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right? He was a f* up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be. Bang on. This effort we see to lump in all of sundry (those on the left who seek to blame 'INCELS' and the far right, and those on the right who seek to link it to 'feminists' and 'alphabet soup' types) fail to see that even the most ardent basement dwellers very rarely behave as this guy did. There's a bit of a difference between being a dropout, and loading a gun and killing a kid. Hopefully those desperate to endlessly politicise to their own advantage will instead for once just take these utterly tragic events at face value. Edited by BlueJay (19 Aug 2021 6.38pm)

BlueJay

UK 19 Aug 21 6.21pm

Originally posted by Matov

This bloke as an 'Incel' terrorist spiel is utter bulls***. He shot two men dead. And a little kid. These Incel freaks are meant to have problems with women right?

He was a f*** up who lost the plot. The REAL issue is how the hell he was allowed to get that shotgun back. That is where all the focus should be.

Bang on. This effort we see to lump in all of sundry (those on the left who seek to blame 'INCELS' and the far right, and those on the right who seek to link it to 'feminists' and 'alphabet soup' types) fail to see that even the most ardent basement dwellers very rarely behave as this guy did. There's a bit of a difference between being a dropout, and loading a gun and killing a kid. Hopefully those desperate to endlessly politicise to their own advantage will instead for once just take these utterly tragic events at face value.

Edited by BlueJay (19 Aug 2021 6.38pm)

PalazioVecchio south pole 19 Aug 21 9.22pm
Flags & ideologies aside for a second. Sociology & History shows that a society with an over-supply of men ( and an undersupply of women) is always ALWAYS ...A violent society Gun control is irrelevant. A nutter drove a lorry into 600 people on Boulevard des Anglais, Nice. Knives are easy to buy. What really matters is having a minimal number of angry nutters in our society. Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

PalazioVecchio

south pole 19 Aug 21 9.22pm

Flags & ideologies aside for a second.

Sociology & History shows that a society with an over-supply of men ( and an undersupply of women) is

always ALWAYS

...A violent society

Gun control is irrelevant. A nutter drove a lorry into 600 people on Boulevard des Anglais, Nice. Knives are easy to buy.

What really matters is having a minimal number of angry nutters in our society.

Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

Stirlingsays 19 Aug 21 9.27pm
Originally posted by PalazioVecchio Flags & ideologies aside for a second. Sociology & History shows that a society with an over-supply of men ( and an undersupply of women) is always ALWAYS ...A violent society Gun control is irrelevant. A nutter drove a lorry into 600 people on Boulevard des Anglais, Nice. Knives are easy to buy. What really matters is having a minimal number of angry nutters in our society. Accurate mate. But that's not how it's going. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

19 Aug 21 9.27pm

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

Flags & ideologies aside for a second.

Sociology & History shows that a society with an over-supply of men ( and an undersupply of women) is

always ALWAYS

...A violent society

Gun control is irrelevant. A nutter drove a lorry into 600 people on Boulevard des Anglais, Nice. Knives are easy to buy.

What really matters is having a minimal number of angry nutters in our society.

Accurate mate.

But that's not how it's going.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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